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U.S. Vintage Trans-Am Racing Part 2

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U.S. Vintage Trans-Am Racing Part 2

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Old 04-16-2018, 09:04 AM
  #11626  
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Originally Posted by DaSilva3525 View Post
Maybe try a higher roll center up front to generate some mech grip with some camber gain on top even. Did you go less droop up front?


Not trying to tell you what to do, but maybe throw around some set up changes in here?

-Less droop up front (more droop in rear if you want more off power steering / weight transfer towards the front)
-If you are at -1 toe go to 0
-If you are at -1.5 camber up front, maybe try that extra .5 to get it up to -2
-Sauce whole front if you are only doing half.
-Rear toe, go down to 2.5 or 2.0 if you are at 3 degree current.
-Higher spring rate up front (or try and move shock one hole towards the outside if you haven't) or go progressive front springs
-If you were playing with the front shock position only I would go to the rear and try one hole towards the outside. Ride height split 5mm front if you can get it that low and 5.2 rear or 5.2 front and 5.4 rear.
-Higher roll center up front (mentioned up top)
-More camber gain up front

Just a few off the top of my head. Your Sakura has a lot more flex then most CF or alum chassis cars to you have that advantage on the VTA tire in a way.
Yep went through all of that, i'm actually @ 1 degree toe in on the rear, the tires are just too hard/dry.
I'm asking more for tire break-in/prep as it seems you cant just run them without some kind of prep, and just running laps had no affect.
Going to try Eric's recommendation and just soak them overnight in liquid wrench, we don't follow usvta rules so it don't matter.
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Old 04-16-2018, 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by moparSRT View Post
Changes to ride height, droop, shock location and spring rate made verrrrrrry little difference, the push/understeer was just too much, but with the HPI's it was instantly hooked up.

Are your tires hard/dry/plastic like to the touch?? if not they how long did it take for that to change ??
I've got about 30-35 batteries on them. They're sticky to the touch and were good from the time I put them on the track. I am new to this carpet racing thing though.
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Old 04-16-2018, 05:54 PM
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What am I missing here guys. I watched Billy Kellys video the car didn't look uncontrollable, I put a set on my car are drove it in an treated unswept parking and the car was driveable. Pushy sure, I don't have the ideal set-up on the car and the tires we unprepped and brand new, but it didn't feel like I was on an ice skating rink or a was driving a drifter, the temp was in the mid 40's. So what exactly am I missing?
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Kregger View Post
What am I missing here guys. I watched Billy Kellys video the car didn't look uncontrollable, I put a set on my car are drove it in an treated unswept parking and the car was driveable. Pushy sure, I don't have the ideal set-up on the car and the tires we unprepped and brand new, but it didn't feel like I was on an ice skating rink or a was driving a drifter, the temp was in the mid 40's. So what exactly am I missing?
That's where I've been at, during the last few pages of this thread... Seems like some guys figured it out for their tracks and other cliques of racers are all agreeing to the same issue of no grip. Not knocking anyone, interesting topic for sure. Again I'm just happy to see PF keep it going period. I still feel like sharing some more ideas around could help with set up and tire prep. Shoot make a "Asphalt Surface recommendation list" between tire prep and some set up changes as a sticky even and keep moving towards a more positive note.
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Kregger View Post
What am I missing here guys. I watched Billy Kellys video the car didn't look uncontrollable, I put a set on my car are drove it in an treated unswept parking and the car was driveable. Pushy sure, I don't have the ideal set-up on the car and the tires we unprepped and brand new, but it didn't feel like I was on an ice skating rink or a was driving a drifter, the temp was in the mid 40's. So what exactly am I missing?
You're missing the part where all of the guys who have prepped their tires with WD/PB/heat are blowing by you like you're standing still! So, it's "drivable" vs raceable.
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by JC3 View Post
You're missing the part where all of the guys who have prepped their tires with WD/PB/heat are blowing by you like you're standing still! So, it's "drivable" vs raceable.
Besides the fact that the asphalt track isn't open yet, I purposely didn't treat the tires because everyone was mentioning the lack of grip and I wanted to see how bad it really was. Hopefully I'll get a chance to see what they are like on a dedicated track this weekend.
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Kregger View Post
Besides the fact that the asphalt track isn't open yet, I purposely didn't treat the tires because everyone was mentioning the lack of grip and I wanted to see how bad it really was. Hopefully I'll get a chance to see what they are like on a dedicated track this weekend.
I'm a newb and I volunteer marshalled at my track for a month before buying a car. Standing on the track (carpet) I couldn't believe the grip that the cars generated. The boards shook under my feet! I got my car, set it up, and hit the track for the first time. Pulled the throttle - nothing but wheel spin. I spent weeks trying to figure out what was wrong with my car/setup and got very frustrated/disappointed. Thankfully a RCTech member felt sorry for me, reached out ,and gave me some advice on the tires. I took it. After prepping my PF's I was within a few seconds or so of the others lap times. I later found out that everybody was prepping their PF's! No prep = no grip. If you want the no grip experience, which is certainly fine, go with Euro Truck or tub chassis classes.

When you watch the races this weekend, watch the leaders and check out how much grip they are generating. That will give you some indication of the level of tire prep. If guys have glued sidewalls and some cars look like they are traction rolling, that will tell you just about all that you need to know.

Last edited by JC3; 04-16-2018 at 06:51 PM.
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Old 04-16-2018, 07:08 PM
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To add to the previous post...

I often forget how much racing experience I've gotten over the years. What I might consider as common knowledge might be a mystery to a newer racer. It doesn't hurt to share that information so that someone else might have a better day. Tire prep can be a mystery to a lot of newer racers. I have to keep reminding people at my local track that just because we switched to black carpet doesn't mean you can stop prepping your tires. Some newer racers don't understand the benefits to cleaning their tires when they spend most of the race driving outside the racing line.
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Old 04-16-2018, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by IndyRC_Racer View Post
To add to the previous post...

I often forget how much racing experience I've gotten over the years. What I might consider as common knowledge might be a mystery to a newer racer. It doesn't hurt to share that information so that someone else might have a better day. Tire prep can be a mystery to a lot of newer racers. I have to keep reminding people at my local track that just because we switched to black carpet doesn't mean you can stop prepping your tires. Some newer racers don't understand the benefits to cleaning their tires when they spend most of the race driving outside the racing line.

Thank you, best post in weeks ...... all the tire stuff was getting a little depressing.
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Old 04-17-2018, 03:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Lone Drifter View Post
True Billy it looks like you are not sliding too much , but it does look like you have to baby the car around too much by the "sidewalk Dogleg"a little . I know its cold , Did you Compound the tires???
I’ve done nothing to the tires. Running them as they came out the package. Temp were in the 50’s during this run, warmest temps I’d run them in. The only change I’ve made was to fix the leaking shock. I loosened the shocks up a lot from last run.

Even racing USGT and F1 last summer I only tried using any tire sauce a couple times. Didn’t see any real difference overall so I’ve continued that way all winter.

The pavement is uneven at the turn by the sidewalk. Messes with every car I’ve run the layout with.

Last edited by Billy Kelly; 04-17-2018 at 03:58 AM.
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Old 04-17-2018, 06:54 AM
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Has any track ever tried runnin gno surface prep other than sweeping/blowing and no tire prep?


There is a local track in the Carolinas that does this and USVTA lap times are only a second behind USGT. And this is on a large outdoor track.

I am just curious as to why we as racers want velcro type grip on every surface in every class.


We have complained about motors being too fast for a class, talked about new rules to “slow things down”, talked about handout motors, spec batteries, cost limits, blah blah blah. But no one (ok 1 guy) actually talks about what the best thing to actually accomplish this is. Limit traction. Stop asking for, actually demanding, higher levels of grip. But anytime this option to actually slow things down is mentioned, the individual saying it, gets accused of blasphemy. Apparently asking to slow thing down via less traction is the third rail of RC cars
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Old 04-17-2018, 08:19 AM
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At Kannapolis Raceway Park this last weekend we blew the track off three times during the day to combat the yellow snow of pollen that at times was visible and still you could hear tire squeal by some of the cars in VTA and CHR and it was probably the worst traction day we have had since opening. We do nothing but blow the track off and insist that tires hit the track completely dry. I will say that traction roll isn't an issue but I have bicycled once through the sweeper at the end of the back straight with the HPI tires. OK, it wasn't with PF tires but nobody is complaining. Out loud anyway..

I will be at Valkaria in a couple weeks and plan to try out there surface on PF tires so I can make a comparison.
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Old 04-17-2018, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by theproffesor View Post
Has any track ever tried runnin gno surface prep other than sweeping/blowing and no tire prep?


There is a local track in the Carolinas that does this and USVTA lap times are only a second behind USGT. And this is on a large outdoor track.

I am just curious as to why we as racers want velcro type grip on every surface in every class.


We have complained about motors being too fast for a class, talked about new rules to “slow things down”, talked about handout motors, spec batteries, cost limits, blah blah blah. But no one (ok 1 guy) actually talks about what the best thing to actually accomplish this is. Limit traction. Stop asking for, actually demanding, higher levels of grip. But anytime this option to actually slow things down is mentioned, the individual saying it, gets accused of blasphemy. Apparently asking to slow thing down via less traction is the third rail of RC cars
I have found that if there is No track or Tire stickum the tires wear out twice as fast because of the slight sliding you get in loose conditions , especially on older asphalt.
As for High grip , i could take it or leave it , i want controllable,
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Old 04-17-2018, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by theproffesor View Post
Has any track ever tried runnin gno surface prep other than sweeping/blowing and no tire prep?

For practice nights its just blow off the track and no sticky track prep. But we still do tire prep. Grip level is noticeably lower than on race day when the track is washed, the syrup & A&W Rootbeer get sprayed.

Its more fun when the car sticks, than when sliding.

One race day it was real windy and dirt, pollen, grass etc was being blown onto the track. Was not blown off. Not as fun.
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Old 04-17-2018, 02:13 PM
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So I soaked the tires in WD40 overnight, came out of the bag swollen, soft and sticky Now were getting somewhere ...
Drove down to the track for some practice, a little SXT 3.0 and off I went ... same grip level as with the HPI's, verified with consistent same laps as on Sundays Race.

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