R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-14-2005, 11:03 AM   #1
Tech Master
 
kvrc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: michigan
Posts: 1,000
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default feedback on motor can zapping

ok guys i am looking for some feedback. a few weeks ago i started a can zapping service. i have a post here on the for sale forum and out of respect for the rules i wont post any of that info here.
i want to know what you guys think about my prices and turnaround, i have great feedback here, on hobbytalk,ebay and a couple of other forums.
i dont think people believe i will burn them but i could be wrong. just for reference, i am the guy who has been making and selling the teflon washers for several months now. i am only looking for constructive comments please.
kvrc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 11:13 AM   #2
Tech Master
R/C Tech Charter Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Margaritaville
Posts: 1,957
Default

I think it is more of an issue of having to send the motor cans off and having the down time to ship them there, zap them, and ship them back. It sounds like it would take close to a week or a week and a half. (guess off the top of my head) Also not a whole lot of racers have the money to have multiple motors. I have 2 that I switch off for the heats and the mains. Many racers also have the luxury of someone at the track that has a motor zapper and will do it right there for like $5. I personally would buy a magnet zapper but mostly use it for myself and the local racers just because not many want to ship their motors off and have the down time. So it's really not your prices or that we don't trust you, it's just that it takes a while where we could wait a week to go to the track and have them zapped.
NismoSkyline17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 11:16 AM   #3
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 835
Default

From what I understand can zapping is pretty useless unless you're using an industrial zapper,most of the zapper's that are on the market,IE Team 1 etc etc. are of no value.
Hyper1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 12:19 PM   #4
Tech Master
 
kvrc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: michigan
Posts: 1,000
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

hyper1... you are partialy right. some of the zappers sold wont do the job properly. i have the team one zapper and i can assure you it is one of the few commercially sold zappers that will fully energize the magnets to full strength.
i waited a long time for a team one zapper to go up for sale locally so i could make sure it worked properly before i bought it. i paid much more for it than some others i have seen listed. but in my book if something cant get the job done right it isnt worth anything.

keep the comments coming guys...
kvrc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 12:20 PM   #5
JKA
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,000
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Hyper1
From what I understand can zapping is pretty useless unless you're using an industrial zapper,most of the zapper's that are on the market,IE Team 1 etc etc. are of no value.
I have a team 1, and I've seen increases both on the track and on the dyno. The benefits are huge if the motor has been abused and decent even for new motors.

I would agree though that the big zappers are probably much better.

The only issue with the zapping service IMO is exactly what Nismo stated. Turnaround time will keep many from "buying" in.
I zap cans for local racers free of charge. That probably hurts too.

Other than that, it seems like a good deal.
JKA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 12:27 PM   #6
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 835
Default

Maybe for one or two runs but that's about it.then you're back to square one.Is your zapper a 110 volt or 220?A 110 just won't cut it.
Hyper1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 12:53 PM   #7
Tech Master
 
kvrc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: michigan
Posts: 1,000
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

the team one is a 120 unit. i dont want to argue with you about wheather my zapper can do the job because it can and im sure many others will post the same. tempest 2000 is making his own zapper and his runs off 120 and it definitly will do the job. he did a lot of research before desinging his and he determined that if done right like the team one is, it can do the job.
kvrc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 01:31 PM   #8
JKA
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,000
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Hyper1
Maybe for one or two runs but that's about it.then you're back to square one.Is your zapper a 110 volt or 220?A 110 just won't cut it.
The drop off you are seeing after a couple runs is not the can. Unless of course your are running the thing at about 250 degrees!

I zap my cans with every rebuild, and by the readings on my guass meter there isn't a significant desaturation in this time frame (usually 5 runs). Enough to warrant a zap though!
JKA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 01:43 PM   #9
Tech Regular
 
BuddyB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Gate,Ohio
Posts: 348
Send a message via AIM to BuddyB
Default

I believe that you only need to zap the can every 5-10 runs if you have the luxery of a zapper around you, if not its no big deal. The only time you need to zap more often is if you are running the motor at excessive temperatures b/c as the motor gets that hot, it reduces the force the magnets produce.
-Buddy
BuddyB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 02:11 PM   #10
Tech Master
 
Tempest2000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Smyrna, TN
Posts: 1,590
Trader Rating: 21 (100%+)
Default

I can assure you than a 110 when designed probably is definately more than capable of fully saturating the magnets.
Our unit puts out well over 2 times the required field to saturate the magnets.

Voltage is only a part of the equation there is much more to it than that. I could make a unit that used 500 or 1000 volts, but that won't make it zap any better.

Please don't discredit magnet zappers without doing the homework yourself...

As for Team 1 I cannot vouch for it... I have not tested one of their units. I have heard it does make improvements.

I can say that magnet zappers do in fact work. There are plenty of people that post on here that can back that up as well. Quite a few of the motor builders on here actually use my units with great results. Those type of people wouldn't buy something on a whim.

Now as far as how often etc. Heat is not the only thing that degrades the magnets in a motor. The motor itself actually partially reverses the magnets over time when you run it. I find that 200+ deg usually hurts the magnets. It all depends on the type of magnets Epic, Reedy, and even they use different grade magnets in their motors. Typically handout stocks and 19's have the most to be gained by zapping. They usually are a weaker grade magnet and therefore they degrade faster than say a mod TI or mod cobalt motor etc.

If you have access to one zap on every rebuild... why not its already apart. If you don't have access I'd say 15-20 runs at the club level would show some benefit by rezapping. At the national level zap it at least every 2 or 3 runs. You need every thing you can get.

Now as far as the gauss meters go... I have not seen a single guass meter under $200 to $300 that is even close to accurate. You can buy some in the $50-$100 range but usually they are not calibrated so it will give you a reference point, but it will not tell you what the actual gauss reading is. In other words you can use it for reference on your own motors to some degree, but yours will not necessarily correlate to the next persons meter. Most are not precise enough either...

Bottom line, there have been a few zappers out there that gave magnet zapping a bad name and ERP was probably the most well-known. Neither of there units worked 12v or 110v. In fact they actually demagnetized your motor in most cases. So people with fantom dyno's actually thought it improved there motors, but overall they lost more torque and gained rpm... looks better on a fly wheel, but does not perform on the track or on a load dyno.

A magnet zapper should increase torque and watts... if it increases rpm it would be only slightly and in most cases it stays about the same. The other thing to keep in mind is that after zapping the motor is more efficient due to the increase in torque and watts. In most cases you can actually gear up a tooth and have the same infield speed and more straightaway without using up more battery and the motor will also stay about the same temperate as it ran before zapping with the smaller pinion. Increased torque means more efficiency, more power, more run time, ability to take more gear, etc...

Hope that helps answer some questions...

I don't want you to think I was taking over the thread...
I just want to make sure that everyone has accurate information about magnet zappers and what they do...

Michael Skeen
Tempest2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 02:13 PM   #11
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 835
Default

kv,

No argument here buddy,just opinions.I've tried to zap before and can see no REAL difference.After some questioning with some of the guys that build them,that is what I was told.Tempest maybe I need to try one of your units.I'm thinking that ERP is the one that I was trying it was either that or the Team one.

Last edited by Hyper1; 01-14-2005 at 02:21 PM.
Hyper1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 02:24 PM   #12
Tech Master
 
Tempest2000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Smyrna, TN
Posts: 1,590
Trader Rating: 21 (100%+)
Default

A magnet zapper will not put you in the A at a national event if you are usually in the F or G main...

You are talking about something that might pick you up a tenth or 2 a lap max with every thing else being equal (yes there are cases when it picks up more with proper gearing etc and the condition of the magnets before zapping).

Magnet zappers aren't for people who are a second a lap off the pace. If you hit 5 or more boards a race you probably don't need a zapper.

Will zapping your magnets help the avg racer... Yes it will, but don't expect it to put you in the A....

If you are a good driver you should feel the difference on the track corners straightaway etc. You should also see a difference in you times if you are a good consistant driver.

A load dyno like the turbo dyno will show an increase. A fantom is about 50/50. They are weighted more towards rpm so you might see a slight to moderate increase... Also the fantom dyno doesn't actually measure the inch oz of torque so it is difficult for it to read the difference. This is where the turbo dyno has its advantage....
Tempest2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2005, 02:29 PM   #13
Tech Master
 
kvrc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: michigan
Posts: 1,000
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

hyper1 its all good. i appreciate any info as long as it is based on experience and not heresay. tempest2000 named the zapper that gives many people a bad taste when it comes to this whole issue.
these are a lot like dynos in that people think that since it was made to do a certain job it must be good. unfortunatly if you use the wrong type of dyno or zapper for that matter you will assume that all of them must be useless.
in case people dont know how magnet strength works, look at your magnets as a 10 oz. cup and the zapping as water. if the zapper can fill the cup to full then it is good enough. if you had a zapper as big as your house and could pour 1000 oz. of water on your cup, you still end up with 10 oz.
i have talked to many people with first hand experience on the various zappers avalable as well some of the home built ones. they all say that the team one can do the job as well as any of them that actually work.
kvrc is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
MOTOR ZAPPING zrill Singapore R/C Racers 4 03-20-2007 01:37 AM
Motor zapping service Marcos.J R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 53 03-01-2006 12:34 PM
Motor Can Zapping Service kvrc R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 1 12-23-2004 09:40 PM
Motor zapping lee82gx Singapore R/C Racers 10 01-13-2003 05:12 AM
Motor Zapping lee82gx Malaysian R/C Racers 0 01-08-2003 03:18 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 10:28 AM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net