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Old 03-17-2005, 10:58 AM   #196
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Quote:
Originally posted by EddieO
Well, when Charlie from Novak tells him they are running the new unreleased system....that pretty much gives it away, not to mention when I can hear fernando in the background saying he is running it and its fast....

Do you want me to get a picture?? It's certainly not a 5800 or 4300....


Later EddieO
I saw the brushless system already at the track. the motor looks the same as the one I bought from my local hobbyshop but I can't see a sticker on it which shows model. The ESC looks familiar too (big orange case with heatsink) but it has a big fan on it so I'm not sure.
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:02 AM   #197
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Originally posted by GordonFreeman
Then I suggest you complain to the tech guy, have him take those cheater motors away!

Who is breaking the rules here? ROAR? Novak? The track is allowing cheater motors?

Is this practice or actual qualifying?
ROAR establishes the rules. If they rule the motors can be used, then they are legal and nobody is breaking the rules.

ROAR is the bad guy, breaking their own rules for the benefit of certain manufacturers with no explanation. It is unethical, and probably illegal.
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:06 AM   #198
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Originally posted by Rick Hohwart
It is unethical, and probably illegal.
I could see a court case out of this depending on the results of this weekends race. ROAR better realize this.
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:09 AM   #199
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There must be a clause somewhere that says ROAR can do whatever it wants at any time, right?
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:21 AM   #200
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I can see it now ...

Under,

Roar Expenses....


Lawyer fee`s..........
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:24 AM   #201
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Well from watching the hobby/racing scene for the last 10 years it is certain that ROAR has lost its luster as the top sanctioning body of rc racing in the US. Just in the past year there have been some major issues with several of the biggest events (Paved Nats, Worlds, Carpet Nats) that involved ROAR. Now I am not going to get on here and bash individuals...but I am posting to make a perdiction. If people take notice of the growth and popularity of sanctioning bodies such as RC Pro Series...it is not to hard to invision that ROAR may be on its last leg. The major events in the US are for the most part non roar races. Roar is not the top dog and its events are losing luster in the RC racing world. Roar needs to help itself soon or it will lose its place in our racing.....my predictions.

ps.... I am a ROAR member and did vote...so those replies I do not want to see....lol

Jeff
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:26 AM   #202
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rick Hohwart
ROAR is the bad guy, breaking their own rules for the benefit of certain manufacturers with no explanation. It is unethical, and probably illegal.
LOL...illegal...

I'm not totally sure, but I'm almost positive that neither the penal code in CT nor the Federal Code cover motor verification rules at R/C car races.

You could try to sue civilly for breach of contract, but I bet there's a "Spirit of Competition" clause in the rulebook that allows them to do whatever they feel is necessary to put on the race.
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:29 AM   #203
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jeff Werner
Well from watching the hobby/racing scene for the last 10 years it is certain that ROAR has lost its luster as the top sanctioning body of rc racing in the US. Just in the past year there have been some major issues with several of the biggest events (Paved Nats, Worlds, Carpet Nats) that involved ROAR. Now I am not going to get on here and bash individuals...but I am posting to make a perdiction. If people take notice of the growth and popularity of sanctioning bodies such as RC Pro Series...it is not to hard to invision that ROAR may be on its last leg. The major events in the US are for the most part non roar races. Roar is not the top dog and its events are losing luster in the RC racing world. Roar needs to help itself soon or it will lose its place in our racing.....my predictions.

ps.... I am a ROAR member and did vote...so those replies I do not want to see....lol

Jeff
Well said. The only thing keeping ROAR alive is the have the monopoly on qualifying drivers for the Worlds. As soon as that is gone, so is ROAR.
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:31 AM   #204
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Sheesh... appears as if the sky is falling again.

Its not a good situation. Fine. Its a bad situation.

Lets not trivialize things. I've read comments about the national economy, job outsourcing, how ROAR's decision needs to consider these things, now I'm reading about possible lawsuits over ethics.

I understand this MIGHT have an effect on certain businesses in the hobby. But to take this speculation to the extremes that we've seen here is absurd.

The unfair things that need to be remedied are the motor approval issue and the level playing fields within the rules for brushless as compared to brushed. In other words, if Brushless motors are exempted from the approval process for this race then prototype brushed motors should be allowed as well so long as they conform to the rules currently in place. Which brings us to the next issue. If Brushless motors are allowed to use certain components previously deemed unacceptable for brushed then the brushed motor rules should be quickly updated to equalize this playing field.

The fact of the matter is though, the sky isn't falling.
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Old 03-17-2005, 11:32 AM   #205
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A for profit or non-profit corp that has bylaws with membership, can be cited and/or fined by the us government for not following their own bylaws.....


I know there was a union, who made loans they thought were legal under their rules, but turned out to be against their bylaws....the government cited and fined them....

It's happened before and will happen again.....the main problem is the government doesn't go looking for cases like this....and they kinda pick and choose the ones they do.....


What's worse, is a lot of the rule book is seriously flawed....

And before anyone goes and says, I don't know what I am talking about.....I do this stuff for a living.....I am not a lawyer, but have three seperate firms at my disposal. I write a majority of the laws, rules, and ordinances for my work....none of which have ever lost in court....


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Old 03-17-2005, 12:57 PM   #206
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The rules that govern the behavior of a corporation as a business (accounting rules, etc.) are a separate issue from the rulebook that would govern the hobby (essentially a product of the company).

One is a securites/stock/property/fiduciary-type issue , the other ("You didn't follow the rules") would strictly be a civil issue between the customer and the company.
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Old 03-17-2005, 01:14 PM   #207
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I talked with some guys at the track and no one is making a bif deal about the super secret brushless systems. Also heard that there are no ROAR reps there yet and no one knows who's suppose to be there anyways.
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Old 03-17-2005, 03:44 PM   #208
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Where's Mattloc ?
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Old 03-17-2005, 04:00 PM   #209
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"i find it interesting how many people that are involved/members of roar are distancing themselves from roar as some sort of alien-third party entity. roar leadership and regional directors are elected by popular vote. excomm (i believe) is selected by this group. the decisions being made today are, by association, those of the majority of the active roar members.

don't agree with these decisions you can do one of three things: nothing, whine/complain (on the internet), get involved and try to make some changes.

the most constructive thing we could do at this point would be to open our perspective beyond this event and decide what is a fair and equitable solution for all parties (organizations, manufacturers, retailers, consumers) going forward"


When you have a choice between 2 guys, such as pres., it may not be much of a choice. Gabe was not much of an alternative to Rick Wilson. If you did not like Rick, you are out of luck. Not to mention regions that had one guy running for office.

ps yes I know volunteer......
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Old 03-17-2005, 07:31 PM   #210
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They might as well run a brushless everywhere.be alot cheaper
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