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Old 03-22-2005, 05:44 AM   #1
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Default Roar recommendations

Let's put all our positive and negative post in here
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Old 03-22-2005, 05:56 AM   #2
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ROAR is in serious need of help. It's like me on a saturday night, tore up from the floor up.
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Old 03-22-2005, 06:29 AM   #3
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Default I'll toss mine in

Can we stop the"I'm just a volunteer nonsense"?What ever happened to pride in a job well done?Paid or volunteered?Those that volunteer for something should be well aware of the tasks and RESPONSIBILITIES of what they are volunteering for.Bottom line.This whole"it wasn't me"excuse is just childish and nonsense.When I take on a task or job,I do the best I can,because it's my name and reputation on the line.When I represent a company or organization,It's my job to do the best I can.For both the company or organization,but most of all for myself.When did we become a group of whiners and pointer's?My .02,Mario.
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Old 03-22-2005, 07:34 AM   #4
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Default Re: I'll toss mine in

Quote:
Originally posted by lotus1
Can we stop the"I'm just a volunteer nonsense"?What ever happened to pride in a job well done?Paid or volunteered?Those that volunteer for something should be well aware of the tasks and RESPONSIBILITIES of what they are volunteering for.Bottom line.This whole"it wasn't me"excuse is just childish and nonsense.When I take on a task or job,I do the best I can,because it's my name and reputation on the line.When I represent a company or organization,It's my job to do the best I can.For both the company or organization,but most of all for myself.When did we become a group of whiners and pointer's?My .02,Mario.

I agree with you about the "I'm just a volunteer" nonsense. When was the last time you talked to someone from a Volunteer fire department, and IF they weren't able to save a house from burning down, did they shrug their shoulders and say I'm just a volunteer? NO, they work just as hard as the paid Fireman in big cities. Actually, they WORK HARDER due to the fact that most of their revenue for new equipment and such comes from field days and other such fund raisers that they put on to fund the house. All this is done by people who don't receive a dime and work other full time jobs on top of all that.

Point is, if you're unable or unwilling to do the job correctly, don't volunteer to do it. And if you are going to do it, do it with the same effort and passion you would if it meant putting food on your table. In the long run, you're only making yourself and the organization you represent look like an A55.


On the other hand, if this topic was started due to the Nats this past weekend, I do not agree. The ROAR officials that were there did what they could considering they had to battle a very un-obliging host. A couple of the things being debated over the weekend (like the re-sort for example), were really things that did not need to be debated. ROAR explained to the race management how it was supposed to be done, and how it has always been done, but the host didn't agree and wanted to do it differently even though they had no previous national experience at all (hosting or attending).

I think ROAR really did what they could this past weekend considering the circumstances and what they had to work with. The only mistake they made was granting this race (the highest level of ROAR events) to a track with very little experience or knowledge of ROAR events and procedures.


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Old 03-22-2005, 08:09 AM   #5
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Default Nice reply

and true.I think maybe a disclosure of sorts on what the roar guys tried to do/couldn't do might go a long way in helping them.It is too easy to bash.Information is what educates people.Not a he said/she said type of thing or a finger pointer deal either.Lay out the facts and let everyone decide by educating them.It seems to me this race was doomed from the start based on the official threads from their inception.Maybe something should be put into a contract with the host track.This could solve a great many issues right up front.Mario.
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Old 03-22-2005, 08:20 AM   #6
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ROAR needs to find the right people to partner with.

Everyone raves about what Scotty Ernst, Mike Boylan, and Jimmy Babcock do, to name a few. In the past these individuals may have been promoting ROAR races but for some reason avoid affiliation. Maybe it is ego, monetary, who knows.

But I am sure racers would attend events run by these people regardless of if they were ROAR are not. If the Snowbirds didn't change anything, but was now ROAR sanctioned, it would still be the same great race.

I think ROAR needs to actively pursue these type of promotors to run their races rather than wait for people to come to them.
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Old 03-22-2005, 08:22 AM   #7
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Default What ROAR needs!!

ROAR needs a few full time paid individuals that work 40 hours a week on nothing but ROAR. These two or three people work on hosting ROAR Races at great tracks or finding venues such as car shows, RCX show, ect to host ROAR Nationals. They also go to the races and bring ROAR's personal tech equipment, ROAR's personal computer that has all the entrants of the race entered into the race so heats are posted immediately so racers can see what race they are in. Then the ROAR people need to run the race and official the race. If the race is hosted by a track/hobby shop then the owner just sits back and watches the race. This would add some consistency to ROAR races. A lot of tracks that have hosted ROAR Nationals never have hosted a race with 250 entries before. This can be extremely overwhelming for the race director if he has never done this.

Honestly ROAR Races anymore feel like big club races around the country. Unfortunately we all go to these big club races because it has the word "National Title" on the line. Races like Snowbirds, US Indoor Champs, Cactus Classic, Hot Rod Shootout, and Reedy Race feel more like big races since they have more entries and are hard to get into since everyone wants to go. When is the last time we filled a ROAR Offroad Mod National? It has been a while....if I am correct I think it was in Lake in the Hills, IL in 1998.
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Old 03-22-2005, 08:36 AM   #8
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will said T hodge but who is going to step up to the plate? Ive been racing for years and i only used the roar member on a race day only (super region 4-5) ect.
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Old 03-22-2005, 08:44 AM   #9
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Todd I think you are right on with waht you said. I think Scarecrow has been trying to get Roar to due just what You have said. Kenny said that he would travel and due the events but Roar snubbed him the last time they were approached. I dont know why. If like you said they had a full time crew that did nothing but attend to these matters, offciateand direct the races we would definately have much better consistency with the nationals program. I think the members should try to get this to happen. It really only takes one good general and a few good troops to pull it off. Look at the Minnreg crew. They got three of the best field marshals running the show. They have strong race management and solid club leadership. That in turn leads to a club that actively participates and works(labor). That in itself is a huge feat.

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Old 03-22-2005, 08:54 AM   #10
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WKA-aka World Karting Association has traveling crew that goes to all the National Points races. I am sure the track attends to timing and scoring, but the WKA crew is there and always accesible and runs post race tech. They are in uniform so it makes it even easier to find them. They are at every race from Mid-Ohio to Daytona.


Also-because they are there-Results and Points are quickly updated to the WKA website.

Also-many meetings are held over the race weekends as the whole road racing commitee is together.

Maybe use them as a model.
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Old 03-22-2005, 09:49 AM   #11
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Default Re: What ROAR needs!!

Quote:
Originally posted by T. Hodge
ROAR needs a few full time paid individuals that work 40 hours a week on nothing but ROAR. These two or three people work on hosting ROAR Races at great tracks or finding venues such as car shows, RCX show, ect to host ROAR Nationals. They also go to the races and bring ROAR's personal tech equipment, ROAR's personal computer that has all the entrants of the race entered into the race so heats are posted immediately so racers can see what race they are in. Then the ROAR people need to run the race and official the race. If the race is hosted by a track/hobby shop then the owner just sits back and watches the race. This would add some consistency to ROAR races. A lot of tracks that have hosted ROAR Nationals never have hosted a race with 250 entries before. This can be extremely overwhelming for the race director if he has never done this.

Honestly ROAR Races anymore feel like big club races around the country. Unfortunately we all go to these big club races because it has the word "National Title" on the line. Races like Snowbirds, US Indoor Champs, Cactus Classic, Hot Rod Shootout, and Reedy Race feel more like big races since they have more entries and are hard to get into since everyone wants to go.
I don't disagree with the paid position thing - I think it's a good idea.

Unfortunately, ROAR doesn't bring in enough funds to create 2 or 3 salaried positions that could pay enough. . . I don't have this issue's RevUP, which has an interim budget, but I do know that there isn't $60K in there for a full time employee.

(($60K = $50K plus benefits. If you want a full time person who is going to do a good job, you're going to have to pay him/her a decent salary. . .and $50K is probably low.))

btw - you should post more on the on-road rules board, Todd.
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Old 03-22-2005, 09:51 AM   #12
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I wonder how much budget that ROAR could work out.

the By-Laws DO give room for something along these lines. . .

Hmmmmmm.
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Old 03-22-2005, 10:34 AM   #13
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How about a person or persons who are paid JUST for National events. Fee plus expenses. This is optional but highly recommended.

Take for example again the Gate. The Gate recruited and paid tech personel for the Halloween Classics and ROAR Nationals. They had a webmaster, registrar, announcers and race director all lined up beforehand. Locals also chipped in to manage trash, bathrooms, etc. All pre-arranged. But HC it seems did not arrange for a large enough staff. So ROAr has a list of personnel that can be hired to do those jobs for them. Maybe not the website or regitration mind you-but Tech, Race director could be handled. Call them "proffesionals".

And anyone doing a National Caliber event must provide proof pre-event that certain positions have been covered or they must pay to have these "proffesionals" to help run the event.

What does everyone think?.

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Old 03-22-2005, 01:50 PM   #14
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I posted this in the Nationals thread. I'll step up and do it. Somebody get the ball rolling.
quote:
Originally posted by Bob Schoenau
Kenny....know what you mean....i did your job after the questionable embezzlement....did it as a "favor" to try to get ROAR back on track....case is did the best i could....couldn't get anyone to help out....lots of complaining, couldn't please everyone so did what i thought was fair.....and try to get someone to host a regional.....HA HA....everyone wants a place to race but no-one wants to do any work to put on the races....give credit to Mr. Bill and the folks at the champs....wow 25 years of putting up with the whining etc.....want to help....VOLUNTEER!!! and quit crying.....


Bob, I have nothing but respect for you, but to compare a ROAR race to the Champs is completely laughable. Mr. Bill and the Champs staff don't hear as much whining in 5 years of Champs, as ROAR reps hear for one event. Hell, most Roar races I've been to, the ROAR reps themselves do as much whining as the racers.

The Champs is the longest running and most successful race on Earth because of one thing. PREPARATION. Bill Aholt has already been working on the '05 Indoor Champs, and it's still 8 months away. I've attended, helped organize, put on big races, and I'm now a proud member of the Indoor Champs staff. In my experience, big races are far better run WITHOUT ROAR INVOLVEMENT.

The situation is this, at a Roar National there are too many chiefs, and not enough Indians in the Race Crew. Either let the Host Track run the Race, or let ROAR run the race. ROAR can't afford timing and scoring equipment, and to send staff to the races? Please, this is the new Millenium guys. Drop the stupid Rev-UP which noone seems to get. I started getting mine regularly TWO WEEKS AFTER I NEEDED TO SUBMIT MY BALLOT. Go on-line with it and free up those funds.

I'll also tell ya right now, I'd have no problem laying down $50 a year for my membership if I knew I could count on a good show when I go to a NATIONAL EVENT. So, if you raise the fee to $50, multiply that by 6000 members, you get an additional $90000! I think that would more than cover a fulltime staff of two people (a race director and an Official Referree) and their travel expenses.
ROAR provides the tech equipment, The track provides a few volunteers for tech. Aside from that all the host has to worry about is facility prep.

I don't wanna hear about track staff feeling stepped on if ROAR stepped in. I've done big races, and I'd have gladly accepted the help.

The Sport has outgrown the current ROAR structure and mentality. The races are bigger, the business is bigger. It's time the organization grew to match.
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Old 03-22-2005, 03:23 PM   #15
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I might be stupid in saying this, because I havent been around quite as long as others, but who needs ROAR? They put on regional and national races but so do alot of other people. the roar races arent promoted or advertised for that matter, Everyone knows the winners of snobirds and Cleveland and Scottys race (commonly refered to as Novak Race) but the winners of the roar nats never get anything.
All I am saying is if there was a big race called a nationals at a nice track I am sure it would get the entry limit.
but if you have a ROAR nats at a shit hole you'll still get the entry limit but then you'll have 20 different threads on how stupid roar is and roar defending themselves by saying how stupid the track is.
I think manufacturures ( I think I spelled that right) should hold the big races not some organization that charges people an annual fee just to get them have a shitty weekend at the sake of saying they won the nats
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