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Old 01-12-2005, 01:07 PM   #1
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Default Why are we Dumbing down our hobby??

I guess I just don't understand why we're moving towards making everything in this hobby easier. One of the main reasons I still do this after 17+ years is because it's challenging. The 4-cell Sedan movement, and the advent of the brushless motor, will remove a fair amount of the challenge, as I see it. Perhaps I'm in the minority, but I do this for the challenge of running with the big dogs at THEIR level. I have no interest in becoming competitive by bring them down to my level.

Feel free to post whatever you like, but I didn't establish this thread to start a festival of flaming, so please try to be constructive.
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Old 01-12-2005, 01:19 PM   #2
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I am soooo with you on this one. I came up in the era of the Gold tub Rc10 with the 6-gear tranny. Talk about work getting your car right. The mold for the rear arms was screwed up for about 6 years where the inner hinge pin holes didnt line up with each other. I just read a guy complaining about building his Losi ADII truck and having to trim the molding off the plastic pieces. Maye we are the minority here and actually enjoy the time it takes to amke your car "perfect".
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Old 01-12-2005, 01:22 PM   #3
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I remember building an old Grasshopper, RC10 gold pan, and an FX10. It was no cake walk. It took me and my dad (at that time it was realistically my Dad), the better part of two weeks of working nights on them o try and build them. Now if it takes 4 hours it's too long. I like things to be simple but not easy, if you know what I'm saying. Making the car perform well should be more than just holding down a button and changing your tires. Understanding the car and why it does this when you do that to it is all a part of it.
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Old 01-12-2005, 01:31 PM   #4
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I don't see the brushless movement as bringing anyone down to someone's level...Brushless makes it easier togo fast with higher efficiencyand lower maintenance.

A brushed motor cn be made to go as fast or faster than brushless...it makes it easier for the people that don't have access to a 'motor guru' to hand whind, balance and tech their motors for them.

The big dogs that you're aspiring to hang with no longer have to do a lot of the things that helped them achieve big dog status....they have their motor experts..and battery experts to help them...

What's wrong with making it easier for the people that don't have those resources to hang with them?
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Old 01-12-2005, 01:50 PM   #5
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All that stuff is learned by experience. That is part of what makes someone fast. These big dogs still have the motor and battery and chassis smarts to be fast, but at big races they pool the talent together to get the car/ driver package as good as they can. The Atsushi Hara, Mark Pavidis, and Barry Bakers of the world are still fast at a club race where they have to work on their own motors and batteries.

What is wrong with making it easier for people without these resources to hang with them? That is part of the challenge of racing. People must like these challenges or the T-Spec class would have alot more participants.
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Old 01-12-2005, 01:55 PM   #6
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4 cell touring car???? who is the jackass that came up with that?


I personally dont see why we dont run 8min TC like they do in japan. We might not be running 7x1's then...

but 4 cell... ???
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Old 01-12-2005, 01:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by Keith Billanti
4 cell touring car???? who is the jackass that came up with that?

but 4 cell... ???
There's a whole thread dedicated to the 4-cell TC movement right on this very board KB. I don't get it either.
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:01 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by Keith Billanti
4 cell touring car???? who is the jackass that came up with that?
Idiots like Adrian Martinez and Mike Reedy... But what do those guys know anyhow right?...
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:03 PM   #9
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I understand that some people actually like to work on cars and tinker with it. That's great, to each his own.

My desire is to race (drive) against other racers (drivers). Unfortunately, I'm forced to work on the car also. I would prefer somesort of racing where the machine is taken out of the equation and it could be driver only.

As far as I'm concerned all the work that goes into this hobby is a neccesary evil.

If I had unlimited funds, I would simply pay somebody to suppy me with a car and work on it and maintain it and I would drive it.

At the same time it is somewhat satisfying to be capable of doing to whole thing, but it gets old. I used to like to change the oil in my car (real car) when I was 18, but now it's simply a chore...a neccesary evil.
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:11 PM   #10
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Brushless removes motor tuning from the equation, and then makes the HP war even MORE about batteries. It also adds the new wrinkle of "ESC wars". Motor tuning has always been a part of the sport. I can tell you that alot of PROS do ALL of their work. At some major events a motor man shows up to handle the motor work in order to allow their drivers to focus on chassis tuning and driving, but at the club level they still do it all.

I want to control my power package and the tuning aspects of my car, I don't want the end result dictated by a speed control/BL motor manufacturer. If you wanna run a SPEC class, run T-SPEC. Don't ruin the upper echelon of racing just to make the uncompetitive feel better.
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:12 PM   #11
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The market place has told the manufacturers that the customer of today is LAZY.
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:17 PM   #12
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I agree. As a shop owner I see it every day. A large persentage of the customers want insant gratification. They want to pull a RTR out of the box and run as good as a guy that has spent hours building a kit and tuning motors and when the RTR doesn't do that the come in complaining that the car is crap. We resently stopped our repair service and when you tell someone that they get pissed as if it was there car that they drive to work. I try to explain that this is a HOBBY and that part of the fun or the challenge is finding out what the problem is fixing it so that the next time you will know how to take care of it. Also if you tell a customer that they may have to fabricate a part they look at you like you are crazy.

Don't get me wrong I will help anyone out and guide them in the right direction so that they can go out and have fun with this HOBBY, but bottom line is this is a HOBBY. I want this hobby to grow and continue to be fun for all involved, my concern is that if someone buys an RTR and it doesn't perform as expected that they will throw it in the corner and forget about it and I don't want that.

Just my two cents
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:18 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by GordonFreeman
I understand that some people actually like to work on cars and tinker with it. That's great, to each his own.

My desire is to race (drive) against other racers (drivers). Unfortunately, I'm forced to work on the car also. I would prefer somesort of racing where the machine is taken out of the equation and it could be driver only.

As far as I'm concerned all the work that goes into this hobby is a neccesary evil.

If I had unlimited funds, I would simply pay somebody to suppy me with a car and work on it and maintain it and I would drive it.

At the same time it is somewhat satisfying to be capable of doing to whole thing, but it gets old. I used to like to change the oil in my car (real car) when I was 18, but now it's simply a chore...a neccesary evil.
You then, are a prime candidate for T-Spec racing. It's a class designed for individuals who'd rather just run than tune and test.

I watched the T-Spec exhibition at the Indoor Champs, 8 of on-road racings best, and it was unfortunately very dull to watch. TC Mod on the other hand was incredibly exciting, why you ask? BECAUSE THE CARS WERE FAST, and the drivers had to actually drive them!

I don't wanna roll around a track with the throttle clamped, sawing the wheel back and forth. I want to have to finesse the car, and make it work.
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:18 PM   #14
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I'm waiting for my next kit to come with a World-Champs #800 so I can call him for questions on setup. Or, better yet, my own personal World Champ!!! That way I just have to drive it!!!
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:18 PM   #15
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here is what I find aggravating to this hobby... Ready to run kits...

Lets just pull all the traxxas rtr stickers off and put Sears LOBO stickers on them or Radioshack golden arrow...

How many times am I at the track and some older person is running their truck and it breaks and they come running into the guys at the hobby counter to fix it for them... if it wasnt a rtr kit, you would know how to fix it cause you built it. they would know it worked cause they built the diff... etc etc....

r/c isnt what it used to be. I remember my first rc10 metal tub car, my dad and me built it over a 3 day period and learned about the car, kids now buy a rtr, charge a battery, run it. if it stops moving, they have no clue, cause their only experience with it is charging a battery, and putting it in...

and another thing that pisses me off. reverse in races... marshalls run out to get a car unstuck only to get 1 foot from the car and it go in reverse, nevermind the marshal is in the way to go get your car and help you, you just made someone go help your car that didnt need help, when he could have gotten to the accident on the other corner faster...
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