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Old 03-11-2005, 02:53 PM   #271
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Default catch up

you had better hurry up dom were almost on page 10
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Old 03-11-2005, 03:00 PM   #272
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No doubt!

Also, I saw that your batts are in the middle position? That would have something to do with as well.

Dom
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Old 03-11-2005, 03:02 PM   #273
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Default batts

brians original set up was batts forward, so i moved them back and it helped a little, should i go all the way back??
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Old 03-11-2005, 03:46 PM   #274
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Default TQ vs Paragon

Yea, what Dom is saying: the amount of grip that Paragon produces in the rug is vastly different then what TQ does to the rug. Take a car that uses a fraction of traction on a front tire on a Paragon track and bring it to a TQ track... same car needed a lot more sauce on the front to make it steer. I know that this is probably not new news to anyone, but it's something to be vary aware of. The big thing is to get the balance right away for 8 minutes and then tweak from there. I know that I could not use side springs on a Paragon track, where it was manditory in Salem (TQ).

Rudedog- there is always something that I remember. Look tire split. Bigger split = more stable, smaller split = more aggressive.

Brian
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Old 03-12-2005, 12:57 AM   #275
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Slapmaster-

Rumor has it you liked all the color my car had. I think it adds character. Talk to you later.

"Red Rocket"

BTW You want to start distributung those T-Bars for me?

How about the Spur Gear?
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Old 03-12-2005, 10:57 PM   #276
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Default The 1 minute twitch

Brian,

Remember the 1 minute twitch that you experience at RC Plus? Or was it 30 secs twitch? And then the car pushes in the last minute? Apparently it is something that not only the spanker is experiencing, looks like the faster CRC are doing the same thing. Car is just evil to drive in the first minute, then it pushes in the last minute. Your theory on too much traction compound at the beginning and not enough mechanical grip at the end is definitely spot on. However, I really don't know how to cure the problem. Here is my setup.

BTW, TQ, track record and win again today. I'm on a roll! Or I'm having some real good luck lately.

pink/dbl pink...small tires, 1.78 rear
.020 fr springs
middle roll center
even caster shims
.075 t-bar, 2 screws on bar
green spring, 30wt oil
Losi hydra fluid (regular) on tubes
2 .020 side springs in each tube, .020 preloads
batts back
3.25 ride height all around
just a touch little over 1/2 TQ sauce on front, full rear

Wes surprisingly ran .018 front springs in the main and he finally got the handling back on his T-Force.

My cornering speed is real good, gives me a lot of confidence while I'm on the track. My back end is just planted, it's not going anywhere, but the first minute twitch and last minute fade is really something else. I want to say that I'm already used to driving with the twitch and fade, but I'm sure there is a better setup for an entire 8 mins. After talking to couple of guys (Ellis included), I'm beginning to think it just might be the characteristics of the track??? I really don't want to think that way, but I'm starting to question....

Your thoughts?

Dom
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Old 03-13-2005, 12:56 AM   #277
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Hi gang,

Great 1/12th thread ya got going here. Keep it up, it great to hear the healthy 1/12th chat.

Hey Brian, I just couldn't let this one go...

Quote:
When you say purple stuff in the side tubes, do you have the old Hyp tubes or the newer CRC copies of Hyp tubes?
CRC was the first to bring aluminum tubes to the mass market in 1997. I designed the current aluminum tube, with it's taper and bleed hole after being dis-satisfied with the plastic Bolink tube. We have made subtle changes to the tube to improve it over the years. It appears that the Hyp tube is a pure copy of our tube, shortened a bit. CEFX has copied the tube as well. Seeing how we have never seen Hyp tube, I can tell you we certainly didn't copy it.

Sorry to jump in... that copied thing just kinda hit a sore spot.

Frank
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Old 03-13-2005, 05:29 AM   #278
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Default 1 minute twitch

dom you are right on th money, that is the exact problem i have, i have made some changes last night to see if it will help, i'm off to hobbychamber, we should have a good turnout today, 1 week before nats.

Mr.Calandra didn't get a chance to say hello at the jan jam, i'm in pit 49 come say hello next week!!

later

rudy
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Old 03-13-2005, 10:13 AM   #279
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Default Flatery

Hey Frank- you know what they say, that copying is the sincerest form of flatery.... it just doesn't line the wallet very well. When you have something good, people will notice. I am aware that a few are after my diff trust kits. I feel that it is just too good of an idea to go unnoticed. What do you think of yours at this point?

Dom/Rudedog- think of the twitch in this way. If you put too much traction on the front end, it will be twitchy to drive; right? If you don't have enough mechanical front grip in the car, it will push. Now that you get both of these conditions in 8 minutes should tell you that the car is out of balance and that you are making it do some things that it doesn't want to do. So the answer should be to use less front traction and to put more mechanical grip into the car. I was able to get the car farely consistant at Salem start to finish, so I know that you can do it too.

Dom- you might go to 22/20 on the side springs, chrome or blue on the center spring, might add that 3rd spacer, 1/4" of front traction, 3/4 & 1 on the camber and toe out to suit the track needs.

What you are doing here, is making more off power steering, freeing up the rear end just a little and using less chemical traction to achieve a better balance then before. Give it a try.

Nice job, keep gettin' 'er done!
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Old 03-13-2005, 10:19 AM   #280
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Default Re: Flatery

Quote:
Originally posted by Slapmaster6000

Dom- you might go to 22/20 on the side springs, chrome or blue on the center spring, might add that 3rd spacer, 1/4" of front traction, 3/4 & 1 on the camber and toe out to suit the track needs.

That's my thought on the spring and spacer too. I'll try the 22/20 springs.

As much as we both love driving gas cars outdoor, I wish I have a few more club races left, seems like I'm just starting to comes to term with the car and making progress.

Brian, I also emailed you earlier about something else.

Dom
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Old 03-13-2005, 12:16 PM   #281
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Sounds like you've been having a great week Dom keep it up.

Justin
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Old 03-14-2005, 10:31 AM   #282
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Dom, all

I have experienced the twitch thing with all of my 12th cars. I find if I can really wipe down my front tires well before the race the twitchy is reduce greatly. Just giving them a quick wipe with a towel doesn't work that well, I spend nearl 2 full minutes on the front tires alone. I also fond that cleaning my tires with motor spray helps to keep the grip for longer in the race.

Chris.
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Old 03-14-2005, 01:01 PM   #283
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Yea I heard motor spray works but I heard from a friend that some people use lighter fluid on there foams to take out the compound so it would work as if it were brand new, never tried it though.
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Old 03-14-2005, 01:17 PM   #284
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Default LIGHTER FLUID

i used the lighter fluid trick this weekend, went to a lighter damper tube fluid, and the twitch went away!!! now if i could just find a cure for backmarkers!!!! my white rag is now black from all of the residue off the tires. also cured the heavy pivot i was experiencing.
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Old 03-14-2005, 01:22 PM   #285
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Dom and the twitches. I know the feeling oh so well at Salem. My best efforts on that track come with a great deal of cleaning the fronts with motor cleaner, then laying on a good dose of TQ for 25% of the inside edge. A previous note made mention of this. After much battle with my bloody Bloody Knife, I cracked my 50 lap thresh hold by two laps and missed a 53 by 0.23 or summut. This took a gold spring and 80 wt on the Silver shock. The back end was brill like this. The main revalation was with the tyre washing and the increased consistancy, came the fact that 10 degree blocks threw on too much caster gain in all corners. Uncle Chad suggested a couple of degs extra toe out ta boot and that was a plesant suprise. Felt like turn in was mitigated for the first half, but then weight transfered and camber gained and whoops, there we go twitching again.

Super cleaning the tyres though, is my way out of this pit. Can't wait to see Dom burning his tyres !!

Mostly, I have to work on my own body twitches more than anything else.

Jacko
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