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Old 06-24-2013, 08:33 AM   #121
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You're a brave guy loaning out touring cars. There are a whole lot of things to break on those! But there's no beating 4WD on a parking lot track. ANY action for an old race car is better than sitting in a closet or on a shelf. Ain't it great that you can still have fun, and help promote the hobby, using "recycled" stuff?
Well, brave, dumb, or cheap. They were what I have laying around. I always like seeing what I can accomplish with $0!
They are outfitted with GTX speedos, P2k motors, and 2000mAh stick packs!
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Old 06-24-2013, 09:42 AM   #122
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It is especially tricky if your car is over geared, you have no throttle end point adjustment, and no way of knowing your lap times!
Throttle endpoint adjust can be added to nearly any radio. If you know a bit about electronics, you can add a potentiometer somewhere convenient on the transmitter, and wire it to the trigger potentiometer. Unfortunately, the details of this vary from radio to radio; there's no single solution.

Alternatively, you can add a small screw into the pistol grip, under the trigger, to serve as a stop for travel. Adjust the length of screw protruding from the pistol grip to change the throttle endpoint.

If the announcer or computer does not announce lap times, you'll need to check after the race to see how much adjustment you need.

By the way, one of our local racers has modified the Flipside scoring program so that the computer will automatically call out "Breakout", the driver's name, and the offending lap time. It's really slick!
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Old 06-24-2013, 01:37 PM   #123
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At the track I frequent, we strictly run VTA/25.5 or 21.5 open manufacture blinky ESC(most guys are sticking to USVTA rules) VTA body and tires of course using break out. This has refreshed a COMPLETELY dead touring car class. We also run an open class for those not wanting VTA. The breakout class is by far now the biggest class with over 25 regular shows between Friday nights and Saturdays every week. They also run 7s nascar and 8s nastruck on a banked tri-oval. I've seen guys run 20+ laps within hundreths of a second of each other. great racing but oval just not for me no matter how fast it is.

The VTA class raised enough money so the shop would expand the track. That is in the planning stages as I type. Breakout is not as easy as it looks.
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Old 06-24-2013, 04:50 PM   #124
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At the track I frequent, we strictly run VTA/25.5 or 21.5 open manufacture blinky ESC(most guys are sticking to USVTA rules) VTA body and tires of course using break out. This has refreshed a COMPLETELY dead touring car class. We also run an open class for those not wanting VTA. The breakout class is by far now the biggest class with over 25 regular shows between Friday nights and Saturdays every week. They also run 7s nascar and 8s nastruck on a banked tri-oval. I've seen guys run 20+ laps within hundreths of a second of each other. great racing but oval just not for me no matter how fast it is.

The VTA class raised enough money so the shop would expand the track. That is in the planning stages as I type. Breakout is not as easy as it looks.
Wow, Dave, that's fantastic! It sounds like you have a bunch of guys that know how to have fun-- without spending a ton of money!

You're right, winning at Breakout is not easy at all. It's like playing Blackjack with a three-deck shoe.
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Old 07-07-2013, 06:00 PM   #125
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We raced at Hobbytown Centennial today and I got to run my mini in the breakout class again. What a blast!

I found another challenge to breakout!

I had set my throttle endpoint to 90% and I was running laps that were 18s (right at the breakout point) in practice. Then we started racing and all of a sudden I tightened up my line and started breaking out! I had to pull over and turn down the endpoint to 85%. That'll teach me to practice like I race.
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Old 07-08-2013, 02:59 AM   #126
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We raced at Hobbytown Centennial today and I got to run my mini in the breakout class again. What a blast!

I found another challenge to breakout!

I had set my throttle endpoint to 90% and I was running laps that were 18s (right at the breakout point) in practice. Then we started racing and all of a sudden I tightened up my line and started breaking out! I had to pull over and turn down the endpoint to 85%. That'll teach me to practice like I race.
There's always extra impetus to go faster when you're racing!

Watching other cars while you are marshalling can also lead to breaking out: I once marshalled a particularly challenging corner, and observed one of our local fast guys taking a much different line than I had been using. I gave it a try when the Breakout heat ran, and immediately gained about 0.1 second per lap... which was a bit too fast!

The track can also get faster as the day progresses, but this varies with the surface. Let us know if you notice this on the asphalt.
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Old 07-21-2013, 09:27 AM   #127
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i've got an old rc10ds on the way that i plan on trying to run in the carpet oval breakout class up at fastlane.
i've always loved the dual sport and the breakout class seems perfect for guys who like close racing and vintage cars.
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Old 07-21-2013, 06:50 PM   #128
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We had a great day of racing on the parking lot of the Hobbytown here in Denver today. We ran the novice as a breakout race and it is proving to be a great way to introduce drivers to racing without getting in the way of the fast guys running 17.5 touring. We had 5 entries in the breakout and 5 in the TC class. Of course, there were two who raced in both classes.
I am running into a problem with breakout in the parking lot. We had to constantly adjust the breakout time today so the new guys dont breakout. How can we find a good starting point if the track changes every weekend?
We settled on a time of 15 seconds. For comparison, the fast TC guy was running consistent 12.3s, and got at least one 12.0. Howard, you mentioned early in this thread that you start with a reasonable VTA time and tweak from there. What are the lap time comparisons between VTA and TC on your tracks? My thinking is to set the breakout at 125% of the TC times to start.
What are your thoughts?
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Old 07-21-2013, 09:07 PM   #129
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When we run a breakout class, we pay attention to the lap times in practice for the new guys, and adjust accordingly. Sometimes we have to correct the breakout time between each round as the new guys get a little faster.
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:10 AM   #130
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Originally Posted by lil_man72 View Post
i've got an old rc10ds on the way that i plan on trying to run in the carpet oval breakout class up at fastlane.
i've always loved the dual sport and the breakout class seems perfect for guys who like close racing and vintage cars.
Breakout class is perfect for vintage DRIVERS, too!

We would love to have you race with us! Fastlane oval runs on Thursday nights and one Sunday a month.

If you'd like to try onroad racing, just let me know and I'll reserve one of my loaner cars for you to use. The only item you need to bring is YOU! Arrive, enter, and drive! Onroad runs on Sundays.

Check the Fastlane schedule, as it can vary due to special events.
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:14 AM   #131
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We had a great day of racing on the parking lot of the Hobbytown here in Denver today. We ran the novice as a breakout race and it is proving to be a great way to introduce drivers to racing without getting in the way of the fast guys running 17.5 touring. We had 5 entries in the breakout and 5 in the TC class. Of course, there were two who raced in both classes.
I am running into a problem with breakout in the parking lot. We had to constantly adjust the breakout time today so the new guys dont breakout. How can we find a good starting point if the track changes every weekend?
We settled on a time of 15 seconds. For comparison, the fast TC guy was running consistent 12.3s, and got at least one 12.0. Howard, you mentioned early in this thread that you start with a reasonable VTA time and tweak from there. What are the lap time comparisons between VTA and TC on your tracks? My thinking is to set the breakout at 125% of the TC times to start.
What are your thoughts?
It's good to hear of your success. One person really can make the difference between having an ever-expanding group of racers, or none at all.

Our breakout time is very close to 125% of the fastest TC guys. It also works out to (almost exactly) what a fast Mini can do. We will occasionally change to a slower time for one day if we have a total beginner. Although the track layout might change, if the track width and length is fixed, then using the same breakout time for every layout gives some continuity so that racers can make their adjustments in practice rather than the qualifying heats or races.

On the other hand, if the class is only used as a temporary measure to get a new racer up to speed, then I think CarbonJoe's answer might be better.

Marc, there might be a few more considerations in your case. First, do all of the racers understand the breakout concept, and how it will help all of the participants? Do they want to do it, or would they rather go as fast as possible? Do all of the racers have the necessary equipment (throttle endpoint adjustment, different gear ratios, different batteries, etc.) to stay above the breakout time?
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:16 AM   #132
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When we run a breakout class, we pay attention to the lap times in practice for the new guys, and adjust accordingly. Sometimes we have to correct the breakout time between each round as the new guys get a little faster.
CarbonJoe, do you run Breakout as a permanent class, or do you use it as a temporary measure to bring a new racer up to speed?
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Old 07-23-2013, 10:56 AM   #133
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In r/c airplane pylon racing, they have 3 classes of races. they have the GOLD class, the Silver class, and the Bronze class. they all use breakout times. if you go too fast on a lap, you lose that lap
racing has never been closer. the better you get at setting up your flying, the higher up you race.
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:00 AM   #134
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In r/c airplane pylon racing, they have 3 classes of races. they have the GOLD class, the Silver class, and the Bronze class. they all use breakout times. if you go too fast on a lap, you lose that lap
racing has never been closer. the better you get at setting up your flying, the higher up you race.
That's an excellent data point! I never knew that pylon racers used Breakout!
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:50 AM   #135
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That's an excellent data point! I never knew that pylon racers used Breakout!
they used to do it the old fashioned way... 5 racers to a heat, 5 guys on the ground with stop watches, they don't have the luxury of the automated lap times that we have on the ground. the beauty of this class of racing is,,,its all about the flyer. they used the same motors and airplanes in each class. some motor tuners were better than others, but, with breakout racing, it didn't matter

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