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Old 10-18-2011, 05:19 AM   #31
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the reason why I run WGT for my second class these days rather than running two classes of 1/12th scale is completely based on the fact that WGT uses spec tires. With that car, I don't need to worry about bringing multiple types of tires or about trying to find the tire combo that works best. In WGT, you just run the legal tires and tune around them as best you can. Honestly, taking the tire selection out of the equasion for WGT has been a very good thing, and probably a primary reason for the popularity of the class. The WGT's spec tires save alot in terms of expense and also stress. For the faster classes, I doubt that a spec tire would work in 1/12th scale because the cars are much more demanding, more fussy about their tires, and much harder to set up. But for the slowest of the 12th scale class, a spec tire rule just might be worth considering. Those who want to push the envelope harder can always choose run prostock or mod. And those who prefer lower cost and lower stress just might appreciate a spec tire rule. After all, just like all other types of race cars, tires are typically the biggest operating expense.
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Old 10-18-2011, 09:04 AM   #32
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I stepped aside from racing a few years ago after running 1/12 stock and TC. When I returned four years ago I decided to run in the new WGT class. The reason was spec tires. Where these tires do not give the perfect combination what they do is teach you chassis tuning. The car must be adjusted to changing track conditions just like it is done in most of the big car racing series in the world. NASCAR (all series), IndyCar, F1 and Rolex Series all have at most two and usually only one tire choice. That is done to save dollars to the teams.
I would limit the spec tires to the 17.5 blinky class and if you wanted to add the option of tire tuning, move up to 13.5 open ESC.
If you want 1/12 scale to grow, I believe this would be a smart choice.
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Old 10-18-2011, 11:50 AM   #33
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1/12 is not like 1/10 TC.

1/12 tires are about $10/pr vs. TC about $40/set of four

For the cost of one set of TC tires you could have 4 pairs of 1/12 tires each pair with one shore harder and one shore softer for both front and rear to tune to the track condtion.

Control tires are great for classes like TC where costs are rather high but for 1/12 which can be half the cost of running TC, the costs are minimal.

Someone already suggested this before so I'll reiterate. Have everyone run a minimum "spec" tire diameter and the problems of cost and unfair advantage all goes away.
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Old 10-18-2011, 12:40 PM   #34
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At our track a set of Sweeps is about $25 (4 tires). To put a set of front and rears on a 1/12 cost about $20. Typically they true the 1/12 tires down so low that they may not get the day out of a set for the guys trying to be the fastest at club races.
I get two weeks out of my WGT fronts and about 3 out of the rears. I am one of the faster guys in WGT at the track.

Just what happens.
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Old 10-18-2011, 02:30 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by old_dude View Post
At our track a set of Sweeps is about $25 (4 tires). To put a set of front and rears on a 1/12 cost about $20. Typically they true the 1/12 tires down so low that they may not get the day out of a set for the guys trying to be the fastest at club races.
I get two weeks out of my WGT fronts and about 3 out of the rears. I am one of the faster guys in WGT at the track.

Just what happens.
Pan car racers will cut any tire down if they think it is faster, makes no difference whether it's WGT, F1 or 12th scale, so moot point.

I like WGT racing, and I like the spec tire for that class.

Leave 12th scale alone, it IS growing in case you haven't noticed, it IS also MUCH more popular than WGT, pehaps not at your track, but in general, and at the iic it is.

If you have a favorite "spec" tire that YOU want to run, go for it, why ruin it for everyone else, that is already participating in this class, and enjoying it the way it is ?
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Old 10-18-2011, 05:08 PM   #36
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sorry, I'll pass on that one. When I go to big events, I take 4 different tires for stock... Orange and black as primaries, yellow and lilac as back-up. Not as many back-ups as primaries. Does this mean that I would want to make it a spec? NO. Open tires. The only thing that should be spec is esc/motor. Grow a set and figure out how to tune the chassis.
Hey tim, you know we have raced eachother quite a few times over the years. I can assure you that it is not tires keeping you out of the main. Granted, it is my driving as well, but wouldn't a spec tire do just what you have told me to do and learn how to adapt the chassis to a particular set of circumstances?
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Old 10-18-2011, 11:38 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by vafactor View Post
the reason why I run WGT for my second class these days rather than running two classes of 1/12th scale is completely based on the fact that WGT uses spec tires. With that car, I don't need to worry about bringing multiple types of tires or about trying to find the tire combo that works best. In WGT, you just run the legal tires and tune around them as best you can. Honestly, taking the tire selection out of the equasion for WGT has been a very good thing, and probably a primary reason for the popularity of the class. The WGT's spec tires save alot in terms of expense and also stress. For the faster classes, I doubt that a spec tire would work in 1/12th scale because the cars are much more demanding, more fussy about their tires, and much harder to set up. But for the slowest of the 12th scale class, a spec tire rule just might be worth considering. Those who want to push the envelope harder can always choose run prostock or mod. And those who prefer lower cost and lower stress just might appreciate a spec tire rule. After all, just like all other types of race cars, tires are typically the biggest operating expense.

Thank you for saying what I was thinking!
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Old 10-18-2011, 11:41 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by old_dude View Post
I stepped aside from racing a few years ago after running 1/12 stock and TC. When I returned four years ago I decided to run in the new WGT class. The reason was spec tires. Where these tires do not give the perfect combination what they do is teach you chassis tuning. The car must be adjusted to changing track conditions just like it is done in most of the big car racing series in the world. NASCAR (all series), IndyCar, F1 and Rolex Series all have at most two and usually only one tire choice. That is done to save dollars to the teams.
I would limit the spec tires to the 17.5 blinky class and if you wanted to add the option of tire tuning, move up to 13.5 open ESC.
If you want 1/12 scale to grow, I believe this would be a smart choice.
Also thank you for saying what I was thinking!
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Old 10-19-2011, 12:14 AM   #39
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I do think they should leave Mod 12th scale alone, period! Dont get me wrong. If you keep a open mind about making a totally stock 12th scale class, speck tires would be pretty cool. I think with a non-ramped 17.5 class speck tires will handle just fine. Heck it might even be funny to see everyone trying to push there limits at driving. 12th scale has died at my track because of a bunch of bull $**t with guys who want to go Mod and guys who want to keep it 17.5. I'm stuck in the middle and just want to run period, whatever they decide. The classes that have seemed to take off have some kind of rules and specs. FWD class is 17.5 Cirtrix esc combo cars all are running on the same laps and its all about the driving and gears. Mini's and WGT have there rules and are going strong. So I'm not trying to start anything or even make the spec tire rule offical. I was just trying to say before it's interesting and something to think about for the future maybe.
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Old 10-19-2011, 12:21 AM   #40
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Okay, here's my two cents. There are already PLENTY of classes with Spec tires. In TC there's VTA, USGT, and most clubs seem to allow only two to three different pre-mounted brands. We pan car racers have WGT. I'm still not sure why everyone feels the need to spec EVERYTHING.

There aren't that many tire combos available that actually work, and in order to be competitive, you have to run them small. WGT is a larger, far more forgiving car. This allows for a larger sweet spot in the set-up. A smaller, lighter, twitchier 12th scaler really needs to have tires suited to driver preference, and set-up.

As has been stated by some very wise folks in this thread, 12th scale is growing. Let's not spec all the fun out of it.
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Old 10-19-2011, 12:56 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by CypressMidWest View Post
Okay, here's my two cents. There are already PLENTY of classes with Spec tires. In TC there's VTA, USGT, and most clubs seem to allow only two to three different pre-mounted brands. We pan car racers have WGT. I'm still not sure why everyone feels the need to spec EVERYTHING.

There aren't that many tire combos available that actually work, and in order to be competitive, you have to run them small. WGT is a larger, far more forgiving car. This allows for a larger sweet spot in the set-up. A smaller, lighter, twitchier 12th scaler really needs to have tires suited to driver preference, and set-up.

As has been stated by some very wise folks in this thread, 12th scale is growing. Let's not spec all the fun out of it.
+1

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Old 10-19-2011, 02:05 AM   #42
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I do think they should leave Mod 12th scale alone, period! Dont get me wrong. If you keep a open mind about making a totally stock 12th scale class, speck tires would be pretty cool. I think with a non-ramped 17.5 class speck tires will handle just fine. Heck it might even be funny to see everyone trying to push there limits at driving. 12th scale has died at my track because of a bunch of bull $**t with guys who want to go Mod and guys who want to keep it 17.5. I'm stuck in the middle and just want to run period, whatever they decide. The classes that have seemed to take off have some kind of rules and specs. FWD class is 17.5 Cirtrix esc combo cars all are running on the same laps and its all about the driving and gears. Mini's and WGT have there rules and are going strong. So I'm not trying to start anything or even make the spec tire rule offical. I was just trying to say before it's interesting and something to think about for the future maybe.
Hey Josh just started a thread for positive 12th scale stuff
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Old 10-19-2011, 06:11 AM   #43
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I just heard a new one. Some 1/12 racers were discussing the differences between two manufacturers of the mounted tires. It seems there is a different offset and they were discussing the handling benefits. Now you need two complete sets of each compound to tune.
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Old 10-19-2011, 07:15 AM   #44
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I remember about 10 years ago when we had to run the P35 protoform body that was the only body that worked. Pretty much we all ran the same tire Purple Front and Grey rear in stock class. No body complained then about everyone one running the same tire because you still had a choice to run something different.

I say Mod or 13.5 anything goes tire wise. Run spec for stock class so a new guy just had to buy one type of tire. Also the Manufacturer and the Distributers don't have to try to keep in stock the tire of the month and carry only what they know will sale.

My 2 cents.

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Old 10-19-2011, 07:19 AM   #45
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Every big TC race has a spec tire for all classes.

Most clubs run a spec tire in TC.

So that argument carries no weight.
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