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Old 10-10-2012, 12:36 AM   #46
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Again too many followers trying to copy fast racers!!! Find your own way !!! MikeXray, I was too seconds off the pace running a brushed 27t motor vs 17.5t in a car that was setup to traction roll , until I switched to brushless, learned about roll centers etc..., and now I am 0.8seconds off the pace on my third time practicing the right way... By the end of this season, I should be as fast as the top racers if I stick to my plan.... I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE EACH OF YOU GUYS A NIKKO TOY CAR TO BUILD AND RACE WITH NO MANUAL AND CHEAT SETUP SHEET, JUST TO SEE IF YOU HAVE A CLUE ABOUT HOW SETUP ADJUSTMENTS AFFECT YOUR CAR !!!! I AM SURE NONE OF THE FOLLOWERS WOULD PARTICIPATE !!! SOMETIMES A WELL BUILT KIT WILL SLOW YOUR LEARNING PROCESS BY PUTTING YOU ON PACE WITH OTHERS, WHILE YOU DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND THE MOST BASIC SETUP CHANGE.... IT'S LIKE GETTING A FIVE YEAR OLD TO DRIVE FAST AROUND THE TRACK, UNTIL CONDITIONS CHANGE, AND SOMEONE'S CRYING ABOUT BEING OFF THE PACE...............KNOWLEDGE IS POWER PEOPLE !!!!!
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Old 10-10-2012, 02:04 AM   #47
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I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE EACH OF YOU GUYS A NIKKO TOY CAR TO BUILD AND RACE WITH NO MANUAL AND CHEAT SETUP SHEET, JUST TO SEE IF YOU HAVE A CLUE ABOUT HOW SETUP ADJUSTMENTS AFFECT YOUR CAR !!!! I AM SURE NONE OF THE FOLLOWERS WOULD PARTICIPATE !!! SOMETIMES A WELL BUILT KIT WILL SLOW YOUR LEARNING PROCESS BY PUTTING YOU ON PACE WITH OTHERS, WHILE YOU DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND THE MOST BASIC SETUP CHANGE.... IT'S LIKE GETTING A FIVE YEAR OLD TO DRIVE FAST AROUND THE TRACK, UNTIL CONDITIONS CHANGE, AND SOMEONE'S CRYING ABOUT BEING OFF THE PACE...............KNOWLEDGE IS POWER PEOPLE !!!!!
It doesn't often happen but I am off to work this morning with a smile on my face


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Old 10-10-2012, 02:33 AM   #48
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Well, it is 10.5t in 1/10 on road class. The fastest guy on the track is 16.xx second per laps and i have 2 second gap. I have driven this car for a few month. I think i know some intermediate car setup and i own my setup system. Actually i drive with a relatively used tire that about 4-5 battery.
There are fast guys and then there are "fast guys" if the fastest guy at your track is one of the later then there is no shame in being 2 secs off his pace, he will be doing 18 laps, you 16 laps, 2 laps down on Moore, Harper, Jefferies is a pretty good place to be.

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Old 10-10-2012, 03:22 AM   #49
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Well, it is 10.5t in 1/10 on road class. The fastest guy on the track is 16.xx second per laps and i have 2 second gap. I have driven this car for a few month. I think i know some intermediate car setup and i own my setup system. Actually i drive with a relatively used tire that about 4-5 battery.
Is a few months your total experience, or just with this most recent car?

If it is your total experience, them you'll have to trust me when I say you are very, very early on your RC learning curve.

I've been in RC for 20 years, I've seen a lot of people come and go, and the number of people that I have seen become competitive within 6 months of regular racing can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Most people I know take a year of regular (weekly) racing to become competitive, and another year to become fast.

Some people get frustrated by this, some people make their learning curve steeper by falling into the trap of thinking that changing setup and parts after every run is the the key to unlocking faster times - when the true key is taking the car that you have, building it well to kit settings, making sure the steering and throttle are set up, and DRIVING it.

Unlike a computer game, RC is hard to master. The experience takes a long time to acquire - and that is because RC is REAL, constantly changing, and you need to have run a lot of laps at a lot of different tracks before you get to grips with what makes you fast.

I race with a couple of juniors who started from scratch a couple of years ago. Both of them took a year to even get the car around the track for five minutes, yet both of them have had that moment where the driving "clicks" into place in the last season, and suddenly, they are quick and consistent over 5 minutes. They have taken the 2 second a lap margin I used to have over them last winter, and turned it into nothing, just from practice and experience.

So keep practicing, get more track time under your belt, race at different tracks and in different classes if you can (I made a big improvement as a teenager when I ran 2wd buggy for a while instead of 4wd), and watch the time drop off without doing anything to your car.
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Old 10-10-2012, 03:37 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by sosidge View Post
Is a few months your total experience, or just with this most recent car?

If it is your total experience, them you'll have to trust me when I say you are very, very early on your RC learning curve.

I've been in RC for 20 years, I've seen a lot of people come and go, and the number of people that I have seen become competitive within 6 months of regular racing can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Most people I know take a year of regular (weekly) racing to become competitive, and another year to become fast.

Some people get frustrated by this, some people make their learning curve steeper by falling into the trap of thinking that changing setup and parts after every run is the the key to unlocking faster times - when the true key is taking the car that you have, building it well to kit settings, making sure the steering and throttle are set up, and DRIVING it.

Unlike a computer game, RC is hard to master. The experience takes a long time to acquire - and that is because RC is REAL, constantly changing, and you need to have run a lot of laps at a lot of different tracks before you get to grips with what makes you fast.

I race with a couple of juniors who started from scratch a couple of years ago. Both of them took a year to even get the car around the track for five minutes, yet both of them have had that moment where the driving "clicks" into place in the last season, and suddenly, they are quick and consistent over 5 minutes. They have taken the 2 second a lap margin I used to have over them last winter, and turned it into nothing, just from practice and experience.

So keep practicing, get more track time under your belt, race at different tracks and in different classes if you can (I made a big improvement as a teenager when I ran 2wd buggy for a while instead of 4wd), and watch the time drop off without doing anything to your car.
Very good point. Get a basic setup that works, leave it alone and then drive the car and PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE!

Its the same in anything in life, practice makes you better. Do you think a Premier League footballer was instantly brilliant? No, they have natural ability which is harnessed by practice.

As one of the posters has said - you still do need natural ability - you may never close that 2 second gap.
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Old 10-10-2012, 05:16 AM   #51
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When you have 2 second slower per lap than the other, what priorities would you do to keep up with the other?
A. Driving skill
B. Tyre
C. Esc setting
D. chassis setting
Given 16 seconds vs 18 seconds, I would prioritize all of the above. And add motor, batteries, body to it.
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:02 AM   #52
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That's the equivalent of a scientist ignoring all of the research that came before him and "finding his own way!!!"

I think i'll start with the fast guy's setup or the base setup from the manual and go from there. I also hear that advice from good drivers works and that several setup books were in print long before setup software was developed. But that's all crazy talk...

And did you really just use "Nikko" and "Race" in the same sentence???

PS- fix your CAPS lock.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bertrandsv87 View Post
Again too many followers trying to copy fast racers!!! Find your own way !!! MikeXray, I was too seconds off the pace running a brushed 27t motor vs 17.5t in a car that was setup to traction roll , until I switched to brushless, learned about roll centers etc..., and now I am 0.8seconds off the pace on my third time practicing the right way... By the end of this season, I should be as fast as the top racers if I stick to my plan.... I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE EACH OF YOU GUYS A NIKKO TOY CAR TO BUILD AND RACE WITH NO MANUAL AND CHEAT SETUP SHEET, JUST TO SEE IF YOU HAVE A CLUE ABOUT HOW SETUP ADJUSTMENTS AFFECT YOUR CAR !!!! I AM SURE NONE OF THE FOLLOWERS WOULD PARTICIPATE !!! SOMETIMES A WELL BUILT KIT WILL SLOW YOUR LEARNING PROCESS BY PUTTING YOU ON PACE WITH OTHERS, WHILE YOU DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND THE MOST BASIC SETUP CHANGE.... IT'S LIKE GETTING A FIVE YEAR OLD TO DRIVE FAST AROUND THE TRACK, UNTIL CONDITIONS CHANGE, AND SOMEONE'S CRYING ABOUT BEING OFF THE PACE...............KNOWLEDGE IS POWER PEOPLE !!!!!
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:05 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by bertrandsv87 View Post
Again too many followers trying to copy fast racers!!! Find your own way !!! MikeXray, I was too seconds off the pace running a brushed 27t motor vs 17.5t in a car that was setup to traction roll , until I switched to brushless, learned about roll centers etc..., and now I am 0.8seconds off the pace on my third time practicing the right way... By the end of this season, I should be as fast as the top racers if I stick to my plan.... I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE EACH OF YOU GUYS A NIKKO TOY CAR TO BUILD AND RACE WITH NO MANUAL AND CHEAT SETUP SHEET, JUST TO SEE IF YOU HAVE A CLUE ABOUT HOW SETUP ADJUSTMENTS AFFECT YOUR CAR !!!! I AM SURE NONE OF THE FOLLOWERS WOULD PARTICIPATE !!! SOMETIMES A WELL BUILT KIT WILL SLOW YOUR LEARNING PROCESS BY PUTTING YOU ON PACE WITH OTHERS, WHILE YOU DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND THE MOST BASIC SETUP CHANGE.... IT'S LIKE GETTING A FIVE YEAR OLD TO DRIVE FAST AROUND THE TRACK, UNTIL CONDITIONS CHANGE, AND SOMEONE'S CRYING ABOUT BEING OFF THE PACE...............KNOWLEDGE IS POWER PEOPLE !!!!!

Why would anyone on here take advice from someone who doesn't know how the CAPS LOCK key works?

If you want to progress at racing then you need to make sure the basics are all in place; you need a car that's in reasonable condition and built correctly, with a setup thats easy to drive. You need the correct tyres and they need to be in decent condition (this is really important, as the wrong tyres can cost you several seconds per lap). The ESC/motor/battery don't really matter too much; having too much power as a beginner will make you slower over a lap, so don't waste too much time or money on these to begin with. A decent car with decent tyres is a much better investment.

Then the key is practice, practice, practice, and practice some more. Race as often as you can, test whenever you've got a day off or a spare Saturday. On race day if there's open practice, make use of it and get as many practice runs in as you can.

Watch the pros to see how they drive. Listen to their throttle/brake inputs, and watch their lines.

And remember to enjoy it. We all reach our personal limit sooner or later, and for most of us this leaves us some way behind Volker and Moore. There are guys at the track who have been doing this for 30 years and are still seconds per lap off the pace. But they enjoy it and don't seem to care too much!
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Last edited by daleburr; 10-10-2012 at 06:38 AM.
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Old 10-10-2012, 07:08 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by bertrandsv87 View Post
Again too many followers trying to copy fast racers!!! Find your own way !!! MikeXray, I was too seconds off the pace running a brushed 27t motor vs 17.5t in a car that was setup to traction roll , until I switched to brushless, learned about roll centers etc..., and now I am 0.8seconds off the pace on my third time practicing the right way... By the end of this season, I should be as fast as the top racers if I stick to my plan.... I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE EACH OF YOU GUYS A NIKKO TOY CAR TO BUILD AND RACE WITH NO MANUAL AND CHEAT SETUP SHEET, JUST TO SEE IF YOU HAVE A CLUE ABOUT HOW SETUP ADJUSTMENTS AFFECT YOUR CAR !!!! I AM SURE NONE OF THE FOLLOWERS WOULD PARTICIPATE !!! SOMETIMES A WELL BUILT KIT WILL SLOW YOUR LEARNING PROCESS BY PUTTING YOU ON PACE WITH OTHERS, WHILE YOU DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND THE MOST BASIC SETUP CHANGE.... IT'S LIKE GETTING A FIVE YEAR OLD TO DRIVE FAST AROUND THE TRACK, UNTIL CONDITIONS CHANGE, AND SOMEONE'S CRYING ABOUT BEING OFF THE PACE...............KNOWLEDGE IS POWER PEOPLE !!!!!
http://www.rctech.net/forum/11285168-post173.html

12.4 fast lap, Haynes runs 10.3, 2.1 seconds there buddy. Even if you "break" into he 11's, that's still going 2 laps down from the non pro fast guys. You need to be running 10s every lap to consider making the show.
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:11 AM   #55
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Mike Haynes never did a 10.3sec lap with a 17.5t buddy.... Diatta's best when I saw him run Lou's Xray t3 was 11.0 and he is one of the fast guys there. I managed a 12.4sec lap in a tc4 rtr after only three days of practice with my new 17.5t... Haynes himself told me that 10.9second consistantly is what expert drivers should be looking at.... 10.7sec down is for 13.5t only buddy...... Since I have a rtr, 11.6sec might be the best I can get out of that car, but I will be on pace with most of the true sportsman racers there, not with Haynes or Mark Rheinard... I am not racing for a living, so the pro level was not considered here, only the club level pace ..... I 'll be passing you soon Mike....ahah....lol......
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:15 AM   #56
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Also Haynes did a 10.5sec lap with a mod car ! No way a 17.5t is beating that !!!
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:53 AM   #57
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Mike Haynes never did a 10.3sec lap with a 17.5t buddy.... Diatta's best when I saw him run Lou's Xray t3 was 11.0 and he is one of the fast guys there. I managed a 12.4sec lap in a tc4 rtr after only three days of practice with my new 17.5t... Haynes himself told me that 10.9second consistantly is what expert drivers should be looking at.... 10.7sec down is for 13.5t only buddy...... Since I have a rtr, 11.6sec might be the best I can get out of that car, but I will be on pace with most of the true sportsman racers there, not with Haynes or Mark Rheinard... I am not racing for a living, so the pro level was not considered here, only the club level pace ..... I 'll be passing you soon Mike....ahah....lol......
1.5 secs on a 10.9 second lap is actually further away than the original poster who is 2 secs down on a 16 second lap.

If you were on a bigger track that the fast guys are doing 16 sec laps on, you would be 2.2 secs down.

Trying to give advice to guys on here who are obviously a) more experienced and b) quicker/faster/better is not the best thing to do buddy!
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Old 10-10-2012, 02:39 PM   #58
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This thread is turning interesting... where's the popcorn??
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Old 10-10-2012, 04:50 PM   #59
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Again, practice is where it's at. Build the car to the manual settings, equip with the spec electrics, fit the common tyre and race, and race and race.

Whilst practicing learn about set-up. The most important thing is that other set-ups might not work for you. By all means look at them and learn from others but copying a drivers set-up can be a hindrance as subtlies in driving technique will become amplified.

At our club myself and the other fast drivers have different set-ups but we are all usually within a tenth of each other. We just have settings that suit our driving styles.

But, as mentioned, these adjustments only matter once you can get a car around the track avoiding kissing the walls.
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Old 10-10-2012, 07:02 PM   #60
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Also Haynes did a 10.5sec lap with a mod car ! No way a 17.5t is beating that !!!
10.1's have been done in mod TC. I've seen a 6 in 17.5.

I'll give you a good deal on my 2nd T3, it hotlapped .3th slower than haynes at IIC
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