View Poll Results: what's your tire choice?
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4318LikesU.S. Vintage Trans-Am Racing Part 2
06-18-2016, 09:02 AM
#9661
Knowing Trinity they would then come out with a Certified VTA, then a Certified Plus VTA, and then a Super Certified Plus Extra $300 VTA motor.
06-19-2016, 09:07 AM
#9663
We had 3 heats of VTA last night at Indy RC (17 cars!). Two heats of USGT. Great night!
Next Saturday, we will be running a VTA exhibition race at the Big Ben Memorial in Indianapolis on the Mini Indy Track. Ben was a 12 year old boy that died from bone cancer. He was into RC and quarter midget racing. Should be fun and memorable. Also running stock Slash and maybe another class. This is all being done leading up to their racing starting at 10 AM.
Next Saturday, we will be running a VTA exhibition race at the Big Ben Memorial in Indianapolis on the Mini Indy Track. Ben was a 12 year old boy that died from bone cancer. He was into RC and quarter midget racing. Should be fun and memorable. Also running stock Slash and maybe another class. This is all being done leading up to their racing starting at 10 AM.
06-20-2016, 08:53 AM
#9664
Tech Fanatic
The very simple solution at the club level for the certified motor issue is to have a claiming rule where any racer can buy the motor in your VTA car for $90 or $100. If you don't want to sale your motor you just take your car home and get disqualified. That way if someone wants to spend $300 for a "Super Certified Extra" motor, I can buy it from him/her for the price of a standard off the shelf motor.
I don't like a single motor rule (which I believer there are really 3 Novak motors legal for VTA) any more than I like a single motor supplier because of just what happened with NOVAK. ROAR now has 25.5 motor standards and approved 25.5 motors. Stay with approved motors (plus Novak) and use a claiming rule if necessary to keep the certified motors under control. BTW my buddy here is still using an old Trackstar in USGT and competing well against Certified 21.5 motors.
06-20-2016, 11:16 AM
#9666
FYI Trinity isn't the only OEM that has Certified motors!
The very simple solution at the club level for the certified motor issue is to have a claiming rule where any racer can buy the motor in your VTA car for $90 or $100. If you don't want to sale your motor you just take your car home and get disqualified. That way if someone wants to spend $300 for a "Super Certified Extra" motor, I can buy it from him/her for the price of a standard off the shelf motor.
I don't like a single motor rule (which I believer there are really 3 Novak motors legal for VTA) any more than I like a single motor supplier because of just what happened with NOVAK. ROAR now has 25.5 motor standards and approved 25.5 motors. Stay with approved motors (plus Novak) and use a claiming rule if necessary to keep the certified motors under control. BTW my buddy here is still using an old Trackstar in USGT and competing well against Certified 21.5 motors.
The very simple solution at the club level for the certified motor issue is to have a claiming rule where any racer can buy the motor in your VTA car for $90 or $100. If you don't want to sale your motor you just take your car home and get disqualified. That way if someone wants to spend $300 for a "Super Certified Extra" motor, I can buy it from him/her for the price of a standard off the shelf motor.
I don't like a single motor rule (which I believer there are really 3 Novak motors legal for VTA) any more than I like a single motor supplier because of just what happened with NOVAK. ROAR now has 25.5 motor standards and approved 25.5 motors. Stay with approved motors (plus Novak) and use a claiming rule if necessary to keep the certified motors under control. BTW my buddy here is still using an old Trackstar in USGT and competing well against Certified 21.5 motors.
A single source motor rule completely eliminates the motor of the month club. A racer can go in and buy that motor and be reasonably assured no one will out horsepower him. And company A is not going to try something silly just to beat company B. Vintage Trans Am was started as a class to have fun with that didn't have all the issues of 17.5 touring car. If you're racing VTA to prove that you're the best driver, may I suggest you're in the wrong class.
06-20-2016, 11:43 AM
#9667
Again the drama about trinity motors.From what I hear for my other sponsored drivers the other companies sell the same thing except they don't advertise it the way Trinity does. Just go out and work on your set-up and everything will come around.Although I'm not a VTA driver (dead down here) we do race a 25.5 TC class and it is quite competitive with any motor and battery. If you have "The motor" of the month and still lose- it set-up and driving!!!!
06-20-2016, 12:13 PM
#9668
As long as USVTA maintained their own rules separate of ROAR, the class has been healthy. While many have complained about various rules over the years, the actual racing on the track was always good.
I would hope that USVTA will continue to maintain their rules separate of ROAR. This will allow USVTA to ban any/all manufacturers that exploit grays areas for their own profits.
I would hope that USVTA will continue to maintain their rules separate of ROAR. This will allow USVTA to ban any/all manufacturers that exploit grays areas for their own profits.
06-20-2016, 01:03 PM
#9670
Tech Fanatic
[QUOTE=jiml;14574151]But Trinity is the best (or should I say worst) example
A single source motor rule completely eliminates the motor of the month club. A racer can go in and buy that motor and be reasonably assured no one will out horsepower him. [QUOTE]
IF and only IF that OEM has GREAT quality control processes! Before the 45 degree timing limit rule was eliminated in VTA there certainly wasn't IMO a level playing field eve with a single source OEM or even with a single motor like the BOSS VTA motor (yea I know there are actually 3 legal VTA motors). At 45 degrees by the end bell (EB) timing label, my BOSS motor was according to my motorlizer more like ~68 degrees. Others reported that at 45 degrees by the EB, they had around 30 degrees timing using a motorlizer or G Force tester. If you think that is a level playing field, I have some land in FL I want to sell you. IF you are lucky enough to get one of the good motors you love the single source motor rule; however, if you are not so lucky and get a pig you'd better be content with cars zooming by you on the track and hearing people tell you, you'd better work on your setup! Yea go tell that to Red Bull, Ferrari, and the other F-1 team without the Mercedes engine.
After 30 years of racing, a single source motor only creates a different kind of motor war: a search for the best of the lot! The only place I saw get around it was one track where they had a spec motor. The motors were dyno tested and only the most closely matched motors were used, and only those motors were randomly issued to racers each race day (and returned after the race). Even then, the racers knew which motors were the pigs!
A single source motor rule completely eliminates the motor of the month club. A racer can go in and buy that motor and be reasonably assured no one will out horsepower him. [QUOTE]
IF and only IF that OEM has GREAT quality control processes! Before the 45 degree timing limit rule was eliminated in VTA there certainly wasn't IMO a level playing field eve with a single source OEM or even with a single motor like the BOSS VTA motor (yea I know there are actually 3 legal VTA motors). At 45 degrees by the end bell (EB) timing label, my BOSS motor was according to my motorlizer more like ~68 degrees. Others reported that at 45 degrees by the EB, they had around 30 degrees timing using a motorlizer or G Force tester. If you think that is a level playing field, I have some land in FL I want to sell you. IF you are lucky enough to get one of the good motors you love the single source motor rule; however, if you are not so lucky and get a pig you'd better be content with cars zooming by you on the track and hearing people tell you, you'd better work on your setup! Yea go tell that to Red Bull, Ferrari, and the other F-1 team without the Mercedes engine.
After 30 years of racing, a single source motor only creates a different kind of motor war: a search for the best of the lot! The only place I saw get around it was one track where they had a spec motor. The motors were dyno tested and only the most closely matched motors were used, and only those motors were randomly issued to racers each race day (and returned after the race). Even then, the racers knew which motors were the pigs!
06-20-2016, 01:49 PM
#9671
John, that hasn't been my experience. The people I race with haven't complained about the Novak motor.
Doesn't matter anyway, USVTA has decided to go with ROAR approved motors, plus the Novak is grandfathered in. We'll just have to see where this goes.
Doesn't matter anyway, USVTA has decided to go with ROAR approved motors, plus the Novak is grandfathered in. We'll just have to see where this goes.
06-20-2016, 02:02 PM
#9672
Was the Novak 25.5 motor perfect? No.
Was it good enough to create close club racing at the vast majority of tracks racing USVTA rules? YES.
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The unintended consequence of spending so much time talking about the best motor, battery, speed control, etc. online is that people forget that the actual racing on the track was always fairly close in VTA.
The guys winning at the club level and big races always had a better setup car and made fewer mistakes. Period.
Hopefully as the new ROAR 25.5 motors become available, the actual racing on the track will continue to be as good as it ever was.
Was it good enough to create close club racing at the vast majority of tracks racing USVTA rules? YES.
----------
The unintended consequence of spending so much time talking about the best motor, battery, speed control, etc. online is that people forget that the actual racing on the track was always fairly close in VTA.
The guys winning at the club level and big races always had a better setup car and made fewer mistakes. Period.
Hopefully as the new ROAR 25.5 motors become available, the actual racing on the track will continue to be as good as it ever was.
06-20-2016, 02:15 PM
#9673
Pro Invitational Class sponsored by Novak and DS4L
a. must have TQ'd or finished in the top 5 of one of the following events running U.S.VTA rules: Scale Nats(Chicago) Southern Nats(Nashville) Summit Nats(Ft Wayne) Halloween Classic(Cleveland) Snowbirds Nats(Orlando) U.S.VTA Pavement Nats (FL) or the U.S.VTA National Points Series
b. sponsored or unsponsored
c. Pre glued HPI VTA wheels and tires as handout
d. handout Novak VTA Boss 25.5, built by Charlie and/or Bob Novak. Built to be as equal as possible. One motor per racer
c. battery will be tech for capacity with the ICharger. NEW Rule is 6000 mah. Must use the same battery, limit 2.
e. simple points system 1-10, lowest amount of points wins. tie breakers will be times and laps
f. limited to 10 racers
g. random sort and starts using all 3 types: rolling, lemans, inverted
h. 6 rounds at 10 min each
hummm
a. must have TQ'd or finished in the top 5 of one of the following events running U.S.VTA rules: Scale Nats(Chicago) Southern Nats(Nashville) Summit Nats(Ft Wayne) Halloween Classic(Cleveland) Snowbirds Nats(Orlando) U.S.VTA Pavement Nats (FL) or the U.S.VTA National Points Series
b. sponsored or unsponsored
c. Pre glued HPI VTA wheels and tires as handout
d. handout Novak VTA Boss 25.5, built by Charlie and/or Bob Novak. Built to be as equal as possible. One motor per racer
c. battery will be tech for capacity with the ICharger. NEW Rule is 6000 mah. Must use the same battery, limit 2.
e. simple points system 1-10, lowest amount of points wins. tie breakers will be times and laps
f. limited to 10 racers
g. random sort and starts using all 3 types: rolling, lemans, inverted
h. 6 rounds at 10 min each
hummm
06-20-2016, 02:27 PM
#9674
also...I hope all you guys with a "honest" opinions race and promote USVTA on a local regional and national level. Cause its hard for me or others to take anything you say serious if you not racing the class...
people have to understand that this class has done really well and gain tremendous following from across the globe. No the rules are not always smiles, but what rules are? Racers have options more now than ever...do we like them?..me?..NO...I don't like the esc or the motor rule now....but Im USVTA all the way and that is why they get my support. We can debate argue bitch moan and complain all day on the internet. But what we need to do is get to the track and parking lots and wherever and help keep these cool azz American Muscle cars racing for years to come....lets stop for a minute and look at the real options for the USVTA....not many that can be done overnight. So the ROAR option is best for now...this allows us to continue to grow the class with new racers that are looking to get involved. When asked what motor do I need?...simple answer Novak or ROAR approved 25.5's
get to the track and race some VTA
people have to understand that this class has done really well and gain tremendous following from across the globe. No the rules are not always smiles, but what rules are? Racers have options more now than ever...do we like them?..me?..NO...I don't like the esc or the motor rule now....but Im USVTA all the way and that is why they get my support. We can debate argue bitch moan and complain all day on the internet. But what we need to do is get to the track and parking lots and wherever and help keep these cool azz American Muscle cars racing for years to come....lets stop for a minute and look at the real options for the USVTA....not many that can be done overnight. So the ROAR option is best for now...this allows us to continue to grow the class with new racers that are looking to get involved. When asked what motor do I need?...simple answer Novak or ROAR approved 25.5's
get to the track and race some VTA
06-20-2016, 02:55 PM
#9675
Tech Fanatic
Anyway I was just disagreeing with your statement that having a single source for motors completley eliminates the motor of the month club. I haven't purchased a Novak motor for several years so perhaps they have improved, but the BOSS motors I have (3) show significiannt differences on my FACT Mancine2, my motorlyzer, and my Facts MachineII dyno even when I set the timing of each to the same timing using the motorlyzer..
Last edited by John Wallace2; 06-20-2016 at 03:19 PM.