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Old 07-08-2005, 01:49 AM   #16
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David,

I don't know if you've met Larry Ruby in Santa Barbara or not.

Larry does motors out here, locally. *(Ruby Racing Motors)

He does a great job tuning the Stock motors, and I think he is using the "Revenge of the Monster" based tear downs.

He's out of Ventura and races EVERYTHING electric and does very well..just ask 2/3rds of the guys in Santa Barbara, Ventura, etc.

For a 19t motor, depending on if you are running the ARCOR Style, adjustable timed motors or the old Chameleon FIXED timing style. Ruby use to have a really well tuned 19 fixed timing motor, but for the adjustable timing style 19 spec motor, either KC Racing or KISBEY out of Bakersfield are really good.

Will you be running in SLO Sunday or are you going to the KART race in Santa Maria?
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Old 07-08-2005, 07:50 AM   #17
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Well I will chime in here.....

Tried many of the tuners out there.....Most are about average some a little above average...Only a couple were above. Here is a slight list of what I think are the best.
EA motorsports: Consistant (every motor feels that it is Eric's best) and very fast (IT'S IN THE CAN)...Customer Service is beyond great.
Banzia: Great service and motors are very nice...Some seem faster than others though..
Team Br00d: Eddie O tunes some sick fast motors as well. Had a couple go flat though..probably my fault regardless. His are fast as well.
Team Paradigm: Really fast motors but Customer Service has deteriated to nothing...in fact I heard they were shutting down but that could easily be a rumor.
Brahama: Only bought one...wasn't impressed but the motor had some power.
Redline: Nice tuner but took forever to get it.
SO I have tried a few...
Why I would put a link to him in my sig and promote his buisness,
1) Great service
2) Motors in my hand ASAP
3) Motors are the best consistantly
4) Answers all my annoying questions
5) Goes out of his way to help me...
6) He will retune my motors for cheap...heck he has a package of a couple motors coming to him today...Another tuners motor infact so he can work his skills on it..
If that isn't enough I don't know what it...
As for the others out there...I haven't found a need to go anywhere else.
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Old 07-08-2005, 08:00 AM   #18
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Nice summary Mr. Shookie

Also look for a best effiency on the Dyno readout as those are the one that will be the fastest on the track not the most rpm.

Though every motor tuner will probably argue this point. I have point motors will high rpm/watts number but poor effiency but were rubbish on the track. I have bought motors that were good/ okish rpm/watt numbers but high effiency number and are very good on the the track.
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Old 07-08-2005, 08:59 AM   #19
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I personally tune my own and have had great sucess with doing so. I have been able to blow by people on the straight with my self tuned motors as well. I had a comment once during practice, guy asked me what 19t motor I was running and I told him it was a Monster Stock. He could not believe it was that fast. I don't put much faith in dyno's for I had someone at our track dyno a couple of mine to only tell me he thought they were no good but on the track it said otherwise. Learn the technics the "Pro's" use and you won't pay extra for a Name tuned motor again.
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Old 07-08-2005, 09:25 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yeti35
I personally tune my own and have had great sucess with doing so. I have been able to blow by people on the straight with my self tuned motors as well. I had a comment once during practice, guy asked me what 19t motor I was running and I told him it was a Monster Stock. He could not believe it was that fast. I don't put much faith in dyno's for I had someone at our track dyno a couple of mine to only tell me he thought they were no good but on the track it said otherwise. Learn the technics the "Pro's" use and you won't pay extra for a Name tuned motor again.
Are you kidding me.....
I pay less than what it costs to buy a no name off the shelf motor than it costs me to buy one from EA....See I am learning all those nice little tricks as I go but if I wanted to get a motor for me to tune I get a great motor from EA to start that way I know that it is ready to begin with...I still true my own comms seat my own brushes and all that happy good stuff. But I can not afford a magnet saturation device to make sure my Mags are up to there best either, so what it costs me to buy a new motor run the junk out of it until it starts to go flat...Send it back in EA rezapps the Mags for me makes sure my comm is true and the armiture is balanced...bla bla bla...all for about $10.00 man some tracks charge $7.00 just to cut a comm. Your talking pennies plus I know what I get back is going to be way beyond what you are buying off the shelf..Sorry but that thery is fine and dandy but for those who would rather jusy buy a great motor I would stick with EA...Heck I have 10 or 12 right now...wait I sold a few as I am not using that kind of motor any more...but still I have 7 or 8...
-Shookie <><
Just my opinions but hey what are those worth now adays?
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Old 07-08-2005, 10:00 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Shookie
Are you kidding me.....
I pay less than what it costs to buy a no name off the shelf motor than it costs me to buy one from EA....See I am learning all those nice little tricks as I go but if I wanted to get a motor for me to tune I get a great motor from EA to start that way I know that it is ready to begin with...I still true my own comms seat my own brushes and all that happy good stuff. But I can not afford a magnet saturation device to make sure my Mags are up to there best either, so what it costs me to buy a new motor run the junk out of it until it starts to go flat...Send it back in EA rezapps the Mags for me makes sure my comm is true and the armiture is balanced...bla bla bla...all for about $10.00 man some tracks charge $7.00 just to cut a comm. Your talking pennies plus I know what I get back is going to be way beyond what you are buying off the shelf..Sorry but that thery is fine and dandy but for those who would rather jusy buy a great motor I would stick with EA...Heck I have 10 or 12 right now...wait I sold a few as I am not using that kind of motor any more...but still I have 7 or 8...
-Shookie <><
Just my opinions but hey what are those worth now adays?

It's all personal preference. It's like RTR vs. Kit....Some enjoy working with dynos and building their own motors, and some just like the buy their power from someone else.
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Old 07-08-2005, 10:16 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pro4Capece
It's all personal preference. It's like RTR vs. Kit....Some enjoy working with dynos and building their own motors, and some just like the buy their power from someone else.
Pretty much what I was getting at. I have bought "Pro Tuned" motors and have been disappointed with some of them. It is pretty much luck of the draw with any motor really. I have had some no matter what you do with it, they are just plain dogs. I just don't feel it is necessary to pay extra for a Pro Tuned motor. It is just my opinion and preference.
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Old 07-08-2005, 10:45 AM   #23
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Default dyno tuned

Jest because the motor looks good on the dyno does not mean it will run good on the track. A dyno is nothing more than a test tool, and its results are only as good as the test profile created by the tuner.

The key too generating dyno results that corilate to track performance is to test with a profile that closly matches on track conditions.

First you need to test with the voltage you motor will see on the track or atleast close to the avg. voltage seen. As the voltage supplied to the motor drops so does the RPM and in some cases the torq, the power curve changes and not all motors drop power equaly. To best guage the on track power you should test at the motor's supply voltage or use a constant volatge of about 7V to simulate 6cell or 5V to simulate 4, testing with a lower volatege than you will use will yeild dramiticly skewed results.

In addition to testing at the appropriate volate you will also need to compare power @ the current your motor will see on the track. A stock motor will generaly draw around 100A off the line with s 19T pulling around 120-130A. The max amp draw of the motor is of little importance, you should focus on the avg amp draw of 22-25A for stocks or about 28A for 19T, this is the middle of your powerband and changes here will have the greates effect on the track. Peak power is generaly achived around 32-38A (40-50A for 19T) but fades as the motor heats up. In short with a load type dyno testing with a fixed voltage of say 7V (5V for 12th scale) with amp steps of 20,22,25,28,30,33 for stock or 25,28,30,33,36,40 for 19T will provide results that compare to track performace. With an acelerometer ( flyweel type ) use either a fixed 7V (5V for 12th scale) or a voltage curve ( Robi or CS ) and focus on the power in the 18-35A (20-50A for 19T) range.

On the who is the best tuner subject, I would say that when it comes to customer motors anyone who zaps the magnets, and aligns the brush hoods is generaly going to be about the same performance and price. Remember that every legal stock and 19T motor is machine wound and balanced at the factory taking the biggest variable out of the tunners hands. Any tuner you buy from is going to have good, bad and mostly avg motors, the one you get is nothing more than luck of the draw.

Mark
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Old 07-08-2005, 01:28 PM   #24
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I rarely build anything that comes out of my shop.......if you get something done by me, consider yourself special....because it's a rarity.

99% of the stuff that comes out of the shop is built and tuned by Peter Robinson.....

Peter tunes all his own stuff (and a lot of others too) at the big races....

And while we can spout about who put the most cars in the A....who cares, lets talk about podium finishes. Peter has put up the results....and I usually only have a few drivers at the races......

Customer service we excel at, just ask the many customers who have gotten their motors replaced or rebuilt at no charge.

And if I was not gonna buy from myself, I would buy from Todd Putnam....EA does good stuff too.

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Old 07-08-2005, 04:26 PM   #25
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I got tired of the motor wars and went modified Want to go faster, drop a wind!
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Old 07-08-2005, 05:20 PM   #26
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didnt we already discuss this ?????? http://www.rctech.net/forum/showthread.php?t=66225
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Old 07-08-2005, 05:41 PM   #27
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Duh.... You guys sound like the 'D" Main Nitro Boys who want to go fast.... Spend more money for bolt on horsepower.... Can you handle it... I guess as long as Batteries, Motors et al, have a label on them that says "Gucci" you are doing all right.

What ever happened to the frustrating fun of doing and the sense of accomplishment of doing things yourselves!

There is nothing greater than blowing the doors off the competition with the stuff that you have prepared...
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Old 07-08-2005, 06:11 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hick
Duh.... You guys sound like the 'D" Main Nitro Boys who want to go fast.... Spend more money for bolt on horsepower.... Can you handle it... I guess as long as Batteries, Motors et al, have a label on them that says "Gucci" you are doing all right.

What ever happened to the frustrating fun of doing and the sense of accomplishment of doing things yourselves!

There is nothing greater than blowing the doors off the competition with the stuff that you have prepared...
I spend long enough trying setups, if i dont have to worry about building HP then it saves me time for testing.
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Old 07-08-2005, 07:11 PM   #29
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personally i have suspicions towards anyone with a personal stake towards whomever their favorite tuner is. not that they necessarily maybe dishonest, but that their experience might be tainted. with that said....

most tuners do relatively little to a stock before it is released (different brushes, true the comm, break it in a few minutes and slap a sticker on it). some tuners, albeit illegal under roar, will rebalance the comm (once) and do the aforementioned. others also will realign the hoods, although the jury still seems to be out in the debate of using a tool or checking brush-face wear, on which is a better method. zapping is almost a gimme at this time. although, if you're motor to it's maximum potential each time (and burning brushes), a magnetizer is a must to keep the motor performing optimally. there are dozens of other tricks to gaining a few rpm from shim types and centering the arm to polishing bushings and sanding the stacks.

the difference in performance by doing all of this is relatively small though. typically not even the few seconds spread you'll see from first-last in the A of a large race. having fresh/quality batteries (in comparison to what most common hobbyists use) will make more of a performance difference than doing what is listed above.

in the end, rather than asking a 'who is best' when it comes to tuners, i would like to see a consolidated thread that tells what each tuner does to their motor before it hits the shelf.

oh yeah, almost forgot. the dyno maximums in their own rights are pretty useless. but, if you graph out the accelleration/rpm/etc curves into a chart, you can get a fairly strong reference for how the motor will perform on the track.

and finally... regarding the a-main thing. just about anyone with money and connections can put together a big race/national a-main team. given a pick of 5 drivers at a race, even i could tune motors for them and get 1-2 in the 'A'.
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Old 07-09-2005, 12:24 AM   #30
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i just realized who started this thread....is this SR. or JR.? funny, i saw both of you tonight (GW) and didn't even realize it was your thread.
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