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Old 10-17-2007, 12:10 PM   #5416
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Talking 13.5EX vs. 13.5 Velociti

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and oh yeah:

I had cini-minis and orange juice!

If I missed anyone's questions or comments please let me know... it's been a busy week !
Steve,
Just wanted to know if the 13.5 EX is the same as the Velociti 13.5 in speed and torque. Also can I use the sinterered rotor in a 13.5 that came with the 4.5 GTB system?
Thanks in advance!
Max
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Old 10-17-2007, 12:24 PM   #5417
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Hey max,

Once you upgrade the EX13.5 with the sintered rotor it should perform the same as the 13.5 Pro motor... the only difference will be that the Pro version will have the ribbed endbells.

Yes, if you do not wish to purchase another sintered rotor the rotor out of your 4.5R will be compatible with your EX 13.5. You will just have to use the front endbell from your 4.5R being as that the sintered rotor utilizes a larger front bearing.
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Old 10-17-2007, 02:36 PM   #5418
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Steve- Don't forget to touch my motor
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Old 10-17-2007, 05:07 PM   #5419
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Weiss View Post
Hey max,

Once you upgrade the EX13.5 with the sintered rotor it should perform the same as the 13.5 Pro motor... the only difference will be that the Pro version will have the ribbed endbells.

Yes, if you do not wish to purchase another sintered rotor the rotor out of your 4.5R will be compatible with your EX 13.5. You will just have to use the front endbell from your 4.5R being as that the sintered rotor utilizes a larger front bearing.
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Old 10-18-2007, 10:45 AM   #5420
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... I would recommend that you compare the cost and life span of a new brushless motor with that of the cost of the brushed motors, brushes, and equipment you would have needed to get the same performance for the same amount of time with brushed stuff.
The biggest cost for most racers with any type of motor is not the stuff you mention. The biggest cost is obsolescence, where your current equipment goes from being competitive to being uncompetitive overnight.

Various Novak brushess winds (especially 13.5 and 10.5) have become defacto "spec" classes in clubs. This happened because the lack of viable competition to Novak reassured racers that the high initial cost of a new speedo and new motor was justified; the chances were very good that these expenditures would not go obsolete quickly.

Now it seems that this comfortable situation is ending, with all the other manufacturers getting into the brushless game. The unfortunate result it likely to be more racers sitting on the sidelines waiting for things to sort out.

Novak could reduce this problem and solidify its own leadership position by committing to continue producing motors with performance essentially the same as Novak's current 13.5 and 10.5 for some significant period, say two years. This would allow clubs to move from "defacto spec" to "true spec" motor rules without the risk of being undercut by the ongoing competition between motor manufacturers.

Novak should continue to push forward and *also* produce ever-faster motors to fill demand from racers who want to run in "ROAR brushless stock" races, with the new motors being visibly different from the current motors. But the vast majority of racers only race at the club level, and in the short run the competition between Novak and other manufacturers for "ROAR brushless stock" supremacy discourages club racers if nothing else is done.

Is this something that Novak is thinking about?
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Old 10-18-2007, 10:59 AM   #5421
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Default Reposition heat sink?

I installed the Novak 5413 heat sink on my 13.5 motor. The heat sink was a tight fit so I used the trick of heating it first before slipping it on. It worked like a charm.

Now I'd like to rotate the heat sink to accommodate the constraints of a different chassis. Is there some trick for accomplishing this? I'm afraid to aim my heat gun at my nice motor ...

Or is there a way to rotate the end of the motor that contains the sensor and wiring tabs, relative to the stator?
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Old 10-18-2007, 11:44 AM   #5422
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Mark,

Like I mentioned in a previous post we don't have any intentions on making any performence enhancing changes on the 10.5 or the 13.5 motors in any way.

In fact the current 10.5 pro and 13.5 pro are essentially the same as the original 4300/SS 13.5 motor but only with the addition of the sintered rotor.

The sintered rotor situation was what I believe to be a pretty unique situation where not only was performance enhanced but so was the reliability and longevity of the motor when compared with the original bonded rotors.

As far as the idea of always having to "up the bar" so to speak when another manufacture comes out with a competing product such as an LRP or Orion 10.5 there is really only so much one can do to change the power output of the motor for a given size. The power band can be shifted around and this in turn effects the drivability of the motor... so there become points of diminishing returns at the expense of other factors which make for a "good motor"

As far as rotating the heatsink on the motor your best bet would be to try to remove or partially remove the heatsink and then reposition it. Changing the back end assembly is not really possible without alot of soldering/desolder and testing equipment to make sure that everything is ok again.
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Old 10-18-2007, 12:04 PM   #5423
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Good points, but hopefully the standards for class breakdowns get established soon. I just received a group of motors from SpeedPassion and their 19t brushless is listed as 19t/9.5, not 10.5. So we'll see. I haven't tested it yet, but this can't be good for standardization. Hmmm.?
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Old 10-18-2007, 12:10 PM   #5424
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Yeah, We have tried to work with the manufacturers to create a common ground but if china wants to copy something...they copy it... or if they wanna flood the market with something un-standard... well, you get the idea

We have NO control or recourse with situations like that...

There has been a lot of talk with ROAR and the manufacturers and I think that they are getting close to making some sort of decision... it'll then just be up to the motor manufacturers to just jump on board or not
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Old 10-18-2007, 12:32 PM   #5425
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The Feigao 13.5 is slow, and the LRP sintered rotors are crap. You guys are doing just fine. :-)
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Old 10-18-2007, 12:33 PM   #5426
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P.S. I want a Mongoose for my 13.5. :-)
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Old 10-18-2007, 01:07 PM   #5427
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I didn't want to steer this thread in a different direction from its original intention... but its kinda heading that way anyway. Has anyone tried a brushed stock (CO27) with bearings instead of bushings vs. a 13.5 to see if it is a little more comparable? In a touring car a brushed stock isn't TOO far off from a 13.5 anyway. Maybe something as simple as allowing bearings for the brushed motor would work, or at least help bridge the gap and make them a little more competitive towards each other?

Last edited by CShearburn; 10-18-2007 at 01:24 PM. Reason: typo's
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Old 10-18-2007, 01:46 PM   #5428
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its a idea but there are problems with that. ROAR will never allow bearings in a stock motor, or it wont be spec. its been asked of them and all you usualy get back is a stern NO. club wise it might slide but i dont think it would help bridge the torque gap.
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Old 10-18-2007, 02:22 PM   #5429
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if people still want to watch their movies in a beta max.. or vhs player.. let them. i'll enjoy my HD-DVD or BluRay disc anytime.

Steve, when's the next R6 game? racing this sat?
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Old 10-18-2007, 02:38 PM   #5430
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its a idea but there are problems with that. ROAR will never allow bearings in a stock motor, or it wont be spec. its been asked of them and all you usualy get back is a stern NO. club wise it might slide but i dont think it would help bridge the torque gap.
Hmm, not sure I understand the reasoning behind it. Bearings can be had pretty cheap these days, especially for the motor manufacturers.

As for torque... theoretically I would think it would help the acceleration of the motor more than anything else. The extra drag of the bushing vs. the bearing should hurt acceleration more than top end (doesn't help top end either.... but still...). Not to mention improving effeciency. Both of which is where the brushless excells over the brush motor.
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