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Old 10-10-2004, 07:46 PM   #16
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Putting any kind of padding on could be harmfull too. If you just skim along the padding chances are it will grab you car and cause it to tunr sharply into the wall. Also you have a great potential for tearing chunks off the padding and onto the track where they become hazards. Much easier to just drive to your abilities and stay off the walls. Slow and clean is faster.

BTW where have you raced?
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Old 10-10-2004, 07:49 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by newracer
Putting any kind of padding on could be harmfull too. If you just skim along the padding chances are it will grab you car and cause it to tunr sharply into the wall. Also you have a great potential for tearing chunks off the padding and onto the track where they become hazards. Much easier to just drive to your abilities and stay off the walls. Slow and clean is faster.

BTW where have you raced?
The padding at my track did neither of these two things.

I like how you guys are saying "stay off the walls". The faster guys just hit things harder when they crash. Josh Cyrul tore the right hand side off his 1/8th scale last year. A bit more thought into track barrier materials is not a big ask.

For example Barry Bakers car:



May have hit a few barriers huh? This photo is from Mike Meyers.

Last edited by AMGRacer; 10-10-2004 at 08:05 PM.
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Old 10-10-2004, 08:22 PM   #18
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If you hit the wall at a speed of 40 to 60 mph, it will still break even if there is a padding.
It all comes down to Track owner's Conscience. If I were a track owner, I'll put a padding and show my customer that I care. This also gives my customer a confidence in them and drive faster (and break more parts, Just kidding).
But saying it's your falt to run into the wall to a biginner is not right. Because when I first drove my nitro, I didn't know that my car will keep going straight eventhough turn my wheel. it still requires lot of concentration at the end of the straight. imagine for a beginner. We all should encourage more Beginner to come to this hobby, not blaming them for thier inexperience. I for one think that it shouldn't be expensive to learn and get into this hobby.
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Old 10-10-2004, 08:31 PM   #19
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Thumbs down don't hit sh*t????

ya'know. i'm fresh off assisting in running the halloween classic this weekend, so i've heard my fair share of complaints over the last three days. well, this one's actually legitimate.

1) staying in the middle of the track...
- will keep you in the middle of the pack. you are an idiot if you think that is the fast way around the track. if you aren't trying to run a competitive track, it should at least be friendly.

2) we have two indoor tracks within 30 minutes. one has couplers, like wyd referenced, and the other does not. i don't know too many of us who would would go back after running on a track without them. "rubbing is racin", and that incidental rubbing can make you skim the outside of a straight and hook a coupler. that is just a poor way to DNF, and it can happen to the best racers.

3) there are certainly things that can be done around the track to MINIMIZE breakage. and they aren't that expensive. one of which is called a flapper. when done properly, they drastically reduce breakage. period. for temporary tracks, they are another time consuming task, but the willingness to add that to the list speaks toward the appreciation that the race director has for it's racers.

4) the only thing that absorbs energy on the track is the car? uhh, right.... see #3 above.

5) don't run into walls? how about you don't post here anymore? is that fair? one guy breaks less parts, and the other appears more intelligent. it's a win/win.
- that's like telling your 8 year old little leaguer to never swing and miss at a pitched ball. good luck, son.

6) while many people refuse to blame their driving as the root of the problem, that is not representative of everyone. when we hosted the halloween classic last year, we had top level drivers complaining that we put the flappers on too tightly creating a punishing result if contact occured. the top guys are demanding forgiving layouts so that even they can be less timid about their lines. so don't qualify or label the complaint as the effect of poor skills. that is simply not true.

.... don't hit walls..... wow!
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Old 10-10-2004, 08:39 PM   #20
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It's no secret that many hobby shop tracks 'encourage' a healthy parts replacement program...


I've had more than 100 packs on this track with various badly tuned cars and well tuned cars..
The only major thing i've broken must be a couple of wheels, bent dogbones..
Guess what: this is a Track with no real hobby shop beside it..A major crash and customers will just go home.
Note: The track is barriered with go-kart tyres,grass or nothing at all.

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I only come to this track when i feel that my form is good, with a well tuned car. However, since it's the 1st in my area to open, I must've had no less than 300 packs here.
I've broken almost every single part imaginable on the car. I've seen the worst damages RC can see on this track.
Guess what: This is a hobby shop track. They always run out of arms/kingpins,Suspension shafts,hubs,spindles.
Note: it is barriered with 1 ft high concrete. Note the drainage holes:they just caused me major damage.
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I know you guys are talking about drivigng well,staying off the walls and stuff..heck i consider myself as above average in that department. But the thing is, unless you're Baker or Masami, You can't never avoid collision.

That's where the track owners come in. Either they make the track killers or SAVERS. It's the attitude and policy.
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Old 10-10-2004, 09:06 PM   #21
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that's a hobby shop track? uhhhh, wow. i'd be happy to break on that track.
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Old 10-10-2004, 09:28 PM   #22
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I agree that everybody hits the walls, I was trying to say that if you dirve within your abilities you will not hit as much as you will not break as much.

For example my oldest son started racing last year when he was five. I started him with the most durable car I had, a HPI RS4 Rally. Then I limited his throttle to 50% with the radio EPA so he couldn't go too fast and just crash all the time. At 50% all he had to do was hold full throttle and steer the car around the track. After he was able to consistantly drive the track at that setting without hitting anything I increased it to 70%. At 70% he would have to let off the throttle a little for the corners or he would go too wide and crash or have a really bad line for the next corner. After a few weeks he got the hold of it and I now have his throttle EPA at 80%. When he gets even better I will turn it up more.

Even when my son was only using 50% throttle he would beat most of the other novice racers beacuse they would need to be marshaled at almost every corner.
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Old 10-10-2004, 09:33 PM   #23
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padded walls have often caused more damage on cars from people I have talked to than smooth walls. Just as someone said above, if you drive a line that brings you close to that wall, if you even brush against it, its going to grab the car and spin you if not tear stuff off the car.

Pretty much everyone will tap a wall or brush it, thats not always damaging. its the fools that drive into the wall at 20Mph or with just lots of energy, that bust, and while padding may save them. It could also hurt the people who CAN drive and just maybe get too close to teh wall on a racing line.

If people are worried about having to spend money to fix their cars, maybe R/C racing isnt the place to be. Its not cheap, its not easy, and its not meant to be a budget sport. Bash in parking lots if you want cheap. because you are talking about RACING, which denotes it to be a higher class of driving with higher rewards and higher RISKS.
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Old 10-10-2004, 11:41 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by Clegg
padded walls have often caused more damage on cars from people I have talked to than smooth walls. Just as someone said above, if you drive a line that brings you close to that wall, if you even brush against it, its going to grab the car and spin you if not tear stuff off the car.

Pretty much everyone will tap a wall or brush it, thats not always damaging. its the fools that drive into the wall at 20Mph or with just lots of energy, that bust, and while padding may save them. It could also hurt the people who CAN drive and just maybe get too close to teh wall on a racing line.

If people are worried about having to spend money to fix their cars, maybe R/C racing isnt the place to be. Its not cheap, its not easy, and its not meant to be a budget sport. Bash in parking lots if you want cheap. because you are talking about RACING, which denotes it to be a higher class of driving with higher rewards and higher RISKS.
AGREE!!!!! 10000% AGREE!!!!
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Old 10-11-2004, 01:01 AM   #25
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If the barriers used result in a large amount of parts breakage at your track then speak with the people that run the track on alternatives.

My local track users a combination of materials. Majority of the track is laid out with old fire hose filled with sand. Has plenty of give and does very little damage.
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Old 10-11-2004, 03:53 AM   #26
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Speaking as a guy who has laid down many parking lot tracks for my local club. Track material has to be solid and heavy so that the track stays put throughout the heat. 1,5 kg car moving at 30 miles per hour packs incredible punch. 2 by 4 is cheap and sturdy. And it does stop the car and not launch it into the spectators. To stop the car something has to absorb the energy, it's best that it's the car so the rest of the drivers still have track to race on.
If anyone can show me anything, that does not launch the car, like RoadRails nor grab it, and is resonably cheap, I'll buy it.

Hobbyshops rarely make money on their tracks, and belive me, it's huge investment. It's a service they give to the RC community and they never get any thanks. If you want safer tracks, don't bitch about it, but find cheap solution to the problem and present it to the track owner. I'll guarante you he'll look into it.

Out of two evils I prefer damaged car to damaged bystander, EVERY TIME.
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Old 10-11-2004, 07:39 AM   #27
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Practice, practice and more practice. Whether you are a PRO or a beginner, you are bound to break something. That is a fact and it will always be that way. I run in a very "car friendly" track and still break some parts sometimes, mostly arms.....usually when you fly off berms. Even the "Road Rail" system can damage your car, when you fly off it and your car will do cartwheels, or maybe when a car comes flying from the other lane at full speed then hit you head on....If you hate breaking, then this is not the hobby for you

Just my .02
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Old 10-11-2004, 07:46 AM   #28
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at our club we use piping on the straights and roadrail for the corners....................the roadrail is good cos you cant really hit it you go over it
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Old 10-11-2004, 08:41 AM   #29
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Most tracks I have been to have had fine barriers, but my home track(the one wyd mentions) is brutal. They use 4" pvc so that it keeps the monster trucks on(yup, its an on-road track and they race monster trucks), but it kills all the on-road people. The corners are squared off with the couplers as shown with wyd's picture, and they tend to cause a lot of breakage. Also, the track often comes apart, after every race, a few people go around the track to put many of the couplers back together. I understand that its expensive to get a boarder, but many people have left because of all the breakage.

Here is a picture of the track...
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File Type: jpg hobbytown track 04.jpg (54.5 KB, 244 views)
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Old 10-11-2004, 01:36 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jack Smash
This seems to be part of a trend that I have seen growing in our society. Not accepting responsibilty for your own acctions and then blaming them on other people. Funny, if I am driving my car and I crash into something that I know is solid, I don't go off about why that solid object is there, I accept responsibility for crashing into it and go fix my car.

The first job of the marking barriers is to outline the track for the competitors to run on. The second job is to protect the specators from cars leaving the racing areas. If you break your car by running into these barriers, you obviously did not have control of your vehicle.

So in your world, we should have padded barriers on our city streets in case someone crashes their $40,000 dollar car into one? Seems more worthwhile than crying over a $5.00 suspension piece.
Excellent point Jack. Folks have to realize that anything can happen. They have to accept the fact that this hobby is expensive and to expect the unexpected. There is no conspiracy and its all about knowing what you're getting into.
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