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Old 12-27-2004, 08:56 PM   #16
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I like the idea, but realistically it will be hard to change. There are 4 cell cars out there right now, and they aren't that well received. Even the Corally 1/12 Assasin can use both 6 and 4 cells and isn't received that well. In most people's minds, there's already too many classes, so getting a new one even wheen it makes sence is hard. Hate to be a pessimist, but that's the reality.
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Old 12-27-2004, 09:52 PM   #17
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The 1/12th sedans are not well recieved because they are diffrent than what you are running now. They require an investment in new equipment. Running 4 cell in your current sedan requires no new stuff. That and they do look kinda goofy with the short bodies and big wheels...

Regarding chassis balance...For testing 4 cells just re tweak your car. Your shock collars will look goofy but it will get around fine. If you like it, most side battery cars most cars will have enough room to move at least the speedo if not the speedo and RX over to the batt side for balance.

CharlieO - I run Open Mod now with no trouble at all. However, like Mark said every major motor sport has limits imposed. Historically, every form of unlimited racing has self destructed...CanAm in the 70's, GTP in the 80's, Group C Rally. F1 was in crisis in the late 80's until they limited engines, chassis, aerodynamics and scores of other performance aids. In the end all the sanctioning bodies that have been proactive have prospered...NASCAR, F1, WRC, etc.

I do not recommend the classes running together. 4 cell will be a bit slower in Mod and quite a bit slower in 19T and Stock. I suggest trying it in practice and getting a few guys toghter to run your own class. If it takes off great. If not then thats fine too. Its just natural selection
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:08 PM   #18
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Default Heck, not many have embraced...

the brushless class. Novak has made a great brushless and no one is running them. I figured the 1/12 scale class would jump all over it, but I'm the only one running it at my track. Maybe it's because the Novak brushless speedo is still too big to fit into a 1/12 scale. I don't know. I do know lots of people are still waiting for their competition brushless promised sometime back. A brushless speedo the size of the GTX would help. I'm thinking of going back to brushed. I don't care to but my track is going to ROAR serious rules starting this year. I like the idea of going to 4 or even 5-cells. Five cells would be nice to help bring the costs down. Lets face it, not many new people at the race track these days. When I came back this year, I saw many of the same people there from 5 years ago.
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:09 PM   #19
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People don't see or want to admit that turnout is down at tracks around the country. I personally blame the expansion of foam tire racing and the cost of tires, and I see bringing down the cell count from 6 to 4 cells to be a great idea. 1/12th scale was dying...now 1/12th scale is amongst the fastest growing classes around the country. Why? Was there some magic chassis that came out? No. Did prices of kits drop to under $100? No. Racers simply began to realize that this was a viable and inexpensive alternative in comparison to sedan racing. With fewer cells, the cars would slow down meaning that cars wouldn't hit the wall as hard, would use up tires as quickly, motors and brushes would last longer, and competition would get closer. Charlie mentions a mabuchi class, but the problem there is that it's mispreceived as a beginner's class. If you go to 4 cells, you may even see more and more people running modified as well. Who knows, why not at least give it a try?
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:12 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by RC Driver Gary
People don't see or want to admit that turnout is down at tracks around the country. I personally blame the expansion of foam tire racing and the cost of tires, and I see bringing down the cell count from 6 to 4 cells to be a great idea. 1/12th scale was dying...now 1/12th scale is amongst the fastest growing classes around the country. Why? Was there some magic chassis that came out? No. Did prices of kits drop to under $100? No. Racers simply began to realize that this was a viable and inexpensive alternative in comparison to sedan racing. With fewer cells, the cars would slow down meaning that cars wouldn't hit the wall as hard, would use up tires as quickly, motors and brushes would last longer, and competition would get closer. Charlie mentions a mabuchi class, but the problem there is that it's mispreceived as a beginner's class. If you go to 4 cells, you may even see more and more people running modified as well. Who knows, why not at least give it a try?
70% of all statistics are made up on the spot...fast growing?
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:16 PM   #21
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At 4 local tracks so far this fall/winter, the largest class growth has been in 1/12th scale. The biggest drop has been in sedan classes, with foam taking the biggest hit.
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:18 PM   #22
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Default 4 cell 1/12 racing is huge at my...

track and the sedan class is dying. Only down to stock sedan now and most of the good drivers went to 1/12th class. Reason, it's cheaper! I have honesty considered it. 1/12 scale also seem to have less maintenance and parts to break. I love sedan, but 1/12 is looking appealing. Sedan also takes up so much prep time. No one seems to have much time in there hectic schedules these days.
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:21 PM   #23
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Don't get me wrong, I love 1/12 scale, but fastest growing? I guess maybe if you consider there are now 500 racers from 250...

Foam isn't the problem in racing. Try rubber where there 101 combinations.

Racing is suffering not because of cost but for other reasons.
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:21 PM   #24
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Derek - Thanks not really fair. You know how regional this hobby is. I talk to one LHS and they have 100 guys every Wednesday running Kyosho Mini-Z's. I talk to another and they are selling Mini-Z's below cost to dump them. Mini-T are huge in one place dead in another. You can say this about every class.

I see 1/12th making a come back in many areas around the country. Why? 1/12th is cheap, fast and hard to screw up...lol! Some guys have a hard time dealing with all the adjustments on a sedan. Heck, I know one paid full factory driver that dosn't trust himself to set his own gear mesh!
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:23 PM   #25
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Derek - Only one rubber combo...CS27GL baby ...lol!
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:28 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by AdrianM
Derek - Thanks not really fair. You know how regional this hobby is. I talk to one LHS and they have 100 guys every Wednesday running Kyosho Mini-Z's. I talk to another and they are selling Mini-Z's below cost to dump them. Mini-T are huge in one place dead in another. You can say this about every class.

I see 1/12th making a come back in many areas around the country. Why? 1/12th is cheap, fast and hard to screw up...lol! Some guys have a hard time dealing with all the adjustments on a sedan. Heck, I know one paid full factory driver that dosn't trust himself to set his own gear mesh!
I know. I said I love 1/12th, but the cycle of racing is simple. A class get popular and is dominated by pros then somebody says "hey I can win at this class because nobody is running it" that class becomes popular and then the factory driver dominate that.

It's why racing MTs is so popular right now. The factory drivers racing that will ruin it too. The "regular" guy wants to win.
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:29 PM   #27
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The thought that the old rubber tire/magic insert myth still exsists is just plain uneducated. Many tracks have gone to spec pre-mounted tires, and even those that don't, when was the last time a rubber tire company came out with any new tread or compound? It's been awhile. If people aren't running 27's, they're either running Sorex or Yokomo tires. And people have been using rubber tires long enough that they know what inserts to use when. Foam has increased cost and speeds. That increase in speed has meant that guys are hitting stuff harder, breaking more parts. I just want to know what you're afraid of to even give 4 cell a try?
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:33 PM   #28
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Gary I'm sure you know my stance on "spec tires" in racing and how they stopped tire development.

If you can't handle the speed that's okay.

I'm not for making rules and class because people don't want to take the time to learn to drive. If I'm not mistaken 1/12 scale is faster than mod sedan on the track. So it's not speed that kills.
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:44 PM   #29
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I'd say close to 19T. But compare that to what 6-cell 1/12th scale was. But it's not just the speed, it's the bang for the buck. Someone spends their hard earned race fee and can run for 5 minutes or 8. I don't know about you but more track time is better to me. Also the cost for a 4 cell pack is 20-40 less per pack than a 6-cell pack is a significant savings.

And Derek, I have no idea what your stance on spec tires is. I also have 0 problem handling more speed. One of my complaints locally is that modified classes are almost non-exsistant around here except for off road classes.
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:58 PM   #30
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Well not to pick or anything. But I wanted to comment on something I read awhile ago about what Derek said about rubber tires not advancing or coming out with new compounds because "we" (the usa racers) are stuck with a premount/spec tire for big races. So these companies don't get to test or advance new stuff. I would say that statement is untrue for the simple fact that these tires (most) are made in Japan (or asia) where there is an "open" tire rule. Therefore companies like Sorex can easily test new stuff if they so choose. USA is not Sorex's only customer. I just wanted to comment on that since Derek mentioned 101 combinations and lack of tire development. But tire/insert combo's only really applies to club races here.

Anyways, I also agree that foam isn't the reason as well. Northern and East Coast guys love foam.... Warmer climate places love Rubber.

I think turnouts are low due to exposure. Bring'n in new people is the main thing. Another thing around here is there are tooo many tracks and not enough racers. So everyone gets spread thin.

But back to 4cell Sedans... I'm just wondering or curious as to how chassis's would evolve. Just imagine.. the JRXS could have all its stuff mounted down center!!
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