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Old 07-14-2002, 11:10 PM   #16
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Well if the major events held by ifmar, norcca, jmrca etc. mandate the use of rubber on electric TCs, IMHO when practicing, it would be better to run rubber. Primarily so that the car setup would be less of an issue, and the fact that the car will handle totally different, rubber VS foam. No need to to adapt.

However, if for the generally-hobbyist-weekend-racer type who is not into suspension setup and just want to have good clean fun and not wanting to be the next world champ, I see no reason not to run foams. They grip like hell, especially when the track is overun by nitro tourers, and makes setup nearly a moot point. Just this Sunday my local track held a crazy race, any rubber or foams, brushed, brushless,basically we we told to run 4 door body shells, 6 cells max that's all. Suprisingly the TQ was a MR4TC with a 11x2 on rubber, doing a whole lap faster than the rest.

So the point of my discussion is not whether foam or rubber is better, but rather when to use which tire type for different objectives ;-)
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Old 07-14-2002, 11:14 PM   #17
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BTW, I'm curious (in my entire life I have only ran a full set of foams, so far only *once* on my electric tourer. I didn't like the feel. I love to cut into corners very early ;-)) when the foam's diameter gets thinner and thinner won't this adversely affect the car's handling? Camber, droop, Rideheight all change, and if rideheight changes, camber-at-rideheight changes, the roll axis and CG will probably change; how do you guys compensate? Not to mention the need to change the gear ratio to match the new rollout, or do only pan cars do it not tourers?

Thanks.

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Old 07-14-2002, 11:51 PM   #18
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Alvin,
As a foam tyre gets thinner, the side walls tend to flex less and make the car react faster. On high bite, smooth surface, grip will also improve slightly. But on rough/course or dirty surface the thinner tyre will have less grip as it will feel harder. And yes you need to gear up as well.

Hey I felt that rubber gripped much better than foam that race day at RC speedway. I think the track is just not clean enough for foam. And most of the top drivers are they on foam or rubber?

Last edited by Jimmyd; 07-14-2002 at 11:54 PM.
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Old 07-15-2002, 12:34 AM   #19
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Yo Jimmyd. If by Top Drivers you mean the A mainers, only got 4 of them running rubber. kasey, me, tangfa and wakum. The rest are foams. Seems like virtually everyone else apart from a very small minority runs foams.

I'm less concerned about the sidewall flex as compared to the effect of rideheight change.
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Old 07-15-2002, 10:45 AM   #20
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You do have to adjust it race to race, but I've found that it doesn't change dramatically within the race, and running Greens, they can grind down fairly dramatically. . .esp in the fronts.
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Old 07-15-2002, 11:38 PM   #21
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When I run foams, I naturally check ride height before each run. Then adjust it accordingly. Same with gearing. I do notice though that once you go to a certain point with tire wear on foams, you'll start to loose traction (at this track.) But that's when you run them down almost to the wheels. Plus its very important to watch your tire wear and rotate them. Adjust camber too if your tries start to "cone." Lately I've started to run rubbers again. But I'll go back to foams if I feel the competition is getting too tight. Been wearing down my foams too fast lately in Mod class.
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Old 07-15-2002, 11:55 PM   #22
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The best tyre by far for carpet racing is the Schumacher mini pins and rally block tyres for touring cars! Foam tyres are hopeless on carpet.

My car has almost unlimited traction and on a tight track you only really let off for a split second on the corner if you have to let off at all to get around. When we first started running the spike tyres there was about 3 laps difference between rubber and foam in a 5 minute race!
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Old 07-16-2002, 09:31 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by ixlr8nz
The best tyre by far for carpet racing is the Schumacher mini pins and rally block tyres for touring cars! Foam tyres are hopeless on carpet.


Dude - depending on what compound you run (obviously) foam tires are ridiculously hooked up on carpet, especially on carpet. What kind of carpet are you running? SHAG?

With greens we were having traction roll problems with pro10 cars. . . if you've never run one, you pretty much JUST DON'T traction roll a pro10. . .

You bring your off-road tires (illegal, btw, in sanctioned racing) and I'll bring my foams (legal in pro10, 1/12th and mod sedan - ROAR) and we'll see the results. . .
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Old 07-16-2002, 12:09 PM   #24
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ixlr8nz- i too used to run schumacher minipins (yellow and blue) on carpet and they did have a decent amount of traction, trouble was i could only get about 10 runs out of them before they were down to slicks. Because of this foams that were previously banned at the track are now allowed. I now have stupid amounts of traction using jaco green or blue and TQ orange additive. Also i can get 30 runs on a set of foams, which have consistant grip levels for every run untill they are too small to run. What compound foams were you using? and were you using additive? without additive they are pretty much uesless.
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Old 07-16-2002, 02:49 PM   #25
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Boomer

You'll improve your laptimes on carpet if you use lower rubber content tires. Greens are that "exotic rubber" or whatever, high rubber content tires. Try using grey or white instead of green or pink.
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Old 07-16-2002, 03:35 PM   #26
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I don't mind as long as I win
I like the price and consistancy of foams, but not the gearing changes and performance on dusty tracks.
I like the all round performance and tunability of rubber, but not the price.
Whatever works for you
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Old 07-16-2002, 06:50 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by psycho
Boomer

You'll improve your laptimes on carpet if you use lower rubber content tires. Greens are that "exotic rubber" or whatever, high rubber content tires. Try using grey or white instead of green or pink.
Greens are pretty much our default tire or the starting point from which we work. They aren't exotic - they are close to the softest non-exotic there is (28 shore for Jaco, 32 for BSR and anywhere in between for the other manufacturers) - they work very very very well on the carpets that used to be around here, if the sidewall was very very very small. . . They work exceptionally well on asphalt - we have run them on parking lot, high bite unsealed and sealed asphalt, high temperature (155+) and low (65-). They are what most of us, including Anton, ran at the Norrca Onroad Nats this year and last and at last year's Roar Onroad Nats in Speedworld.

I actually prefer black on the rear. Grey has too much flex in the sidewall, although I do like them. White is just "right out" as it were - on asphalt they are terrible, at least around here.

Unfortunately, there was only one carpet track anywhere near here and it closed down. There is another that just opened but it's 4 hours away. . .
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Old 07-16-2002, 07:25 PM   #28
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Well the Rubber vs Foam topic is quite a hot topic in Australia, have a look at this thread in our Aussie section for more debate on the issue!

http://www.rctech.net/forum/showthre...&threadid=6157

For the record i'm a firm believer in FOAM!
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Old 07-16-2002, 07:57 PM   #29
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Well I have been laying low on the foam amd rubber issue for a while just to see what everyone has to say. Here are my views:

1) Diversity is one of the things that makes this hobby so much fun. I agree that one might be a little more expensive than the other, or one might have a little more traction than the other, but both are fun and give racers more avenues to travel and learn.

2) My personal opinion- Mod foam on carpet is the SHIZNIT!!! LOL. I had a blast running mod foam at Hobbies X-treme in Shreveport, LA. However, I enjoyed stock and 10 turn rubber at the Snowbirds, so I love racing on either at a carpet track. I have never run foam on asphalt, but I've run rubber on a LOT of different traction level asphalt and I liked it all. Our local track isn't really high bite, but I enjoy it as much as the super smooth high traction asphalt tracks. In fact, it makes tuning a little more interesting and challenging.

Here's one idea that might help reduce the cost of rubber tire/insert/wheel tuning for you guys-

I have spent hundreds of dollars on tire combinations searching for the best one for our track and other tracks. When I come up with the best, or a new one that is better than the last, I don't mind sharing the info with our local racers. Yes, it means giving them the edge that I spent so much money finding, but it makes for better racing and it's a way to better promote our hobby here. On the other hand, there are still others that don't necessarily believe that what I find is the best for their combination and sometimes they're right. So, I don't mind letting other people borrow the tires I have to try on their cars. Sometimes if the tires work better I will give the tires to them or sell them cheap.

Again, I could keep my findings to myself, but I want everyone here to get better and faster so we continue to challenge each other. My ultimate goal is that when racers come in from out of town they go back home saying "man, those Memphis guys are FAST!! You better take your A game with you when you go down there!!!"

R/C racing has gone through another "surge" (especially around here) and I believe we are coming to another crossroads. It is us- the racers- that choose whether it will go through another slump, or continue to grow by leaps and bounds in the next few months or years.

I hope others will be inspired to work toward a bigger, better future for r/c and bring new racers into the hobby. Yes, it takes away from you personal practice time to help the new guys, and it takes away from your personal racing budget to invest in ways to advertise and spread the word to bring in newbies, but it's the only way growth will happen.
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Old 07-16-2002, 07:58 PM   #30
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I just read my last post- what am I, some kind of freakin' cheerleader???--- geeeeez.....
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