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Old 04-30-2013, 08:42 AM   #106
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^ Just a reminder... But your local tracks/area is not necessarily representative of the whole country.
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Old 04-30-2013, 09:46 AM   #107
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Hi Rick
You are correct but this will give EFRA 3 WC's in a row which is a bit over the top good for people who live in Europe
But if they give it to FEMCA they would get it for only 2 WC's in a row
and this will still keep the rotation the same.
But 2018 with FAMA could still cause a big headache again.
I am only passing on what I was told. I know that Australia is part of FEMCA but it seems a shame to lump it into the Asian bloc. I'd be all for Australia in 2014 then back on schedule with FEMCA for 2016 (Yatabe please!).

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This whole situation, in fact this whole thread, is a perfect example of why ROAR has membership and support trouble. You mean to to tell that a facility like Tamiya USA's in CA or the huge track they run UF1 on in Texas couldnt support a world-class race? Cant just rent a convention center and roll out carpet like the Snowbirds? The bond should have been posted by ROAR. Have they no confidence in what the racing that they "sanction"? Obviously not.

I've been racing for several years. Other than coming up with rules that no one follows, and the decals you see on LiPo batteries, what the hell do they do? The RC racing hobby grows and strives to survive at the grassroots level. The clubs, their members, and tracks supported by hobby stores are what gives us a place to race. Not some mystical sanctioning body that exists on paper. ROAR contributes little (except controversy and dissapointment) to the hobby. Please.

I love the use of the word "bloc" in reference to ROAR. Sort of like a communist bloc.

The two hottest classes in on-road RC at the moment are Mini and F1. Both, in most situations, reflect TCS rules do a degree. I hate it, but 1/10 Touring Car in North America is dying and ROAR isn't doing a thing about it. At my local tracks, TC represtents the smallest portion of the cars that show up. Mini, VTA, and F1 usually outnumber them 4 to 1. In some areas like around Chicago USGT is exploding with awesome racing and huge turnouts.

Why cant ROAR get a clue?

Jeff
You are over simplifying what it takes to run a Worlds. If you have not been to a Worlds you don't realize that it is much more than a Snowbirds or IIC. Those are nothing compared to an IFMAR Worlds. The Tamiya track is not available for races like this. And you can't just "roll out" carpet somewhere. It takes time, money, people, and the willingness to accept a fairly large financial risk.

Your tracks may not follow ROAR rules. But they create a level playing field and whether to realize it or not you are following ROAR rules. The cars you and other race are created so that they conform to a set of rules. F1, with no such rules, results in various chassis dimensions, tire types, and suspension configuration.

The last two on-road races I participated in (ROAR Carpet Nats, Mile High Indoor Champs) were organized and/or hosted by ROAR clubs that exist because of the benefits they receive as a ROAR affiliated track.

ROAR is not perfect, but I commend them for looking at this situation and passing on an event that would ultimately be a disaster.
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Old 04-30-2013, 10:07 AM   #108
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What this does bring to light though, is something that should explored by ROAR and its reps. Should ROAR put up the bond and actively look for facilities to hold this type of events? ROAR would stand to benefit by looking for the facility to host the event rather than just put up a post on their website saying that they are "taking applications". ROAR should look for the facility, rent the facility and organize the event altogether. The RMT gets payed to run events and the IFMAR races should be no different. They should post the bond. Afterwards, pay the track a $500.00-1000.00/day rental fee and call it a day. ROAR could make a nice profit from this as well.

Today's RC World is much different than what it was 10+ years ago. The internet changed the game. Even racing the Off-Road Worlds takes a company like AMain Hobbies to organize an IFMAR event. It also certainly helps that Kendall Bennett is a racer. Brick and Mortar Pro-Shops are no longer the reality of our hobby. Most tracks, especially on-road tracks are club tracks with no shop and members chipping in to cover the overhead of the track. The possibility and the budget of these clubs does not allow for an IFMAR bond. These tracks also have no shops to benefit from the sales coming through from a big race.

To me, these are some simple changes that ROAR could make to benefit our community as a whole. Promoting RC is ROAR's job, and honestly they have become a little bit lackluster in this area. I know it is a volunteer run organization, but if the volunteers in the committee are not willing to do the leg work, then why volunteer?
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Old 04-30-2013, 12:31 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
I am only passing on what I was told. I know that Australia is part of FEMCA but it seems a shame to lump it into the Asian bloc. I'd be all for Australia in 2014 then back on schedule with FEMCA for 2016 (Yatabe please!).



You are over simplifying what it takes to run a Worlds. If you have not been to a Worlds you don't realize that it is much more than a Snowbirds or IIC. Those are nothing compared to an IFMAR Worlds. The Tamiya track is not available for races like this. And you can't just "roll out" carpet somewhere. It takes time, money, people, and the willingness to accept a fairly large financial risk.

Your tracks may not follow ROAR rules. But they create a level playing field and whether to realize it or not you are following ROAR rules. The cars you and other race are created so that they conform to a set of rules. F1, with no such rules, results in various chassis dimensions, tire types, and suspension configuration.

The last two on-road races I participated in (ROAR Carpet Nats, Mile High Indoor Champs) were organized and/or hosted by ROAR clubs that exist because of the benefits they receive as a ROAR affiliated track.

ROAR is not perfect, but I commend them for looking at this situation and passing on an event that would ultimately be a disaster.
I agree that I have oversimplified what it takes to put on a huge event. No doubt it takes a huge effort by many people, not only in the physical setup of a track & support facilities, but also regarding promotion, liability, etc etc etc. However, shouldn't that be part of the responsibility of ROAR as a "sanctioning body", and also as the North American bloc of IFMAR?

To me, they had a golden opportunity to legitimatize their existance as the top eschelon of RC racing in North America. Instead, they kicked that puppy down the road. The event could have happened here. It would have taken alot of legwork but sponsors & manufacturers could have (possibly) supported part of the tab if they were asked. If a Worlds event is SO big, wouldn't it have been in best interest of all involved to make this work, given this rare opportunity?

In regards to F1 and ROAR, maybe they should have been a little more proactive in setting up a set of rules that could work for the majority of clubs out there. Hindsight is 20/20 - I just feel bad for the members paying dues to an organization that does........what do they do??????

Jeff
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Old 04-30-2013, 02:31 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by fox88gt View Post
I agree that I have oversimplified what it takes to put on a huge event. No doubt it takes a huge effort by many people, not only in the physical setup of a track & support facilities, but also regarding promotion, liability, etc etc etc. However, shouldn't that be part of the responsibility of ROAR as a "sanctioning body", and also as the North American bloc of IFMAR?

To me, they had a golden opportunity to legitimatize their existance as the top eschelon of RC racing in North America. Instead, they kicked that puppy down the road. The event could have happened here. It would have taken alot of legwork but sponsors & manufacturers could have (possibly) supported part of the tab if they were asked. If a Worlds event is SO big, wouldn't it have been in best interest of all involved to make this work, given this rare opportunity?

In regards to F1 and ROAR, maybe they should have been a little more proactive in setting up a set of rules that could work for the majority of clubs out there. Hindsight is 20/20 - I just feel bad for the members paying dues to an organization that does........what do they do??????

Jeff
There are "new" ROAR F1 rules, but the rule book needs to be updated/published. The real issue is that Tamiya and the UF1 series in California have done most of the work to popularize F1. UF1 started as a single race 3-4 years ago, and the series did a ton for F1 when guys saw it on the internet. Tamiya came out with a "modern" car that the rules were based around. ROAR has had rules for the F103/90's style cars for years, but there was no interest until first the F103 came back and then the F104 was released. To be honest, F1 has been spotty nationally until very recently. This year seems to be a big time expansion in the class. That being said, ROAR is a national body, and every time something new pops up there won't be a rule set 10 minutes later. How long was Slash racing big before the short course rules were established? It took several years before trans am was recognized by ROAR as well.

I don't know exactly how it is done in EFRA and FEMCA, but I don't think the organization puts up the money for the race, I think it's the track/club. How many clubs have $10K to put up? How many for profit tracks are that healthy, and have either the manpower or money to get it? As it was pointed out, A Main, the giant online retailer is having the offroad worlds at their track. That is great, but is that kind of success what it takes to bank roll the race? That would be hard for 99% of the other track operators out there. Not to mention, the road race requires 2 sites....
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Old 04-30-2013, 04:38 PM   #111
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I know that Australia is part of FEMCA but it seems a shame to lump it into the Asian bloc. I'd be all for Australia in 2014 then back on schedule with FEMCA for 2016 (Yatabe please!).
I think we would be in the same situation as ROAR, all our clubs are all volunteer funded, i think all of them would struggle to find a financial backer.

We have 2 great tracks here in Sydney that could hold it for 10th, 1 has already held a IC worlds, and the other one a Femca round. but we dont have a 12th scale venue unless you move it to tarmac,

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Old 04-30-2013, 05:01 PM   #112
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Not to mention, the road race requires 2 sites....
Which is complete crap in all honesty. How many times were the 12th scale worlds held on gigantic asphalt tracks to accommodate the sedans? It's ridiculous what IFMAR expects as far as dimensions for a WC track.

IMHO, either Scotty or Boylan could very easily put on a KILLER worlds, in a convention center, if given the proper backing. As the national sanctioning body, I feel that ROAR could do a little more as far as securing events like this. Working with their "affiliate manufacturers" to line up the ludicrous amount of money IFMAR requires, (is Bernie Eccelstone involved with IFMAR?), and the RMT running most of the show, could really go along way.

In all honesty, IFMAR should have their own RMT that handles tech, and race direction at the Worlds. It is, after all, their show. That is one example ROAR is setting currently. The RMT has been a MAJOR improvement at ROAR events, and IFMAR could learn something to that end.
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Old 04-30-2013, 05:24 PM   #113
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Just had a thought. Why not have two TC worlds, one every year? One year, you have an asphalt worlds held in conjunction with the nitro TC worlds. The next year have a carpet worlds held in conjunction with 1/12th. Then you don't have to worry about two separate venues.
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Old 04-30-2013, 06:21 PM   #114
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Just had a thought. Why not have two TC worlds, one every year? One year, you have an asphalt worlds held in conjunction with the nitro TC worlds. The next year have a carpet worlds held in conjunction with 1/12th. Then you don't have to worry about two separate venues.
That's a pretty good idea actually...
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Old 04-30-2013, 06:51 PM   #115
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Just had a thought. Why not have two TC worlds, one every year? One year, you have an asphalt worlds held in conjunction with the nitro TC worlds. The next year have a carpet worlds held in conjunction with 1/12th. Then you don't have to worry about two separate venues.
That is a great idea!

ISTC Worlds could be a two part event... or there could be 2 separate titles(Asphalt and Carpet), just like the ROAR Nationals, etc.
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Old 04-30-2013, 07:11 PM   #116
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When will the worlds come around to ROAR again?

-Mike
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Old 04-30-2013, 07:41 PM   #117
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I was going to attend the asphalt nationals happening this weekend so I could qualify for the the worlds. Waiting paitiently for 10 years and my last worlds and ROAR cancels them. I am done with roar and everyone else should be as well. I can tell you this would not have happened if Mike Reedy was still here. Now roar is run by a bunch of clowns who get 10 votes because nobody cares. Too bad because the US has a lot of great racers who would have had home court advantage.
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Old 04-30-2013, 08:57 PM   #118
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I was going to attend the asphalt nationals happening this weekend so I could qualify for the the worlds. Waiting paitiently for 10 years and my last worlds and ROAR cancels them. I am done with roar and everyone else should be as well. I can tell you this would not have happened if Mike Reedy was still here. Now roar is run by a bunch of clowns who get 10 votes because nobody cares. Too bad because the US has a lot of great racers who would have had home court advantage.
This brings up a very good point. There is pretty much zero participation by US drivers in the classes offered at a Worlds. Some research would have to done but when was the last time there were more than 25 drivers racing modified at a major US race? The last three worlds had fewer than five US drivers - with only 2 in '08 and 3 in'10.

Without local participation a worlds is doomed to fail. Realistically, how many US drivers will spend $400 to enter a race when they won't even race that class at any of the other events? Very few.
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Old 04-30-2013, 09:00 PM   #119
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When will the worlds come around to ROAR again?

-Mike
2022
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Old 04-30-2013, 09:03 PM   #120
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