shaft drive idea
06-26-2011, 01:50 PM
#1
shaft drive idea
if i put a slipper clutch in my shaft car will i still get torq stear.I was looking at thunder tigers Sparrowhawk XB it has a onroad chassis.
06-26-2011, 02:28 PM
#2
06-26-2011, 02:45 PM
#3
i guss for bashing then... will it help stop the torq. stear.If it will they should alow it to race
06-26-2011, 07:35 PM
#4
Torque steer is a myth designed to get everybody to switch from shaft drive to belt drive!!! All the cars I own are shaft drive, and I have never noticed such a problem ! It is all about the bottom line ! A slipper clutch is not necessary, and will only add rotational mass.....
06-26-2011, 09:49 PM
#5
Tech Adept
If you understand what causes torque steer you would see how belt or shaft would not affect it. Torque steer comes from having one axle being shorter than another, common on FWD cars with transverse engine/gearbox combos. The torque steer type effect of RC cars is usually due to the play in the suspension from ball links etc. My brothers HPI srpint 2 has a lot of it for some reason, but you can tell it is a geometry reason and not much to do with it being belt drive.
06-27-2011, 01:07 AM
#6
Wow, some awesome nonsense in this thread...
Torque steer exists in all shaft drive cars because of Newtons third law. With the armature mounted along the chassis, when you spin the armature, the chassis will rotate in the opposite direction to the armature, with equal momentum to that of the armature. Some of this will be counteracted by the propshaft assembly since this also rotates in the opposite direction to the armature. If you look at Associateds land speed record car, you'll see a flywheel on the propshaft to totally counteract the armature torque and give a neutral car.
With heavy, large diameter brushed armatures and powerful motors (i.e. lots of momentum in the armature) this was a total nightmare and made the cars difficult to drive, hence the death of shaft drive cars as motors got faster and faster.
With small diameter, lighter brushless armatures (rotors), especially in spec classes with low motor power, this torque steer effect is much less noticable. My girlfriend runs a 17.5 blinky shaft drive and I can't feel any torque steer effect. It definitely still exists as you can't ignore the laws of physics, but it isn't big enough to cause any problems.
The torque steer on FWDs due to unequal driveshafts is something totally different and not relevant to RC due to our cars being designed properly.
Torque steer exists in all shaft drive cars because of Newtons third law. With the armature mounted along the chassis, when you spin the armature, the chassis will rotate in the opposite direction to the armature, with equal momentum to that of the armature. Some of this will be counteracted by the propshaft assembly since this also rotates in the opposite direction to the armature. If you look at Associateds land speed record car, you'll see a flywheel on the propshaft to totally counteract the armature torque and give a neutral car.
With heavy, large diameter brushed armatures and powerful motors (i.e. lots of momentum in the armature) this was a total nightmare and made the cars difficult to drive, hence the death of shaft drive cars as motors got faster and faster.
With small diameter, lighter brushless armatures (rotors), especially in spec classes with low motor power, this torque steer effect is much less noticable. My girlfriend runs a 17.5 blinky shaft drive and I can't feel any torque steer effect. It definitely still exists as you can't ignore the laws of physics, but it isn't big enough to cause any problems.
The torque steer on FWDs due to unequal driveshafts is something totally different and not relevant to RC due to our cars being designed properly.
06-27-2011, 10:55 AM
#7
Tech Adept
Wow, some awesome nonsense in this thread...
Torque steer exists in all shaft drive cars because of Newtons third law. With the armature mounted along the chassis, when you spin the armature, the chassis will rotate in the opposite direction to the armature, with equal momentum to that of the armature. Some of this will be counteracted by the propshaft assembly since this also rotates in the opposite direction to the armature. If you look at Associateds land speed record car, you'll see a flywheel on the propshaft to totally counteract the armature torque and give a neutral car.
With heavy, large diameter brushed armatures and powerful motors (i.e. lots of momentum in the armature) this was a total nightmare and made the cars difficult to drive, hence the death of shaft drive cars as motors got faster and faster.
With small diameter, lighter brushless armatures (rotors), especially in spec classes with low motor power, this torque steer effect is much less noticable. My girlfriend runs a 17.5 blinky shaft drive and I can't feel any torque steer effect. It definitely still exists as you can't ignore the laws of physics, but it isn't big enough to cause any problems.
The torque steer on FWDs due to unequal driveshafts is something totally different and not relevant to RC due to our cars being designed properly.
Torque steer exists in all shaft drive cars because of Newtons third law. With the armature mounted along the chassis, when you spin the armature, the chassis will rotate in the opposite direction to the armature, with equal momentum to that of the armature. Some of this will be counteracted by the propshaft assembly since this also rotates in the opposite direction to the armature. If you look at Associateds land speed record car, you'll see a flywheel on the propshaft to totally counteract the armature torque and give a neutral car.
With heavy, large diameter brushed armatures and powerful motors (i.e. lots of momentum in the armature) this was a total nightmare and made the cars difficult to drive, hence the death of shaft drive cars as motors got faster and faster.
With small diameter, lighter brushless armatures (rotors), especially in spec classes with low motor power, this torque steer effect is much less noticable. My girlfriend runs a 17.5 blinky shaft drive and I can't feel any torque steer effect. It definitely still exists as you can't ignore the laws of physics, but it isn't big enough to cause any problems.
The torque steer on FWDs due to unequal driveshafts is something totally different and not relevant to RC due to our cars being designed properly.
06-27-2011, 05:08 PM
#8
chassis is tweaked. putting un-equal weight on the tires left to right and its causing it to pull when on throttle, check your left/right weight balance, and for equal shock length, spring length, and ride height, just make sure everything on the car is equal left/ right
06-29-2011, 09:04 AM
#9
Tech Adept
chassis is tweaked. putting un-equal weight on the tires left to right and its causing it to pull when on throttle, check your left/right weight balance, and for equal shock length, spring length, and ride height, just make sure everything on the car is equal left/ right
06-29-2011, 09:39 AM
#10
That will be a faulty servo, a bent driveshaft, a weak differential spring, thin diff grease, a binding bearing etc. All through poor maintenance.
06-29-2011, 10:30 AM
#11
Tech Adept
The car did it since brand new. Its not noticeble while driving unless on super slipery tires. All bearing have been oiled, car is belt driven so there wont be a bent shaft, has stock diff grease and diffs havent been opened (gear diff) and servo is ok. It is faulty suspension design if ive ever seen it. Probably from the inertia of the wheels accelerating acting on the suspension, though gyroscopic precesion takes far too long for it to be that.
06-29-2011, 10:45 AM
#12
In response to the original post, there is a way to put a slipper on a shaft drive car. A company call RC Product Designs has an offroad conversion for the TC3. The offer a slipper assembly for that car. For more information, check out their website (http://www.rcproductdesigns.com/)
06-29-2011, 05:19 PM
#13
Tech Master
The 'torque steer' effect can be seen on a belt drive car, pick it up and hold it in the air halfway along the chassis. When you blip the throttle the front end will lift and the rear end will drop. This torque effect on the chassis on a belt drive car helps push the rear wheels down under acceleration for more grip to put the power down. But with the motor in a shaft drive chassis this same motor torque will lift one side of the chassis while pushing down on the other, causing it to steer one way under acceleration and steer the other way when braking. As Daleburr pointed out, with the lighter armatures in brushless motors today the effect isn't as noticeable as it used to be.
06-29-2011, 06:01 PM
#14
Again torque steer effect is a myth!!! I have run a 4t brushed motor in my tc4 , and I don't notice it guys!!! I also don't balance my car, and don't use a setup station!!! When I hold my tc4 and accelerate, the chassis moves front to back, and not side to side!!! The effect is either too small or inexistent!!!! Shaft cars are still alive, even if some people believe in the brainwashing myth of torque steer....Besides, if it were such a problem, all the fullsize race cars would have switched to belt drives by now...LEARN THAT!!!!!!!!
