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Old 06-04-2012, 07:16 AM   #241
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Originally Posted by Chaz955i View Post
I'll race either, doesn't much matter to me. Most tracks I've been to will run a class for three or more entries. If there were really that many committed to running boost, they would still be racing boost. Showing up to race will say a lot more than crying on RCTech.
So are you saying for those of us that DO show up to race, and DO discuss this topic at the track, that discussing it (or crying as you say) on RCTECH (an open well known RC related forum BTW) will have no affect? Youre telling me that the right to speak/type our opinion freely is a waste of time? Do you realize then, that you are wasting your time? Why is this forum even in existence then???

Did you vote for Obama?

You should know by now that sitting on your hands and doing/saying nothing... gets you nothing. Sure 3 make a class... but who wants to just race with 3 people? Who wants to race a class that cant be run anywhere else but their home track? Everyone knows that club tracks almost always follow ROAR rules, or at least use them as a guideline. ROAR kills boost... the nation follows...

This is my last post on this subject, i shall whine no more. All i was trying to do was add some perspective as a 'seasoned racer' that has had to change his RC interests because of the way ROAR has decided to influence our racing formats. Whatever, im takin my ball and goin home...
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Old 06-04-2012, 07:24 AM   #242
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Originally Posted by SlowerOne View Post
We used to have blinky, it was called brushed motors. I don't remember that tearing the hobby apart...

You're right, racing isn't fair. In my area, boosted was tearing us apart because it was making the cars too fast for most people, and it was definitely making the performance disparity larger because so many people could not sort out their programming and gearing. Even when people copy set-ups from the manufacturers or their friends, they can't get on ith them due to different driving styles, use of a different motor or differing levels of grip at different tracks. For us, blinky has brought is all back together.
Good point and I half agree but I am on the side of boosted. I remember turning up to run 540 with my old 3200 NiMH and my $50 speedie. Only to be blown away by the guys running $200 speedies, brand new 4200's charged at 50 amps which they replace after each meeting....Money equalled speed. And then there was stock.. speed drops, comm drops, secret drops, double ended bushings and what ever else you could squeeze in to a motor can...
*
At least with boosted... it is one thing.. the speedie. We will just end up with battery and motor wars again, whats the difference.
*
Did LRP start this thread?
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Old 06-04-2012, 07:45 AM   #243
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Originally Posted by DaveW View Post
People wouldnt be whining about blinky if other people hadnt whined so much about boosted and ruined classes for everyone else... theres always a flip side.

The rest of us said 'eff it' and left the classes that were regulated by blinky... or found other hobbies.
Ditto!
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Old 06-04-2012, 08:08 AM   #244
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So are you saying for those of us that DO show up to race, and DO discuss this topic at the track, that discussing it (or crying as you say) on RCTECH (an open well known RC related forum BTW) will have no affect? Not sure where I said it will have no affect although I believe that to be true. Youre telling me that the right to speak/type our opinion freely is a waste of time? I do believe that actions speak louder than words even though I hate the cliche Do you realize then, that you are wasting your time? When dealing with people that are so tied up in what they want they can't see the bigger picture? Yes, I agree. Why is this forum even in existence then??? How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?Did you vote for Obama? Ah, about as lame as throwing out the race card. Constuct a reasonable response to the topic at hand and you won't have to question my political affialiations. You should know by now that sitting on your hands and doing/saying nothing... gets you nothing. Sure 3 make a class... but who wants to just race with 3 people? Agreed, that sucks. But if there is this much demand for boosted there would be more than 3 willing to race. How many tracks would turn away money because of what ROAR does? Money talks, the rest is just excuses. Secondly, if the majority have adapted to racing blinky or moved to mod why should they change for a vocal minority who want boosted instead of just moving to the "fast" class that is currently available? Who wants to race a class that cant be run anywhere else but their home track? Everyone knows that club tracks almost always follow ROAR rules, or at least use them as a guideline. ROAR kills boost... the nation follows...

This is my last post on this subject, i shall whine no more. Ok All i was trying to do was add some perspective as a 'seasoned racer' that has had to change his RC interests because of the way ROAR has decided to influence our racing formats. Whatever, im takin my ball and goin home...
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Old 06-04-2012, 08:09 AM   #245
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well alot of you make alot of good points...but the fact remains...boosted classes helped some and ran off others...ROAR, US VTA, and most clubs are done with it. It did have some advantages, but just as many disadvantages...if not more

LRP SPX is at fault for the boosted and esc wars....Im 1st to admit it, but Tekin and others responded quickly and it went crazy from there. The Black Dimond was the kill blow. If boosted wasnt put to an end, how many extra esc's would you continue to buy every 2-5 months...because somebody made it a tick faster...

And I know Tekin fans are saying we didnt have to spend any money...true, but the guys who bought brand A,B, or C did...and in racing if your Tekin software wasnt up to date, somebody snuck a Black Dimond in and put you down a lap...so you either had to wait for Team Tekin drivers to test and race it to make sure it was up to par, or you coughed up the cash for the ESC of the month...and when you are "RACING"..you dropped the cash..period

perfect example

Race I attended in Cincy had A-main Black Dimonds, B-main Tekins, and C-main LRP SPX

what do you think the C-main guys did...?...I know what I did

You cant please everybody, and everybody will be have an opinion...but we all need to work together to continue to keep the Onroad tracks going with whatever class is run, rather it be VTA,GT,WGT,TC, or 12th scale...support your local track and its classes

and also...having a boosted esc(other than SPX)...you can run it in blinky and it wont cost you a dime.
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Old 06-04-2012, 08:31 AM   #246
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My two cents.

If you think batteries or motor are any less important in boosted than blinky, I think you're wrong. What you see is the increase in speed makes those things less important. If you ran 13.5 or 10.5 blinky, you'd see a decrease in the importance of motors and batteries simply because the faster pace puts more emphasis on driver. Vice versa, if you were running 21.5/25.5 boosted you'd see batteries and motors become more important.

The closer you are to flat out, the more important getting maximum power is.
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Old 06-04-2012, 10:04 AM   #247
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A quote from one of my favorite movies. Major League.

"Too high??? Too hard??? Who gives a shit, Its GONE!!"

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Old 06-04-2012, 10:20 AM   #248
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Originally Posted by CBear3 View Post
.

If you think batteries or motor are any less important in boosted than blinky, I think you're wrong. What you see is the increase in speed makes those things less important.
Huh?

So hey let's slow everything down to a crawl, and see who can hunt down the best rotor, stator and battery.
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Old 06-04-2012, 01:58 PM   #249
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Huh?

So hey let's slow everything down to a crawl, and see who can hunt down the best rotor, stator and battery.
The point I'm trying to make, and apparently not very well, is that the faster the cars the less anybody worries about motors/batteries of the week.

Argue class speeds, not boosted vs. non-boosted. You could put in a 21.5, boost it, and run the same as 17.5 non-boosted and you'll see motors and batteries become just as important as the blinky classes because you slowed the cars down.

So the real argument I'd think guys would want to make is that if all the sanctioning bodies want stock to be 17.5 blinky, there needs to be another class faster so less importance is placed on equipment, and more on driver (regardless of what rules you use to get there).

I know guys are going to scream, RUN MOD! but lets be realistic. If I wanted one mistake to cost me an entire run and to come back to the pits with my car in a dustbin, that'd be the answer.

In just about all carpet racing we've seen the surfaces get better, cars get better, and the grip levels are through the roof. That's why I think VTA has seen some success. They've slowed cars down for the amateur, but also taken some grip away. It's allowed for an entry level that is slow enough that you don't bin your car after one pipe, and with motor rules that at least limit your search for a golden motor to one manufacturer. Amp draw is also so ridiculously low that battery performance isn't at a premium.

Basically, its a balance between power and grip that eventually effects how important an individuals motor/battery combo is. Without attacking boosted or blinky, thats the real issue to address.
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Old 06-04-2012, 02:24 PM   #250
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Originally Posted by jsr555 View Post
Good point and I half agree but I am on the side of boosted. I remember turning up to run 540 with my old 3200 NiMH and my $50 speedie. Only to be blown away by the guys running $200 speedies, brand new 4200's charged at 50 amps which they replace after each meeting....Money equalled speed. And then there was stock.. speed drops, comm drops, secret drops, double ended bushings and what ever else you could squeeze in to a motor can...
*
At least with boosted... it is one thing.. the speedie. We will just end up with battery and motor wars again, whats the difference.
*
Did LRP start this thread?
It's one thing? I am not the only one who thinks not...

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBear3 View Post
My two cents.

If you think batteries or motor are any less important in boosted than blinky, I think you're wrong. What you see is the increase in speed makes those things less important. If you ran 13.5 or 10.5 blinky, you'd see a decrease in the importance of motors and batteries simply because the faster pace puts more emphasis on driver. Vice versa, if you were running 21.5/25.5 boosted you'd see batteries and motors become more important.

The closer you are to flat out, the more important getting maximum power is.
So hands up anyone who thinks that in the forthcoming IFMAR Worlds the top ten drivers will be using anything other than new cells and motors every run? On top of which, hands up anyone who thinks that if the speedo they are running proves slower than anything else, they won't swop?

Reality is that most drivers of over-powered cars can't tell the difference between general cells and motors and the best, because they can't make the car go fast enough to use the power they have. As stated above, the closer you get to flat out the more cells an motors become an issue. If you thunk that's not the case, then you are not close to flat out in your class.

It's each to their own, but anyone who thinks that cells and motors are not a factor in any class, boosted or not, is kidding themselves.
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Old 06-04-2012, 02:24 PM   #251
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Originally Posted by DARKSIDE View Post
Race I attended in Cincy had A-main Black Dimonds, B-main Tekins, and C-main LRP SPX

what do you think the C-main guys did...?...I know what I did
are you referring to the grand slam series race at Tri-State Hobbies? Black Diamonds were outlawed at that race so if someone was running it then they were breaking the rules.
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Old 06-04-2012, 04:09 PM   #252
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are you referring to the grand slam series race at Tri-State Hobbies? Black Diamonds were outlawed at that race so if someone was running it then they were breaking the rules.
it was the Grand Prix a few years back....it was very interesting cause the US VTA instantly banned the BD, and we moved towards the esc list we have now.

the software chase and newer better esc was the issue(imo) that really made ppl stop and look at boosted
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Old 06-04-2012, 08:20 PM   #253
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Originally Posted by rccartips View Post
Slow (blinky) and fast class (mod).
Slow drivers race in slow class.
Fast drivers race in fast class.
sounds good, wheres the line between fast and slow??
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Old 06-04-2012, 09:21 PM   #254
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think it is heading back in the right direction with the classes picked for the IIC and i am sure now the rest of the indoor races will follow . . .
17.5 blinky stock
13.5 blinky super stock
mod

while i don't think anyone will disagree that speeds are way faster then brushed, it has the same structure as the brushed days 27t stock/19t/super stock and mod, go to a big race and you can run 2 TC clasess 17.5 blinky and 13.5 blinky or 13.5 blinky and mod . . .

here are some zults of top 3 at a local trophy race

17. blinky
laps-time-hot lap
24 6:12 15.2
24 6:14 15.3
23 6:02 15.2

13.5 blinky
24 6:09 14.8
24:6:14 15.2
23 6:07 15.4

Mod
25 6:12 14.5
24 6:02 14.6
23 6:02 14.8

look at the times 17.5 blinky was the closest racing . . .Faster does not always mean better racing . . .
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Old 06-04-2012, 09:52 PM   #255
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and US VTA is even closer...good point
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