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Old 07-11-2012, 10:20 AM   #1
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Default Speed Control Benchmark

I was curious if anyone had some full information as there seem to be a lot of new speed controls popping up. I was interested to see if anyone had something in a real world example where they switched from brand "A" to brand "B" and actually improved lap times without changing any settings on the car. I am not looking for this one "felt" anything. Feel is personal and I am looking for mechanical and actual power differences. Obviously anything with readings would be greatly appriciated.
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Old 07-11-2012, 01:52 PM   #2
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Default Benchmark

Are you refering to a Spec class eg Blinky? I have personally ran a "Brushlesshobbies" ESC and the Tekin RS in the Blinky 17.5 class and have also been competitive with just about ANY other Speedos. I have NOT noticed too much change. I do know that one is lighter i.e. (tekin).

You have to include "FEEL" even though you want to quantify you results. The tekin in my experience regardless of software acts like a on/off switch eveng though with the 212 software much better. This plays a big role when going around the track. Software IMO changes the feel. The Brushlesshobbies is smoother power is much more linear. Me haveing a itchy throttle finger - this goes a lonh way.
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Old 07-11-2012, 02:06 PM   #3
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All competing speedos from your top manufacturers are going to give you the same basic amount of power at full throttle. Feel, ease of use, dependability, and support is where some speedos shine above others.

For example, the final output power between a Tekin RS and my LRP SXXv2 is probably about identical. But I am measurably faster with the LRP because the controller puts power down in a way that is far smoother, and far more predictable. So to me, the better "feel" of the LRP directly results in better lap times because the car is easier to drive... this makes a MUCH bigger difference on the track, than any tiny percentage of power difference that may or may not even exist.
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Old 07-11-2012, 02:22 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
... Feel, ease of use, dependability... is where some speedos shine above others.

...I am measurably faster with the LRP because the controller puts power down in a way that is far smoother, and far more predictable. So to me, the better "feel" of the LRP directly results in better lap times because the car is easier to drive... this makes a MUCH bigger difference on the track, than any tiny percentage of power difference that may or may not even exist.

I am really glad you brought this up. A friend of mine and i were literally JUST talking about this subject on the phone.

"Feel" of a speedo.

Please correct me if i am wrong about this. IMPO, there is no reason you can't make any speedo from a multitude of manufacturers perform in exactly the same way so long as they have the same adjustable parameters and you are using a transmitter that is less than 20 years old.

What I mean is, as long as you have adjustable:

deadband, minimum drive, drive frequency, exponential and end-point, you can fine tune a car's throttle response in literally thousands (if not more) of variations.

Someone please clarify this for me because I have to tell you, I can take an old Novak Cyclone and adjust it to such varying degrees that if I blindfolded you, took the transmitter away from you, changed the profile in the speedo and changed the body on the car, you would swear up and down from here to hell and back I had made you drive 2 completely different cars.

I am REALLY looking forward to responses.
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Old 07-11-2012, 02:34 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NolanP View Post
I was curious if anyone had some full information as there seem to be a lot of new speed controls popping up. I was interested to see if anyone had something in a real world example where they switched from brand "A" to brand "B" and actually improved lap times without changing any settings on the car. I am not looking for this one "felt" anything. Feel is personal and I am looking for mechanical and actual power differences. Obviously anything with readings would be greatly appriciated.
The only way I think a true benchmark can work is under lab dyno environment. Consider the Novak Sentry Dyno System: http://chassisdyno.arrowbeach.com/chassis_dyno.pdf

Quote from the document: "3. Dynos the speed controller (ever wonder if you have a bad speed controller or wrong radio setting)".
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Old 07-11-2012, 02:34 PM   #6
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@Catfish12c. That is very true. Since 222/223 came out, I can make a Tekin feel anyway I want it too. I do wish they would add drive frequency adjustments to further improve adjustability but even without it, I can make it do what I want.

I do agree with the LRP freaks about one thing, default settings on the Tekin are rubbish.
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Old 07-11-2012, 03:50 PM   #7
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@Catfish12c. That is very true. Since 222/223 came out, I can make a Tekin feel anyway I want it too. I do wish they would add drive frequency adjustments to further improve adjustability but even without it, I can make it do what I want.

I do agree with the LRP freaks about one thing, default settings on the Tekin are rubbish.
How do yo adjust a blinky tekin to feel as silky smooth as a blinky SXX v2?
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Old 07-11-2012, 03:56 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Catfish12c View Post
I am really glad you brought this up. A friend of mine and i were literally JUST talking about this subject on the phone.

"Feel" of a speedo.

Please correct me if i am wrong about this. IMPO, there is no reason you can't make any speedo from a multitude of manufacturers perform in exactly the same way so long as they have the same adjustable parameters and you are using a transmitter that is less than 20 years old.
Id have to disagree. I have extensive experience with both the Tekin RS, and the LRP SXXv2.

Me and my wife race together, and we both run identical kits, identical setups, identical bodies, and identical electronics (radio gear, servo, batteries, and motor), everything except for the speedo. We have a Tekin RS in her car and the SXX v2 in mine. I have been tuning Tekins for a number of years now and believe I can tune them with as well as the best of them. But no matter how I set the speedo... no matter what I try, I don't get the same type of output I get with my SXXv2 in blinky mode. And with the LRP, no tweaking or setup required really... it's right out of the box, just bind and drive.

I could tweak that little RS all day long, and it will never provide the same driving experience as the LRP.
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:17 PM   #9
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Motor, speedo, batteries.

All three together need to be fast.

Battery IR (internal resistance) is the most important thing.

I don't run Blinky I run modified.
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:21 PM   #10
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A 100% deal is the only thing that makes a Tekin feel like an LRP.
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:37 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
How do yo adjust a blinky tekin to feel as silky smooth as a blinky SXX v2?
One of the tuning is to make deadband low. I use Tekin RS for F1 and for RWD the speedo has to have a smooth power delivery. The Tekin was very difficult to drive by factory setting because of the huge deadband. It's like pulling the trigger and nothing till half-way, then all the power came out abruptly. There are also other adjustments but the biggest impact to me is to change the deadband to a very low value.
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:45 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
Id have to disagree. I have extensive experience with both the Tekin RS, and the LRP SXXv2.

...I have been tuning Tekins for a number of years now and believe I can tune them with as well as the best of them. But no matter how I set the speedo... no matter what I try, I don't get the same type of output I get with my SXXv2 in blinky mode. And with the LRP, no tweaking or setup required really... it's right out of the box, just bind and drive.

I could tweak that little RS all day long, and it will never provide the same driving experience as the LRP.
My first question would be: Are you certain the Tekin and SXXv2 have the same adjustment parameters? Even though both speedos may have adjustable functions does not mean they have comparable settings. For example, the old Novak Cyclones had Drive frequencies of in the 5Kh, 7Kh, 11Kh, 15Kh, and 23Kh range. But other speedos did not. Therefore, even though they may have had adjustable drive freqs, they still were not going to feel like the Novak.

And to ask you another question about the comparison of yours and your wife's setups, do your radios have adjustable throttle exponential? That can do a lot for smoothness of your throttle as well.
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:48 PM   #13
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If anyone has what they call a "punchy" throttle feel or an "On/Off Swith" feel, the first thing I always recommended was:

1: Deadband to 5%.
2: Minimum Drive to 5%
3: Throttle Exponential to -25%
4: Drive Frequency (If adjustable) as high as they could get it.

And then adjust up or down as you saw fit after you tested it on track.
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Old 07-11-2012, 05:26 PM   #14
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Or you could just buy a good ESC.
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Old 07-11-2012, 06:09 PM   #15
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you understand that you can change the slope in which the power kicks in on the tekin right? I don't have that problem at all with it not being smooth.

That is also not the question I really don't care about feel personally

I mean does a lower resistance really take in to account when driving through the motor or a higher resistance? If someone wants to sit and tell me that even just .01 in a race doesn't add up they have never been in a close race. I will take .2 off my entire race anyday. But now you cut off .05 after twenty laps thats a second. That has been enough for 1-4 qualifier spots pending which race I have been at. So my question goes back to has anyone efficiently benchmarked the esc's like you can via cell phones...ie showing that the iphone in 3g mode is "benchmarked" as the fastest.

I will take a harsh anything if I can get a faster lap time.
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