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Old 04-11-2013, 01:13 PM   #91
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F104 fronts will fit the f109 but f103 wheels or f109 wheels dont fit the f104.
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Old 04-11-2013, 02:03 PM   #92
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My tires came in today!


I made a video with how i decided to install them as well as a little review!
http://www.uf1houston.com/index.php?...d-information/
MantisWorx thanks for the link and good vid!
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:10 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by Rich Valente View Post
thanks, so F109 wheels = F103 Tamiya wheels?
Yes,

Well ladies and gentlemen i spent 8 hours at the track trying to get them to work. Unfortunately i couldnt get them to be as quick as the "other " tires but I did get some useful information:

1) ALL rear tires need air gap via TC inserts ( for asphalt anyway), It was the only thing that i could do to even get them close to driveable at least for me.
2) front tires simply have too much bite, even the hard ones, so maybe stuffing an offroad insert them to create less traction?

Last edited by MantisWorx; 04-12-2013 at 12:31 AM.
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Old 04-12-2013, 07:19 AM   #94
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Yes,

Well ladies and gentlemen i spent 8 hours at the track trying to get them to work. Unfortunately i couldnt get them to be as quick as the "other " tires but I did get some useful information:

1) ALL rear tires need air gap via TC inserts ( for asphalt anyway), It was the only thing that i could do to even get them close to driveable at least for me.
2) front tires simply have too much bite, even the hard ones, so maybe stuffing an offroad insert them to create less traction?
Last weekend I tried the Supersoft rear, medium front Sweep combo on an exotek F1R. The track was a well prepped and sprayed parkinglot. The F1R was pretty much setup per manual. The car was phenomenal on Shimizu 571, 572, and I was able to drive a 12.4 lap (my fastest 17.5 blinky TC was 11.7 and lapped the entire field 3 times to win).

Then I bolted under the sweeps and the car was pretty much undrivable. I had way too much steering as well, and no traction in the rear. This became even worse after the traction compound wore off after a minute into the run. To me it looks like the sweeps need either an entirely different setup, or are just not as good as the Shimizus. Maybe they will be more useful when it gets warmer outside. I tried the combo at around 60 fahrenheit track temp.

So my limited experience with the sweeps is unfortunately completely in line with yours MantisWorx.
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Old 04-12-2013, 07:35 AM   #95
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the reviews on these tires is a total bummer, I had high hopes for these as the hype was out there for them. oh well ;\
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Old 04-12-2013, 07:57 AM   #96
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Hello

Thank you for the inputs. we will find out F1 Sweep outdoor set up from our drivers to post it here soon.

in initial set ups, we had to increase kickup (castor) on front to get a car to handle right, we will post more tips to get our tires on the top spot.

Thank you for the supports.
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Old 04-12-2013, 09:08 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by SweepRacingUSA View Post
Hello

Thank you for the inputs. we will find out F1 Sweep outdoor set up from our drivers to post it here soon.

in initial set ups, we had to increase kickup (castor) on front to get a car to handle right, we will post more tips to get our tires on the top spot.

Thank you for the supports.
On the 104 you cannot adjust Caster, only camber,ride height and droop!
During the 8 hour stint i put on them yesterday(did not get home until 1:00 last night, look at my post time) i tried every combination of front end adjustment i could think of. All degrees of camber (2.5 was the best), all springs (super soft was the best only because once the spring collapse you lose steering) . I do have a way of adjusting caster via a system i designed a few years back. I will dig through my boxes and see if i can find one but even then , i dont think the rear tires have quite enough grip. There is only so much you can do to the rear of these cars so all tuning will have to come from the front and we are limited on adjustments. Since the dawn of time we have always fought to increase steering and with these fronts even the hards are just slightly too much.

IMO this is what needs to happen to make these tires successful in the US market:
The hard fronts need to become the soft fronts and a new compound for med and hard needs to be found. and the fronts need a more dense insert or better yet a molded closed cell would be superb.
I cant quite put my finger on the issue with the rears. The Med seem to have the most side bite to me even with the supplied insert. I have not mounted the hard tires yet but will today with a TC insert and try them on sunday same with the Med rears. The SS rears had less grip than the S rears and i could not get them to scrub while the Med tires scrubbed after about 5min on the track??
So in reality the rear compounds need to be revisited , as it stands now the best rear simply has less rear grip than the pit 572 which means that even if i get the front end sorted out they will not be as quick as the 0571 no matter what condition.(keep in mind i have not tested the hards yet, they may actually work the best considering the Med right now feel better than the S and SS). Track temps last night was 60-70 FYI.

As a manufacturer myself I know that molds are expensive ,REAL expensive! So this issue eventually needs to be figured out! With that being said if you want to send me the new compounds I will thoroughly test them and give you feedback. I faithfully run the SWEEP GTtires and buggy tires they are excellent so I know its just a matter of finding the perfect elixir!!
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Old 04-12-2013, 10:04 AM   #98
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M,
I think the rears are too stiff on the sidewall and the insert too hard and too big. The tire is ballooning and the contact patch is seriously reduced in back. If the SS had a softer thinner insert, that might increase contact patch and increase mechanical grip. As far as the side wall, I would prefer it stay firm, but not rigid. I'm going to stop by our local shop and see if they have some soft or medium TC inserts. I do have some low profile buggy fronts that might just work too.
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Old 04-12-2013, 10:29 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by liljohn1064 View Post
M,
I think the rears are too stiff on the sidewall and the insert too hard and too big. The tire is ballooning and the contact patch is seriously reduced in back. If the SS had a softer thinner insert, that might increase contact patch and increase mechanical grip. As far as the side wall, I would prefer it stay firm, but not rigid. I'm going to stop by our local shop and see if they have some soft or medium TC inserts. I do have some low profile buggy fronts that might just work too.
Makes sense, not too sure about the ballooning though since they are belted. unless you are saying that the sidewalls are ballooning. In that case though my tires had no low grip traction either! I think its just the compound is too hard.
Because i like a challenge and because i spent over 100 bux on these tires. I will try and get the best out of them just to see if i can do it!

I just mounted the hards using the pit inserts and i used my belt sander to scrub them in along with soaking them with buggy grip in an enclosed container overnight so tomorrow i will retest with all air gap inserts and pre scrubbed on a different track tomorrow.

A few things to keep in mind about F1 and i think most will agree on this.As of right now a set of tires will literally last you 6mths to a year , fronts even longer. ME myself i would LOVE to have rear tires that only last a month or even shorter, wouldnt bother me at all to buy a set of rear tires a month, i waste money on worse RC stuff!! TC tires only last a few weeks, offroad the same etc etc. SWEEP, give us an insanely high grip rear tire that wears fast!!
I also run nitro GT which the compounds run from 40-55, while TC runs 28-40 so it makes sense to me that F1 tires because of weight need 20/25/30 shore non EXP (maybe lower) to work.
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:06 PM   #100
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Attention all F1 racers who purchased Sweep F1 tires.
  • Front tires: If your front tires came with White inserts, please contact Sweep Racing USA through a following link to get replacement front inserts for your tires, if your tires are already glued, you can sliced open from inside of the tires to open to swap the inserts. if you didn't glue the tires yet, please wait for new inserts to arrive.
  • Front inserts: need to be double side taped like the manual show, do not cut or trimmed the inserts over lapping the gluing bid of a wheel. just stick the middle part hard, touch with your fingers on side edges so it won't sticks on the wheel. work your tires over the wheel to get needed supporting inserts goes inside of tires side wall.
  • Rear tires: Please be sure to trimmed the inner gluing lips off before gluing as shown on the SweepRacingUSA.com as a tuning tip or as showing below, we found out its not tuning tip in the US racing, it's a mandatory thing to do to suit on the US Tracks.

  • Rear inserts:Please be sure you have a set of White inserts, not the Grey ones. double side tape to a wheel, it maybe feel like little short this way when you double side taping it to wheel, just stretch the insert little to stick it on a wheel without gap. our inserts are not made to fits in the tires lie we do with TC. if you do that way, you will have left over inserts but that will change density of foams by too far. our inserts are actually designed to be little samller so it need to be stretch to fits.
Please contact our sales dept with Inserts requesting or any other questions by click here

F1 is our new project, which have been worked by our staffs for many years, but as alway real world racing bring us final adjustment to fits right, thank you for the supports and sorry for the inconvenience it may occurred to you.

Team Sweep Racing USA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MantisWorx View Post
On the 104 you cannot adjust Caster, only camber,ride height and droop!
During the 8 hour stint i put on them yesterday(did not get home until 1:00 last night, look at my post time) i tried every combination of front end adjustment i could think of. All degrees of camber (2.5 was the best), all springs (super soft was the best only because once the spring collapse you lose steering) . I do have a way of adjusting caster via a system i designed a few years back. I will dig through my boxes and see if i can find one but even then , i dont think the rear tires have quite enough grip. There is only so much you can do to the rear of these cars so all tuning will have to come from the front and we are limited on adjustments. Since the dawn of time we have always fought to increase steering and with these fronts even the hards are just slightly too much.

IMO this is what needs to happen to make these tires successful in the US market:
The hard fronts need to become the soft fronts and a new compound for med and hard needs to be found. and the fronts need a more dense insert or better yet a molded closed cell would be superb.
I cant quite put my finger on the issue with the rears. The Med seem to have the most side bite to me even with the supplied insert. I have not mounted the hard tires yet but will today with a TC insert and try them on sunday same with the Med rears. The SS rears had less grip than the S rears and i could not get them to scrub while the Med tires scrubbed after about 5min on the track??
So in reality the rear compounds need to be revisited , as it stands now the best rear simply has less rear grip than the pit 572 which means that even if i get the front end sorted out they will not be as quick as the 0571 no matter what condition.(keep in mind i have not tested the hards yet, they may actually work the best considering the Med right now feel better than the S and SS). Track temps last night was 60-70 FYI.

As a manufacturer myself I know that molds are expensive ,REAL expensive! So this issue eventually needs to be figured out! With that being said if you want to send me the new compounds I will thoroughly test them and give you feedback. I faithfully run the SWEEP GTtires and buggy tires they are excellent so I know its just a matter of finding the perfect elixir!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by liljohn1064 View Post
M,
I think the rears are too stiff on the sidewall and the insert too hard and too big. The tire is ballooning and the contact patch is seriously reduced in back. If the SS had a softer thinner insert, that might increase contact patch and increase mechanical grip. As far as the side wall, I would prefer it stay firm, but not rigid. I'm going to stop by our local shop and see if they have some soft or medium TC inserts. I do have some low profile buggy fronts that might just work too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MantisWorx View Post
Makes sense, not too sure about the ballooning though since they are belted. unless you are saying that the sidewalls are ballooning. In that case though my tires had no low grip traction either! I think its just the compound is too hard.
Because i like a challenge and because i spent over 100 bux on these tires. I will try and get the best out of them just to see if i can do it!

I just mounted the hards using the pit inserts and i used my belt sander to scrub them in along with soaking them with buggy grip in an enclosed container overnight so tomorrow i will retest with all air gap inserts and pre scrubbed on a different track tomorrow.

A few things to keep in mind about F1 and i think most will agree on this.As of right now a set of tires will literally last you 6mths to a year , fronts even longer. ME myself i would LOVE to have rear tires that only last a month or even shorter, wouldnt bother me at all to buy a set of rear tires a month, i waste money on worse RC stuff!! TC tires only last a few weeks, offroad the same etc etc. SWEEP, give us an insanely high grip rear tire that wears fast!!
I also run nitro GT which the compounds run from 40-55, while TC runs 28-40 so it makes sense to me that F1 tires because of weight need 20/25/30 shore non EXP (maybe lower) to work.
Attached Thumbnails
Sweep F1 tyres..........-f1r_tip_side_bite.jpg  

Last edited by SweepRacingUSA; 04-12-2013 at 12:28 PM.
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:37 PM   #101
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well, This is frustrating!! i have all white front inserts and did not know about cutting the inner lip on the tires until now!! To add to this if you do not cut the angle on the inserts the front tires bulge around the outside lips and makes the wheels off balance.And when you try and stretch the tire over the wheel and the insert the insert gets bunched up. So we will have to agree to disagree on that tip! I also sent you a PM last night.
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:57 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MantisWorx View Post
well, This is frustrating!! i have all white front inserts and did not know about cutting the inner lip on the tires until now!! To add to this if you do not cut the angle on the inserts the front tires bulge around the outside lips and makes the wheels off balance.And when you try and stretch the tire over the wheel and the insert the insert gets bunched up. So we will have to agree to disagree on that tip! I also sent you a PM last night.
I have white inserts in the fronts as well. I have rears with gray (s) and white inserts (SS). I noticed that the white insert for the rear and fronts were 100% the same in dimension, but the wheels obviously have different widths. I too saw the side wall buldge upfront and figured I had received rear inserts for the front. I did cut 5mm off the width of the front insert (the difference between a front and rear wheel and it seemed to fit nicely then. I had no problems sticking the insert to the wheel, and pulling the tire over inverted. The trick is to get the inverted tire on there to about the mid line of the wheel. Then you flip the tire back over and fits fine. I had no length issues with the white insert and the wheel. If anything it felt a bit long. I pushed the ends together on the wheel, and massaged the rest of the insert to the wheel.

I did not trim the lip, but I'm not sure if that changes much. The tires felt way off to me, and it was not a matter of fine tuning.

So what is the issue with the white inserts, and what is changed with the new inserts?
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Old 04-12-2013, 02:15 PM   #103
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Well as was stated above...traditionally with the F104 we've done all we can to increase front grip even going with setups that would have been considered crazy back in the foam tire days and early rubber tire days. If these tires are designed to work better with a stock setup than Pits or Rides then probably a completely different setup is needed...one that maximizes rear grip instead of front.
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Old 04-12-2013, 02:37 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by InspGadgt View Post
Well as was stated above...traditionally with the F104 we've done all we can to increase front grip even going with setups that would have been considered crazy back in the foam tire days and early rubber tire days. If these tires are designed to work better with a stock setup than Pits or Rides then probably a completely different setup is needed...one that maximizes rear grip instead of front.
I have the most rear grip that i think is possible! My chassis uses real traction bars, very few cars work as well as mine does on loose tracks. I think that caster, toe in,EPS and hard springs will settle it down but need to get this insert thing straight first. After setting my car up to push with the Sweeps at the end of the night i put the pits back on and it pushed sooooo bad you couldnt drive it so that tells me i have plenty of rear grip!

I have been talking with John (Sweep) and he assures me that it will get resolved and he is having different/softer shores poured ASAP!
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Old 04-12-2013, 02:41 PM   #105
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Pan cars, as is the case with most F1's
Are tuned almost entirely with tires, Foam, or rubber
Tamiya, RIDE, Shimizu, and now Sweep, all offer varied sets of compounds to support this case

The fine tuning comes from what little adjustment there is left on the chassis

If a set of tires are deemed undrivable ?
Good luck with tuning that out

all this is just imo of course...
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