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Old 07-14-2013, 05:22 AM   #1
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Default Calculate boost timing to motor timing

Hello
i need same help, how to calculate boost timing to motor timing
thank´s
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Old 07-14-2013, 08:20 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by pauper View Post
Hello
i need same help, how to calculate boost timing to motor timing
thank´s
Are you asking how to get the total amount of timing between the two?

Add 'em up.

30 degrees of motor timing plus...45 in the ESC = 75 degrees.
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Old 07-14-2013, 10:16 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by JimmyMack12 View Post
Are you asking how to get the total amount of timing between the two?

Add 'em up.

30 degrees of motor timing plus...45 in the ESC = 75 degrees.
I wouldn't advise doing this for the reason that every brushless motor is different.

For example, the Trinity D3.5 motors has 30 degrees of timing at 0 degrees on the can.
Novak has 25 degrees of timing at 0 degrees on the can. And so on.

I always adjust my timing by amp draw and power (watt) number to
find the sweet spot (efficiency).

This is done using a watt meter between Esc and battery.
Its like dynoing motor and battery to get the most out of you car.
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Old 07-14-2013, 11:11 AM   #4
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I have a lrp x12 10.5t 4 dots = 27.5 and i use a hobbywing v3 boost and timing is 64 max what is the seting on esc.
Can Mr. Rctech give me an exemple off adjusting timing by amp and power watt
Tanks
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Old 07-14-2013, 11:29 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Mr RCTech View Post
I wouldn't advise doing this for the reason that every brushless motor is different.

For example, the Trinity D3.5 motors has 30 degrees of timing at 0 degrees on the can.
Novak has 25 degrees of timing at 0 degrees on the can. And so on.

I always adjust my timing by amp draw and power (watt) number to
find the sweet spot (efficiency).

This is done using a watt meter between Esc and battery.
Its like dynoing motor and battery to get the most out of you car.
Do you do that with no load on the motor? I remember doing that when I got into planes to determine static draw from different props which applies load.
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Old 07-14-2013, 04:05 PM   #6
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Do you do that with no load on the motor? I remember doing that when I got into planes to determine static draw from different props which applies load.
Yes, no load on the motor.
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Old 07-14-2013, 04:17 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by pauper View Post
I have a lrp x12 10.5t 4 dots = 27.5 and i use a hobbywing v3 boost and timing is 64 max what is the setting on esc.
Can Mr. Rctech give me an example off adjusting timing by amp and power watt
Tanks
This is what i found to work for me:

Trinity D3.5 13.5 motor - castle ESC boost set to 49 degrees and adjust the amp draw to 23-25 amps range.

Low starting rpm range.

If you get poor "punch" out of the corners, try increasing the Secound RPM number.
If you have plenty of punch out of the corners, you can try reducing the Secound RPM timing number for increase in top speed.

Longer timing ranges are better for low-turn motors, shorter ranges for high-turn motors.
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Old 07-14-2013, 07:52 PM   #8
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I seriously need to do some research. I have no clue what this all means.
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Old 07-15-2013, 01:30 AM   #9
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Yes, no load on the motor.
What watt meter do you use?

Thanks
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Old 07-15-2013, 11:21 AM   #10
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Thanks Mr. RCTech. Just gotta find my meter.

NW, the watt meter (Watt's Up) measures amp draw of the motor. You put it between the battery and the speed control. When you apply throttle you'll see the amperage that's flowing from the battery. Was great for airplanes to see if you're using too big of a prop though at static load. Planes move so less load when flying.
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Old 07-15-2013, 02:11 PM   #11
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For boosted class, I suggest to go with torque based motors. They are a lot better to get them running fast and relatively warm. As for timing, you have to first check what's the internal timing that comes with the motor. You wont be using much "endbell timing" due to the fact that the ESC will do it for you. The general rule is not to exceed past 60 degrees of total timing since the ESC will not perform above that (it will be useless). Having said this, you will want to focus the total timing on Boost since you spend the most time accelerating from turn to turn. Note: The Boost is also applied during the straights (as many people think otherwise) Now, the trick is to know how and when to engage the boost timing in order to maintain a great deal of acceleration while maintaining the motor running efficiently (cool) and avoid wheel spin. For example if your motor has 21 degrees of internal timing (SP MMM) you have 43 degrees of timing left to play. In our track we race 10.5T Boosted Class on an asphalt track that measures aprox. 150' x 90'. Usually, we race 46 degrees of boost timing (21 degrees internal on motor and 25 degrees additional timing on the ESC) with a boost timing acceleration (ACC) of 400-450 (the lower the number, the the more punchier the motor gets and also less efficient or hot). Since we have a long straightaway we program some turbo timing to get the car rolling at until 3/4 of the straight. We program 12 degrees of Turbo with a slope of 12 degrees per 0.1sec (Turbo slope refers to the turbo timing increase rate. The higher the number the faster turbo increases along with quicker acceleration and higher motor temperature). As you can see, we have used 58 degrees of total timing (motor internal timming, ESC boost and turbo timing)..

There is no universal setup for boosting since there are many variables you need to consider for example track size, track configuration, motor class, motor power delivery (more torque delivery or more peak power-RPM) etc. As an overall rule, always gear your car for a higher FDR since with boosting, you are basically doubling your motor power and RPM range (and making it less efficient) and try using batteries with a high C rating since the ESC will be drawing a lot of juice from the lipo at a very fast rate.

In setting the car, please start with the boost parameters. Race around your track and start making adjustments. Add boost and race the car for a couple of laps. Then, measure your motor temperature and continue on adding until your car is running faster. After that, adjust the boost timing ACC to better suite your acceleration needs for your specific track. ALWAYS check your motor temp. As a rule of thumb, the temp should not exceed 180.00 (yeap, in boosting class these temps are not uncommon, I race mine at 190..I want to win!!!)

Once you've got the Boosting down, then you can continue on setting the turbo. Remember, the turbo thing is better suit for a track with a long straightaways or a lot of flowing high speed turns. You can always set it up in shorter tracks once you have more experience working with it.

Good luck and happy racing!
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Old 07-15-2013, 02:20 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan Wilson View Post
What watt meter do you use?

Thanks
This is the meter I use:

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s..._Analyzer.html
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Old 07-15-2013, 02:57 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by pauper View Post
I have a lrp x12 10.5t 4 dots = 27.5 and i use a hobbywing v3 boost and timing is 64 max what is the seting on esc.
Can Mr. Rctech give me an exemple off adjusting timing by amp and power watt
Tanks
The Hobbywing does not have 64 deg of timing available. It has 64 "steps" of timing available. The total timing is closer to 38deg.


Shawn.
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Old 07-15-2013, 08:23 PM   #14
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[QUOTE=Shawn68 The Hobbywing does not have 64 deg of timing available. It has 64 "steps" of timing available. The total timing is closer to 38deg.


Shawn.

So if i have 27.5 end bell and apply 64 steps coser to 38 deg i am 5 deg over the max of the motor = heat.
Advice FDR for 10.5 boost very long track 90 m straigth
tanks.
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Old 07-15-2013, 10:19 PM   #15
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[QUOTE=pauper;12351889][QUOTE=Shawn68 The Hobbywing does not have 64 deg of timing available. It has 64 "steps" of timing available. The total timing is closer to 38deg.


Shawn.

So if i have 27.5 end bell and apply 64 steps coser to 38 deg i am 5 deg over the max of the motor = heat.
Advice FDR for 10.5 boost very long track 90 m straigth
tanks.[/QUOTE]


Yes. I recommend running as much timing from the speedo as possible, and then back your timing off on the end bell. I run a lot of 1S 17.5 Boosted, and run 50 Boost, 14 Turbo, and -10 degs on the end bell. (Running Novak). 38deg from the ESC, 20deg on the Motor (Novak Zero=30 Deg)

Check for the Hobbywing Setup thread. Has tons of setups on it.


Shawn.
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