Originally Posted by Bob-Stormer

I think it should start at 45. and keep raising it until the winner is 2 laps off the regular class winners pace.

Age is a lousy indicator of skill level.

Looks to me like the rules are posted. Don't like it, don't go. If the event turns out big, you were wrong and missed out on some great fun. If it turns out poorly attended, whoever put the classes together missed the mark.

I'd be for a class where I didn't have to work as hard, but still got the track time. Something like Leave your car in cardboard box in the track room, and pull it out and toss it on the track for your heat. Toss it back in the box. If you break, you're done, you sit in the bar the rest of the weekend and talk about how fast we all used to be.

I will say this. ALWAYS, when I help setup what I call "different" classes, it's based around fun. And they are always well participated in. If nobody's having fun, that's the killer. And I keep things slow. There's no need for a 7 lap gap in a main event. Figure out how to write the rules so it's 2 laps or less and you'll have 10 drivers having fun and battling, not 2. better racing, closer action. All of us here have great storys about that ONE particular race, the one epic battle where it makes the hair on your arms stand up just to think about it because the racing was so close that it was epic! Even though were racing for 5th and 6th in the C, makes no difference. Where you get off the drivers stand high fiving each other and laughing, shaking hands, and slapping each other on the back. Sometimes, it's somebody you don't even know. All anybody wants is the "perception" of a fair shot, and to have a good time.

It would seem that the majority of racers we race with perceive "blinky" to be more fair. I do too. BUT, I must confess that it might also be because I don't have the time to put in to find THEE settings that work for me. It's not a Lazy thing, we're all busy, I'm just short on time like the rest of us. rarely do I have the right settings. and MAN, do I hate that. I feel like I've missed out on some secret meeting.

Really, all we did is change the magic of tuning brushed motors to tuning speedos. But at least with a motor dyno, you could enjoy the hobby at home, tune your junk and have it ready. Can't tune a speedo in your basement and test it. For most people you have to waste qualifiers doing it.

Since the advent of the brushless motors that were supposed to be the greatest equalizers EVER, we have never had a larger disparity in speed. And more confused people standing around scratching their heads.

If I could get to the track and just learn the layout, rather than learn what I don't know about tuning a speedo, I'd be happier more of the time.

Hence, the popularity of Blinky. Throwing a race without blinky is a ballsy move.

I'm here to tell ya, you want to see a pile of guys having a PILE of fun? Silver can 1/12th, 15 minute qualifiers. Motors are like 35 watts and perfect. I spent a few months one winter perfecting it as a class. NOT for the A-main guys who will declare it "stupid and slow", but for everybody else that wants to actually RACE! There is no speed number associated with the word RACE.

You can make faster classes, or you can have closer races, you can't have both.

Cleveland is kind of it's own Institution, like the Whip was. You go to be a part of the spectacle. And to get out of having to sit with your drunken Aunt Nancy, that smells mysteriously of urine, at the Thanksgiving table.

Originally Posted by cookie1

after going to the Halloween race and watching larry f. lap the field in 13.5 boost i realize the only races that were fun to watch were the Blinky classes. Heck for that matter 1/12th Mod was so fast that the field was so far apart in Mod that maybe its time to have blinky in Mod 1/12th.. Where is Bob Stormer when I need him! But to go to Blinky in all classes would require a bold move..we can't even get blinky in 17.5 or 13.5,,what am I thinking!

Originally Posted by chicky03

I watched some videos from 20+ years ago on YouTube and no wonder r/c was so popular, the cars were so slow any setup or car would get around the track decent! Driving came more into play.

Originally Posted by rayhuang

One of the best A mains I ever saw was Rice, Gerber and, and...crap cant remember his name, but can see his face at the Halloween classic. It was stock, not mod. It is like F1 where individual cars are so impressive to watch, but the speed and capabilities of the cars makes overtaking rare.

I just watched some of those vids recently and the cars stock guys are supposed to compete in are so fast. I hope the cars got stronger too or the walls softer (doubt it).

Originally Posted by Fred_B

I'm done. After getting the time off from work and getting new stuff built for Cleveland (including a new sedan) I'm done.

Pissed doesn't even begin to describe how I feel about the classes and race format. Not running the SAME STOCK RULES as the other big races is a complete JOKE. Add to that this lame idea of running one round of practice and I'm out.

Guess what? I for one need to have more practice laps to get the track down and hang on to a mod 12th car. We're not all factory drivers! So, one practice rules out mod. My next class would be stock. Guess what? You don't offer the same stock class that all of the other big races run.

I'm out on this one again. Not because of the time or the expense but because of the RACE!

Time to look at vacation time for Snowbirds. It's going to be warmer there anyway.

Pissed...

Originally Posted by cookie1

after going to the Halloween race and watching larry f. lap the field in 13.5 boost i realize the only races that were fun to watch were the Blinky classes. Heck for that matter 1/12th Mod was so fast that the field was so far apart in Mod that maybe its time to have blinky in Mod 1/12th.. Where is Bob Stormer when I need him! But to go to Blinky in all classes would require a bold move..we can't even get blinky in 17.5 or 13.5,,what am I thinking!

Originally Posted by vafactor

I've been attending the Cleveland indoor champs for over 25 years and have loved each and every trip to Ohio. IMO, it doesn't matter so much what classes are offered (boost vs blinky, brushed vs brushless). Both are fun. Typically it's the same guys who will be at the top anyway, regardless of which class, motor, or speedo type they are running. The reason......some guys have awesome skills that the rest of us just don't have. My comment about classes is that there are just too many of them these days. Running so many different classes tends to water down the numbers and therefore the competition in each. I fondly remember the glory days of Cleveland when there were only two classes........stock 1/12th and mod 1/12th. The entry list for both was huge and it was an awesome accomplishment just to make it into the feature race. In the early years, the stock heats went all the way down to the M, N, O, & P main. We now have sedans and WGT's in addition to our beloved 1/12th scale cars, so that will add a few more classes. But I see no reason why we need to be running so many different class choices in each scale. 1 slower class and 1 faster class for 1/12th and sedan should be sufficient, plus one or two special interest classes like WGT or F1. Whenever the entry list gets watered down to the point that there are only 2 or 3 heats in any given class, the competition becomes far less interesting. It's much more important to have big fields and lots of close competition from top to bottom. Whenever there are lots of guys running the same class, by the end of the weekend, whatever 10 guys show up for their main........they will all be closely matched and their individual races will be super intense. To me, that's the whole point of attending a major race.....to find yourself in a main with 9 other guys at your same skill level. And of course to try and place yourself as high up the heatboard as you can manage. Having said all that, LET'S PLAY!!!!! I love the indoor champs like no other race. That much has not changed one bit in over 25 years.

Originally Posted by vafactor

I've been attending the Cleveland indoor champs for over 25 years and have loved each and every trip to Ohio. IMO, it doesn't matter so much what classes are offered (boost vs blinky, brushed vs brushless). Both are fun. Typically it's the same guys who will be at the top anyway, regardless of which class, motor, or speedo type they are running. The reason......some guys have awesome skills that the rest of us just don't have. My comment about classes is that there are just too many of them these days. Running so many different classes tends to water down the numbers and therefore the competition in each. I fondly remember the glory days of Cleveland when there were only two classes........stock 1/12th and mod 1/12th. The entry list for both was huge and it was an awesome accomplishment just to make it into the feature race. In the early years, the stock heats went all the way down to the M, N, O, & P main. We now have sedans and WGT's in addition to our beloved 1/12th scale cars, so that will add a few more classes. But I see no reason why we need to be running so many different class choices in each scale. 1 slower class and 1 faster class for 1/12th and sedan should be sufficient, plus one or two special interest classes like WGT or F1. Whenever the entry list gets watered down to the point that there are only 2 or 3 heats in any given class, the competition becomes far less interesting. It's much more important to have big fields and lots of close competition from top to bottom. Whenever there are lots of guys running the same class, by the end of the weekend, whatever 10 guys show up for their main........they will all be closely matched and their individual races will be super intense. To me, that's the whole point of attending a major race.....to find yourself in a main with 9 other guys at your same skill level. And of course to try and place yourself as high up the heatboard as you can manage. Having said all that, LET'S PLAY!!!!! I love the indoor champs like no other race. That much has not changed one bit in over 25 years.

Originally Posted by Mike Blackstock

I love this post. My first race at the champs i was in the last main
( M OR N MAIN) of modified. The big guns were all marshalling my race. That was awesome.

I wish it was this easy. But with the mentality of everyone has to succeed ruined that and more classes were added so we could all make a Amain. Once this started people got used to it and the rest is history. Now they wont show up and race unless they have there class to succeed. I would rather make the B main in mod then win the stock A main back in the day. But that was just me..


Mike

Originally Posted by Mike Blackstock

I love this post. My first race at the champs i was in the last main
( M OR N MAIN) of modified. The big guns were all marshalling my race. That was awesome.

I wish it was this easy. But with the mentality of everyone has to succeed ruined that and more classes were added so we could all make a Amain. Once this started people got used to it and the rest is history. Now they wont show up and race unless they have there class to succeed. I would rather make the B main in mod then win the stock A main back in the day. But that was just me..

Mike

Originally Posted by HarryLeach

What is so horrible about running a class that is challenging to you, instead of sticking with what you feel comfortable with all the time?