1LikesXray T3 2012
09-10-2012, 05:32 PM
#3691
Tech Regular
Originally Posted by NolanP
Most people I have known just use a little sand paper.
09-10-2012, 05:37 PM
#3693
Tech Regular
Originally Posted by NolanP
gotcha. well good luck on the hunt.
09-10-2012, 05:47 PM
#3694
Originally Posted by FLAT OUT
What made you retire the T3 2012 for a Hotbodies TCXX ??
09-11-2012, 05:55 AM
#3695
Hi guys need some info I,ve got a t3 12 cant seem to get max throw on a right turn with savox servo and 4pk end point max out to 120% with 1.5 mm before touching c-hub,other side 97% Ive had two t3 12 and had a short break with other brand. can't rember having this problem before I don't think I had a savox servo in the t3 12 but that should not matter as the control sets end points its like the control ran out of end point adjustment????
09-11-2012, 07:35 AM
#3696
Try a longer servo horn?
09-11-2012, 07:37 AM
#3697
Originally Posted by P.I.M.P
Hi guys need some info I,ve got a t3 12 cant seem to get max throw on a right turn with savox servo and 4pk end point max out to 120% with 1.5 mm before touching c-hub,other side 97% Ive had two t3 12 and had a short break with other brand. can't rember having this problem before I don't think I had a savox servo in the t3 12 but that should not matter as the control sets end points its like the control ran out of end point adjustment????
09-11-2012, 10:50 AM
#3698
It seems like this is comes up from time to time. I know is was talked about in the '11 thread a bit as well.
I followed the direction and example of others and had the servo horn mounted straight up and down with the servo trims and centered. I had to use sub trim to get it stright up and down due to the servo splines.
I then adjusted the endpoints to get to max mechanical throw and raced. Something always seemd a bit off. The car would behave a bit different one way than it did the other.
I started to look into this and found that while I had the same deflection in both directions (max throw), the end points in my radio were more than 30 points away from each other. I don't know a bunch about radios but if there is more throw one way than the other, that seems to me that the car would steer one way differently than the other.
I looked online and found a great techique to use to get your endpoints the same and even travel left to right. Since doing this, my cars drive much better. Basically, for me, the relationship of the draglink and the horn need to be 90 degrees, not the horn and the chasis. That way the arc that the horn travels is perfectly symetrical from left to right.
It is complecated but not too much so. PM me and I can send you the procedure I use.
I followed the direction and example of others and had the servo horn mounted straight up and down with the servo trims and centered. I had to use sub trim to get it stright up and down due to the servo splines.
I then adjusted the endpoints to get to max mechanical throw and raced. Something always seemd a bit off. The car would behave a bit different one way than it did the other.
I started to look into this and found that while I had the same deflection in both directions (max throw), the end points in my radio were more than 30 points away from each other. I don't know a bunch about radios but if there is more throw one way than the other, that seems to me that the car would steer one way differently than the other.
I looked online and found a great techique to use to get your endpoints the same and even travel left to right. Since doing this, my cars drive much better. Basically, for me, the relationship of the draglink and the horn need to be 90 degrees, not the horn and the chasis. That way the arc that the horn travels is perfectly symetrical from left to right.
It is complecated but not too much so. PM me and I can send you the procedure I use.
09-11-2012, 10:53 AM
#3699
Originally Posted by Mera'din
It seems like this is comes up from time to time. I know is was talked about in the '11 thread a bit as well.
I followed the direction and example of others and had the servo horn mounted straight up and down with the servo trims and centered. I had to use sub trim to get it stright up and down due to the servo splines.
I then adjusted the endpoints to get to max mechanical throw and raced. Something always seemd a bit off. The car would behave a bit different one way than it did the other.
I started to look into this and found that while I had the same deflection in both directions (max throw), the end points in my radio were more than 30 points away from each other. I don't know a bunch about radios but if there is more throw one way than the other, that seems to me that the car would steer one way differently than the other.
I looked online and found a great techique to use to get your endpoints the same and even travel left to right. Since doing this, my cars drive much better. Basically, for me, the relationship of the draglink and the horn need to be 90 degrees, not the horn and the chasis. That way the arc that the horn travels is perfectly symetrical from left to right.
It is complecated but not too much so. PM me and I can send you the procedure I use.
I followed the direction and example of others and had the servo horn mounted straight up and down with the servo trims and centered. I had to use sub trim to get it stright up and down due to the servo splines.
I then adjusted the endpoints to get to max mechanical throw and raced. Something always seemd a bit off. The car would behave a bit different one way than it did the other.
I started to look into this and found that while I had the same deflection in both directions (max throw), the end points in my radio were more than 30 points away from each other. I don't know a bunch about radios but if there is more throw one way than the other, that seems to me that the car would steer one way differently than the other.
I looked online and found a great techique to use to get your endpoints the same and even travel left to right. Since doing this, my cars drive much better. Basically, for me, the relationship of the draglink and the horn need to be 90 degrees, not the horn and the chasis. That way the arc that the horn travels is perfectly symetrical from left to right.
It is complecated but not too much so. PM me and I can send you the procedure I use.
Then I tried mounting the servo saver 90* from the link, which means it tilts towards the center of the car, and I was able to take out the subtrim and the L and R EPA's are now only 2% apart.
I had to use a shorter turnbuckle to make it work.
09-11-2012, 11:05 AM
#3700
Originally Posted by Mera'din
It seems like this is comes up from time to time. I know is was talked about in the '11 thread a bit as well.
I followed the direction and example of others and had the servo horn mounted straight up and down with the servo trims and centered. I had to use sub trim to get it stright up and down due to the servo splines.
I then adjusted the endpoints to get to max mechanical throw and raced. Something always seemd a bit off. The car would behave a bit different one way than it did the other.
I started to look into this and found that while I had the same deflection in both directions (max throw), the end points in my radio were more than 30 points away from each other. I don't know a bunch about radios but if there is more throw one way than the other, that seems to me that the car would steer one way differently than the other.
I looked online and found a great techique to use to get your endpoints the same and even travel left to right. Since doing this, my cars drive much better. Basically, for me, the relationship of the draglink and the horn need to be 90 degrees, not the horn and the chasis. That way the arc that the horn travels is perfectly symetrical from left to right.
It is complecated but not too much so. PM me and I can send you the procedure I use.
I followed the direction and example of others and had the servo horn mounted straight up and down with the servo trims and centered. I had to use sub trim to get it stright up and down due to the servo splines.
I then adjusted the endpoints to get to max mechanical throw and raced. Something always seemd a bit off. The car would behave a bit different one way than it did the other.
I started to look into this and found that while I had the same deflection in both directions (max throw), the end points in my radio were more than 30 points away from each other. I don't know a bunch about radios but if there is more throw one way than the other, that seems to me that the car would steer one way differently than the other.
I looked online and found a great techique to use to get your endpoints the same and even travel left to right. Since doing this, my cars drive much better. Basically, for me, the relationship of the draglink and the horn need to be 90 degrees, not the horn and the chasis. That way the arc that the horn travels is perfectly symetrical from left to right.
It is complecated but not too much so. PM me and I can send you the procedure I use.
09-11-2012, 07:40 PM
#3701
Here is what I do. After performing the procedure below my steering seemed much more connected and linear from right to left. I have used this on all of my cars and it helped each one. The procedure is tedious but worth it. Many people will tell you that just make the arm 90 degrees to the chassis, I politely disagree. Do this instead...
You just need to adjust the sub-trim and link length to make the end point values equal. If you have a higher endpoint value turning right shorten the link and adjust the sub-trim so the vehicle tracks straight. If you have a higher endpoint value turning left lengthen the link and re adjust subtrim so the vehicle tracks straight. It takes a little time to get right, but it all centers around having the proper angle between the servo saver arm and angle and length of the link connecting to the bellcrank.
You don't want the ball stud on the servo saver directly above the servo output. You need a 90 degree angle between the link and the servo output shaft/ballstud line. On rare occasions I have had to move the servo saver over a spline to get it to adjust without a crazy amount of sub trim. It is tedious but in the end, if done correctly you will have equal end points, the smallest possible sub trim, an angle close to 90 between the link and the output shaft/ball stud line, and even steering response right to left. Having a set of setup stands helps a ton.
Hope this helps! Express was the first to point me in this direction. All credit goes to him.
You just need to adjust the sub-trim and link length to make the end point values equal. If you have a higher endpoint value turning right shorten the link and adjust the sub-trim so the vehicle tracks straight. If you have a higher endpoint value turning left lengthen the link and re adjust subtrim so the vehicle tracks straight. It takes a little time to get right, but it all centers around having the proper angle between the servo saver arm and angle and length of the link connecting to the bellcrank.
You don't want the ball stud on the servo saver directly above the servo output. You need a 90 degree angle between the link and the servo output shaft/ballstud line. On rare occasions I have had to move the servo saver over a spline to get it to adjust without a crazy amount of sub trim. It is tedious but in the end, if done correctly you will have equal end points, the smallest possible sub trim, an angle close to 90 between the link and the output shaft/ball stud line, and even steering response right to left. Having a set of setup stands helps a ton.
Hope this helps! Express was the first to point me in this direction. All credit goes to him.
09-11-2012, 09:17 PM
#3702
Originally Posted by Mera'din
Here is what I do. After performing the procedure below my steering seemed much more connected and linear from right to left. I have used this on all of my cars and it helped each one. The procedure is tedious but worth it. Many people will tell you that just make the arm 90 degrees to the chassis, I politely disagree. Do this instead...
You just need to adjust the sub-trim and link length to make the end point values equal. If you have a higher endpoint value turning right shorten the link and adjust the sub-trim so the vehicle tracks straight. If you have a higher endpoint value turning left lengthen the link and re adjust subtrim so the vehicle tracks straight. It takes a little time to get right, but it all centers around having the proper angle between the servo saver arm and angle and length of the link connecting to the bellcrank.
You don't want the ball stud on the servo saver directly above the servo output. You need a 90 degree angle between the link and the servo output shaft/ballstud line. On rare occasions I have had to move the servo saver over a spline to get it to adjust without a crazy amount of sub trim. It is tedious but in the end, if done correctly you will have equal end points, the smallest possible sub trim, an angle close to 90 between the link and the output shaft/ball stud line, and even steering response right to left. Having a set of setup stands helps a ton.
Hope this helps! Express was the first to point me in this direction. All credit goes to him.
You just need to adjust the sub-trim and link length to make the end point values equal. If you have a higher endpoint value turning right shorten the link and adjust the sub-trim so the vehicle tracks straight. If you have a higher endpoint value turning left lengthen the link and re adjust subtrim so the vehicle tracks straight. It takes a little time to get right, but it all centers around having the proper angle between the servo saver arm and angle and length of the link connecting to the bellcrank.
You don't want the ball stud on the servo saver directly above the servo output. You need a 90 degree angle between the link and the servo output shaft/ballstud line. On rare occasions I have had to move the servo saver over a spline to get it to adjust without a crazy amount of sub trim. It is tedious but in the end, if done correctly you will have equal end points, the smallest possible sub trim, an angle close to 90 between the link and the output shaft/ball stud line, and even steering response right to left. Having a set of setup stands helps a ton.
Hope this helps! Express was the first to point me in this direction. All credit goes to him.
09-11-2012, 09:53 PM
#3703
Tech Master
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Originally Posted by Mera'din
Here is what I do. After performing the procedure below my steering seemed much more connected and linear from right to left. I have used this on all of my cars and it helped each one. The procedure is tedious but worth it. Many people will tell you that just make the arm 90 degrees to the chassis, I politely disagree. Do this instead...
You just need to adjust the sub-trim and link length to make the end point values equal. If you have a higher endpoint value turning right shorten the link and adjust the sub-trim so the vehicle tracks straight. If you have a higher endpoint value turning left lengthen the link and re adjust subtrim so the vehicle tracks straight. It takes a little time to get right, but it all centers around having the proper angle between the servo saver arm and angle and length of the link connecting to the bellcrank.
You don't want the ball stud on the servo saver directly above the servo output. You need a 90 degree angle between the link and the servo output shaft/ballstud line. On rare occasions I have had to move the servo saver over a spline to get it to adjust without a crazy amount of sub trim. It is tedious but in the end, if done correctly you will have equal end points, the smallest possible sub trim, an angle close to 90 between the link and the output shaft/ball stud line, and even steering response right to left. Having a set of setup stands helps a ton.
Hope this helps! Express was the first to point me in this direction. All credit goes to him.
You just need to adjust the sub-trim and link length to make the end point values equal. If you have a higher endpoint value turning right shorten the link and adjust the sub-trim so the vehicle tracks straight. If you have a higher endpoint value turning left lengthen the link and re adjust subtrim so the vehicle tracks straight. It takes a little time to get right, but it all centers around having the proper angle between the servo saver arm and angle and length of the link connecting to the bellcrank.
You don't want the ball stud on the servo saver directly above the servo output. You need a 90 degree angle between the link and the servo output shaft/ballstud line. On rare occasions I have had to move the servo saver over a spline to get it to adjust without a crazy amount of sub trim. It is tedious but in the end, if done correctly you will have equal end points, the smallest possible sub trim, an angle close to 90 between the link and the output shaft/ball stud line, and even steering response right to left. Having a set of setup stands helps a ton.
Hope this helps! Express was the first to point me in this direction. All credit goes to him.
09-12-2012, 02:39 AM
#3704
Originally Posted by Mera'din
Many people will tell you that just make the arm 90 degrees to the chassis, I politely disagree. Do this instead...
......You don't want the ball stud on the servo saver directly above the servo output. You need a 90 degree angle between the link and the servo output shaft/ballstud line. On rare occasions I have had to move the servo saver over a spline to get it to adjust without a crazy amount of sub trim. It is tedious but in the end, if done correctly you will have equal end points, the smallest possible sub trim, an angle close to 90 between the link and the output shaft/ball stud line, and even steering response right to left. Having a set of setup stands helps a ton.
......You don't want the ball stud on the servo saver directly above the servo output. You need a 90 degree angle between the link and the servo output shaft/ballstud line. On rare occasions I have had to move the servo saver over a spline to get it to adjust without a crazy amount of sub trim. It is tedious but in the end, if done correctly you will have equal end points, the smallest possible sub trim, an angle close to 90 between the link and the output shaft/ball stud line, and even steering response right to left. Having a set of setup stands helps a ton.
If it's 90deg to the chassis, the link will level off in both directions as you approach full lock.
Although you might have similar end points, you could well find that the speed of the steering is different each way near the end of throw. This is the reason a vertical servo saver is recommended.
If you have to use a lot of subtrim to get the servo saver in either position, you need to change the position on the spline, or change the position of the spline adapter in the servo saver.
I kept moving mine around then trying it again, took about 10 changes of position, but eventually, I got the saver 1 click from vertical.
If you have to have a large difference in trims left to right when the saver is vertical there is another problem.
Check the links from the ackermann plate to the steering knuckles are the same length, if there is any difference, that will effect the throw each way.
Skiddins
09-12-2012, 08:41 AM
#3705
Originally Posted by Skiddins
The trouble with having the saver at 90deg to the link, not the chassis, is that when you turn left, the link will raise up as the ackermann plate moves to the right of the chassis. As you turn right the link will drop as the ackermann plate moves left.
If it's 90deg to the chassis, the link will level off in both directions as you approach full lock.
Although you might have similar end points, you could well find that the speed of the steering is different each way near the end of throw. This is the reason a vertical servo saver is recommended.
If you have to use a lot of subtrim to get the servo saver in either position, you need to change the position on the spline, or change the position of the spline adapter in the servo saver.
I kept moving mine around then trying it again, took about 10 changes of position, but eventually, I got the saver 1 click from vertical.
If you have to have a large difference in trims left to right when the saver is vertical there is another problem.
Check the links from the ackermann plate to the steering knuckles are the same length, if there is any difference, that will effect the throw each way.
Skiddins
If it's 90deg to the chassis, the link will level off in both directions as you approach full lock.
Although you might have similar end points, you could well find that the speed of the steering is different each way near the end of throw. This is the reason a vertical servo saver is recommended.
If you have to use a lot of subtrim to get the servo saver in either position, you need to change the position on the spline, or change the position of the spline adapter in the servo saver.
I kept moving mine around then trying it again, took about 10 changes of position, but eventually, I got the saver 1 click from vertical.
If you have to have a large difference in trims left to right when the saver is vertical there is another problem.
Check the links from the ackermann plate to the steering knuckles are the same length, if there is any difference, that will effect the throw each way.
Skiddins
As I said before, I get the pro and cons for each way of doing this, and if I didn't make that clear, here goes...
I am not intending to say which way is right or wrong, only that this is what worked for me.
In my head, the 90 degree to the chasis should work out. You use the subtrim to center the horn, and set endpoints for max throw left to right. This should work if and only if both endpoints have the same points of resolution left to right.
Looking at the endpoint values isn't enough and doesn't paint the entire picture of what is happening as the horn travels on it's arc. If your enpoints are -36L and 84R you would think HOLY CRAP my car drives crazy. But if I then added that the subtrim is at 24, you would realize that there are still 60 steps of resolution left to right.
This makes sense in my head and it should work out on the car when setup with a 90 degree relationship to the chasis. If you had -36L and 84R with a subtrim that didn't give you equal steps left to right I would be concerned.
This was where my car was at. I didn't and the car drove...funny and unpredicatable. I followed the steps above and the car drives true..for me. Others may disagree. Try it if you are having difficulty. if your car is dialed, then don't mess with it!
