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Old 05-11-2011, 06:47 PM   #1
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Default question for the RCGT guys about use of faster motors

our local club has started racing with GT style bodies and have tried adopt the RCGT rules as per hpi... however there is one little problem.
Guys want to go faster.. some of them are trying brushed 19T motors that's the speed everyone wants.

so question is, If we were to adopt a faster motor what are the drawbacks (if any) of going to a 13.5 brushless but keeping everything else the same.
There are no 19 turn available now so guess 13.5 would be the logical alternative...
would there be any advantage from the higher end chassis? (xray, etc...) vs the cheap one (tt01, e10 etc...) because of going to this motor, or would the existing rules (weight, tires, realistic bodies) still compensate this difference.
we are thinking speed passion cirtix 13.5 for this one...
don't want to mess the RCGT rules, just want to implement something that is faster without the touring car feel...

I would really appreciate the advise from those that have already "been there" thanks!
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Old 05-11-2011, 06:58 PM   #2
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17.5 no boost
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Old 05-11-2011, 10:26 PM   #3
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My local track one of our classes is RCGT, which is 17.5 blinky mod. No timing or boost on the esc. There is a serious advantage for some people who are running t3, tc6, tc5, tcx, photon, trf417, so on so forth against who ever is using entry level with a tt01, sprint/sprint 2, e10, and etc. due to handling and weight differences. Our track we limited our to 1425g. so all the light weight chassis have to add weight. I hope that helps out.
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Old 05-11-2011, 11:15 PM   #4
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thanks for sharing that, the weight restrictions make sense... I wonder where do cars like the tamiyas tb03 and ta05 fit in this context...

Also, since we really want to make this an inexpensive entry level class we are thinking about just making a novice class using box stock rtr's and adopt a rule to use 20 or 27t sealed can motors (the cheap 10usd ones), that way all run the same motor regardless of the esc which will have no trouble to support it.
But the fast guys will get a faster brushless class with either the 17.5 or 13.5 non boost...
I have seen youtube videos showing the 17.5 non boost and seems a bit hard to judge just how fast or slow it is... we've been trying the reedy challenger 19T motor and that's the kind of speed we are aiming for the "fast" rcgt category... I think a 13.5 no boost matches the speed of that, but I might be misjudging, any comments on that?
the inexpensive cars (e10, sprint) seems to be able to handle the 19T speeds with no major mod which is a lot of fun for the more experienced drivers. With the weight restriction on the better performing chassis do you think the inexpensive ones would still get a chance on the track? (using 13.5)
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Old 05-11-2011, 11:58 PM   #5
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cirtix 17.5 is plenty enough speed for an entry level rcgt class and its a great price. The track I run at has adopted this. Realistic bodies and spoke wheels only. 1450 gram weight limit.

My shaft drive chassis had way more punch in the in-field than other modern belt drive cars. Setup and driver seems more important in this class.
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Old 05-12-2011, 12:33 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goots View Post
cirtix 17.5 is plenty enough speed for an entry level rcgt class and its a great price. The track I run at has adopted this. Realistic bodies and spoke wheels only. 1450 gram weight limit.

My shaft drive chassis had way more punch in the in-field than other modern belt drive cars. Setup and driver seems more important in this class.
yup, setup is a little more important.
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Old 05-12-2011, 03:41 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufus2000 View Post
thanks for sharing that, the weight restrictions make sense... I wonder where do cars like the tamiyas tb03 and ta05 fit in this context...
In RCGT I actually race with a TA05 V.2 IFS. with everything i came out to about 1588g, that is with the stock chassis. my issue is that we are racing parking lot so traction was low-med. Then i wanted to lose some weight so i opted for a Exotec chassis and that dropped me about 100g's. and it helped out with steering which i didn't have with the tub chassis.
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Old 05-13-2011, 06:39 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minga View Post
In RCGT I actually race with a TA05 V.2 IFS. with everything i came out to about 1588g, that is with the stock chassis. my issue is that we are racing parking lot so traction was low-med. Then i wanted to lose some weight so i opted for a Exotec chassis and that dropped me about 100g's. and it helped out with steering which i didn't have with the tub chassis.
that weight is slowing you down! I can barely keep up with you now
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Old 05-15-2011, 06:27 PM   #9
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i think the Boss 17.5 is very fast
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Old 05-16-2011, 08:35 AM   #10
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Sounds like you must have enough racers to support both an entry level RCGT class and a "Fast RCGT" class. If you don't, be careful about splitting them up. Entry level cars aren't going to do well in the fast class even if just because more experienced racers don't usually run them. This could be discouraging to an intermediate driver thinking that he would need to spend $400 on a chassis to be competitive if trying to break into that class. The other issue you have to consider is tire wear. D compound and Pro Compound X-Patterns don't hold up well at higher speeds. Belted Pro compounds do okay but cost more. In any case the cost of tires is going up with the speed of the class. If you want to have a strong class that maintains its numbers over time and is competitive for all cars and skill levels, then you have to slow the racing down, not speed it up. This will put the win in the hands of the best driver/tuner, not just the ones that have the money for a high-end chassis and new tires every week. Higher speeds also break/wear more parts which goes against the philosophy of containing costs. Keeping things inexpensive, close and competive for all cars is what has made USVTA racing so popular. This year they have introduced USGT to bring the same kind of competiveness to GT style racing. It's just something to consider.

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Old 05-16-2011, 08:52 AM   #11
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We just started a faster class to step it up a notch from our rubber touring class. Rubber touring is 13.5 boosted on our large track and 17.5 boosted on the smaller asphalt tracks in the area. The new class is a MOD/foam tire/exotic body class. X-pattern tires would not be best choice for MOD or 13.5 boosted, foam is an easy way to increase corner speed for everyone!

To your questions: Faster cars will wear much faster, especially with an RTR made mostly of plastics. A high end chassis' advantages show at higher speeds as well, better handling characteristics, more consistent, and less upkeep from worn parts. Easy fix would be to run 13.5 boosted if that's what everyone has already/looking to purchase who wants to go faster. But 17.5-no timing for entry level is correct.
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Old 05-18-2011, 02:59 PM   #12
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thank you all for the great feedback.
I think it's pretty clear that the way to go will be 17.5, maybe some of the guys will still try 13.5 but I bet they'll learn the hard way with that extra tire wear. Perhaps they can still run 13.5 GT but without the x-pattern tires (slicks probably?).

Our track is super grippy (kind of like a tennis court type of surface) so i don't know what could be the most cost consious solution regarding tires... any suggestions for those running under similar conditions?

I have seen lately new 17.5 "stock" non configurable ESC's appearing in the market, there's also the 17T brushless option with no sensors that's even cheaper... not sure if it's the same speed as 17.5 , but some say it is smooth enough for onroad. might be worth getting one of those to try out.
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:15 AM   #13
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The tough part I am coming across is the lack of 17.5R motors out there... Only novak(very,very heavy) and off brands....
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:41 AM   #14
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Perhaps 13.5 blinky would be more appropriate.

At our track we recently had an event using 17.5 blinky and they were a good 10s off the 27t motors of old.
If your venue is quite small then you wont notice much difference between 17.5 and 13.5 though.

As for 17.5's, what about Thunder Power, Speed Passion and Reedy etc.

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Old 04-26-2012, 12:37 PM   #15
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Guys this thread is almost a year old. While these ideas are good for local racing. I would suggest going with 21.5 and USGT rules. This will keep you compatible with so many tracks across the country that have added this class to compliment their VTA program. RCGT is still a great idea but USGT is strong and actively raced every week.
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