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Old 05-13-2011, 01:14 PM   #16
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Can one of you guys post some dyno figures for these motors?

We run boosted 17.5 and if the timing is going to be set then it is going to be great for the boosted classes as changing motor mid meet will not mean stuffing around with timing settings to try and get the sweet spot happening again.
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Old 05-13-2011, 01:26 PM   #17
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I guess I'm the only one that doesnt like this idea? Not suprising.
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Old 05-13-2011, 01:39 PM   #18
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I guess I'm the only one that doesnt like this idea? Not suprising.
No, there's two of us! Can I just remind people...

Get racing back to what it was - what, when there was a new motor every few months that was better than the last one and we had to go out and buy it? When there were all sorts of tuning tweaks that most people couldn't make work, and so they all clamoured for us to go BL because that would stop that problem? When we were buying cell of the month, and kept refreshing them to keep the voltages up? Is that what you want it to go back to?

So, here's what you're in for...
Cells - fresh sets on a regular basis to prevent the drop-off so you get good laps at the end of the run. Always having to get the latest, highest capacity so you can keep the volts up over the run.
Rotors - buying fresh ones because even they will drop off faster as the temps go up as we gear them higher and higher.
Motors - getting the new, latest locked one so you cna keep up with everyone else.

Boosted timing increases motor efficiency right across the rev range, and across the range of motors. People think that all BL motors are equal, but they aren't. During the time we have had boosted timing, it has equalised the motors because you can make them run more efficiently right across the rev range. The motors are not equal when you remove the method of making them efficient - timing. Whether on the motor or on the speedo, timing is what we use to equal out the motors.

For all those that want to walk back to the BR days of five years ago, go ahead. But as these issues unfold, there will be a movement back to boosted to equal these things out.

If you really want to get back to Stock racing, and really want to slow things down, find a slower motor and boost it. That way almost any motor and almost any cell will work as well as any other.

Still, Larry and I can always take a short rest from racing, sit back and watch the fun, and come back when you're all busting to have the adjustable and boosted motors back!! Enjoy yourselves repeating history...
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Old 05-13-2011, 02:31 PM   #19
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I guess I'm the only one that doesnt like this idea? Not suprising.
Nope I'm with you.
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Old 05-13-2011, 02:48 PM   #20
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If you really want to get back to Stock racing, and really want to slow things down, find a slower motor and boost it. That way almost any motor and almost any cell will work as well as any other.
+1
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:18 PM   #21
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If you really want to get back to Stock racing, and really want to slow things down, find a slower motor and boost it. That way almost any motor and almost any cell will work as well as any other.
So if I told you I have a $600.00 speedo that will be the best in that class with your 30 turn BL motor. Would you buy it?
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:23 PM   #22
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to be honest we all have opinions. I am just happy someone is trying something to make racing better. Let's get back to talking about the motor and leave the drama for it's own thread.
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:23 PM   #23
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I guess I'm the only one that doesnt like this idea? Not suprising.
+1
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:24 PM   #24
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I will see if i can get something for you. But give me some time. Eric might be able to help here too.

Thanks

Mike

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benzaah View Post
Can one of you guys post some dyno figures for these motors?

We run boosted 17.5 and if the timing is going to be set then it is going to be great for the boosted classes as changing motor mid meet will not mean stuffing around with timing settings to try and get the sweet spot happening again.
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:26 PM   #25
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Hey guys have your local hobby shops contact me at Trinity 386-668-7771

I have 13.5, 17.5 and 21.5... they are Duo3 based motors... runs identical to duo3 in stock timing position. they just cant be cheated...

if your local shop will not order them just call me Billy ....
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:34 PM   #26
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During the time we have had boosted timing, it has equalised the motors because you can make them run more efficiently right across the rev range. The motors are not equal when you remove the method of making them efficient - timing.
Not sure if I'm getting it correct. Are you saying (assuming the same model motor with same number of winds) that boost helps a slower motor moreso than a faster example of the same motor? Does a more efficient motor lose that benefit when boost is added to the equation? I'd tend to assume that a person who knows how to tune an esc would end up faster starting with a the 'pick of the litter' motor than just grabbing anything off the pile.
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:40 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Mike Blackstock View Post
I am just happy someone is trying something to make racing better.
man, if only we asked ourselves that before each time we hit the 'submit reply' button...

the boost or not to boost is so played out .. and insignificant. it's certainly nothing worth screaming at each other over, or a cause to go pouting out of the track.

locked timing is fine. i think if nothing else, it might be causing trinity to do a better job of qc, which is likely responsible for ea's initial findings. will a better motor come out? maybe. but that's business/racing. people complain more about our self inflicted spending than over any legitimate issues. the hobby is always going to cost money. and it's always going to be exponentially proportional to one's will to be competitive, but i digress..

if nothing else, the 25% lower price tag should be something to feel slightly better about. and by limiting the number of variables that the manufacturers can optimize, we'll get a longer lifespan out of the speed limit that's indirectly set forth by the rules. << (which has been one of the biggest battles over the last half decade)

let's get something durable in place, and even more importantly ... let's get it on!!
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:57 PM   #28
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let's get something durable in place, and even more importantly ... let's get it in!!
are you talking about racing -- or just the after racing fun at The Gate?
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Old 05-13-2011, 05:33 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by SlowerOne View Post
No, there's two of us! Can I just remind people...


So, here's what you're in for...
Cells - fresh sets on a regular basis to prevent the drop-off so you get good laps at the end of the run. Always having to get the latest, highest capacity so you can keep the volts up over the run.
Rotors - buying fresh ones because even they will drop off faster as the temps go up as we gear them higher and higher.
Motors - getting the new, latest locked one so you cna keep up with everyone else.
You forgot the non-programmable speedo of the week.
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Old 05-14-2011, 09:39 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by SlowerOne View Post
No, there's two of us! Can I just remind people...

Get racing back to what it was - what, when there was a new motor every few months that was better than the last one and we had to go out and buy it? When there were all sorts of tuning tweaks that most people couldn't make work, and so they all clamoured for us to go BL because that would stop that problem? When we were buying cell of the month, and kept refreshing them to keep the voltages up? Is that what you want it to go back to?

So, here's what you're in for...
Cells - fresh sets on a regular basis to prevent the drop-off so you get good laps at the end of the run. Always having to get the latest, highest capacity so you can keep the volts up over the run.
Rotors - buying fresh ones because even they will drop off faster as the temps go up as we gear them higher and higher.
Motors - getting the new, latest locked one so you cna keep up with everyone else.

Boosted timing increases motor efficiency right across the rev range, and across the range of motors. People think that all BL motors are equal, but they aren't. During the time we have had boosted timing, it has equalised the motors because you can make them run more efficiently right across the rev range. The motors are not equal when you remove the method of making them efficient - timing. Whether on the motor or on the speedo, timing is what we use to equal out the motors.

For all those that want to walk back to the BR days of five years ago, go ahead. But as these issues unfold, there will be a movement back to boosted to equal these things out.

If you really want to get back to Stock racing, and really want to slow things down, find a slower motor and boost it. That way almost any motor and almost any cell will work as well as any other.

Still, Larry and I can always take a short rest from racing, sit back and watch the fun, and come back when you're all busting to have the adjustable and boosted motors back!! Enjoy yourselves repeating history...

X1000
This has happened in RC now numerous times now, and the motor of the week and battery of the week gets old very quickly and car counts drop. Boosted timing is the great equalizer and tuning tool. Been around long enough to have see this type of push back on technology happen a number of times, and its starting again in numerous circles..

What should be promoted isn't where everyone has to buy the latest stuff to be allowed in, like spending more money on the latest motor or battery, but just learning to tune what you already have and having the rules allow what people generally already have for that type of racing. The software makes these motors fly, and is a great tuning tool at any track. If you think your going to stop the changes to the advances by ruling them out of the playing field, your not looking at what's to come next. Make the rules simple, and as open as possible and let the changes come. Promote flexibility, and you will get better turn outs. We find it easier to allow two classes with the same rules and equipment allowed, and base it more on driver ability. Both are open to any 17.5 motor and open to any esc as well as any 2s Lipo battery. One class is way faster, and the other is not. All of us run the same equipment basically, but yet some are much faster. If you don't want to learn, then you can stay in the slow class....If you have figured out how to go fast, your bumped up, and all your equipment stays the same, very simple.

As far as I am concerned, if you run a 13.5 and I run a 13.5, that's even enough for me. If you want to be fast, learn what it takes to be fast.....stop whinning about it. Because in the end, its the drivers ability to fine tune the set-up and make it fast. Just bolting in a motor and esc and battery, or copying another racers set-up, will not get you the win....We have seen time and time again, where they change the rules to limit speeds, or percieved advantages, and the fast guys are still fast, it doesn't matter what you hand one of those guys to race with, they are just fast.
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