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Old 07-20-2011, 10:04 PM   #211
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Originally Posted by inpuressa View Post
Ah, the good old minis. Look how fun they can be. Too bad it died out here.
This video looks cool not because they are mini cars...but they look like REAL cars and are going around the track at a speed the majority could handle. They are not a yellow or white blob going around at 45+ mph. More people like something they can relate to then something they cant and they have a hard time dealing with. This is the reason SCT is so big....they look just like the real thing and drive around the track looking just like the real thing. There is a reason that a class like VTA or Mini is big in some areas and not in others, people like real looking cars....not everyone but I would guess to say that more people like looking at real cars racing around the track then some neon blobs. Once the cars started to get away from looking like real cars and more like a "shape" and the speed went up people went away. A class like VTA has made some people come back. I dont think VTA is the cure but its a clue to what people want much like what SCT is.
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Old 07-21-2011, 01:59 AM   #212
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Maybe its not the gear that is the problem, because it sounds to me what you are saying is that these newbs are expected to make it with the seasoned vets, which if is the case, is pretty fail.

At the club i drive at, we have a novice class, all new drivers are put in that and they stay there till they have the driving skills to not cause problems to the faster guys or until their lap times improve to class standards. Novice is also run what you brung, has no points scoring and no race winners, with plenty of quality assistance from guys with the experience to help you with getting the most out of the car you brung and with becoming more consistent.
Some guys turn up with very inferior equipment, which is offputting when after being spoken to, could have used the same amount of money or a little more to get something which is better quality if they had known about it is all i'm saying.

We do not have a novice class as such, just regular A B and C mains. The slower guys know why they are in the lower mains as they frequently watch the A, but after schooling, they show potential.

A newcomer who can say they won their race is a good thing for them, but good advice and schooling is just as rewarding and important to seeing them at the track again IMO.

I know of only one guy at the club who has taken his racing too seriously and shown it on the track with his attitude, but he took the time to apologise the other week when it was taken too far, so nearly all of the time everyone is treated with equal respect for each other and that is what you need for a club to work...
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Old 07-21-2011, 02:02 AM   #213
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start a radio shack class!
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Old 07-21-2011, 08:27 AM   #214
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start a radio shack class!
My first RC car was a Radio shack model I never imagined at the time RC cars existed that were much better then that... I didn't know that this RC world existed... now I'm hooked for life...
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Old 07-21-2011, 05:19 PM   #215
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Hate to say it but we almost need a short course type car/class. The off road here as exploded due to this. We even tried to get the guys to run their trucks on road. We did get a few but only because they had nothing else to do that day.
The question here is why short course took off so quickly and inspired people to race? Was it the cost? I doubt it...most of these cost as much if not more than on-road cars. Maybe the scale looks then? Again I'm not so sure on that as otherwise VTA and RCGT would be much bigger than they are now. So what is this elusive formula that Short Course has seemed to hit on that is not only bringing old racers back but bringing in new racers? Or is it really bringing in new racers at all? Locally here it seems like it mostly just brought back old racers.
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Old 07-21-2011, 05:26 PM   #216
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these are all good ideas but if u allow something and think people will not try and abuse it then u r wrong to me boosted esc's killed on-road racing for me im probably not gonna race on-road at my LHS till they change the rule to non-boosted ESC because its kinda crazy trying to drive 17.5 with a boosted ESC you may as well run mod
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Old 07-21-2011, 05:28 PM   #217
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SC really took off cause of the realitic looks and the cost. SC10 rtr is what $180? Then if you go into the kits $240 and thats considered "high end". Lets take a look at ae's tc6 somewhere around $350. I really wish onroad would really take of but some guys just really go all out when getting into that when the new guy comes in to check it out he gets turned away when he sees the $400 plus kits, $100 servos and batteries, $200 esc's, and so on.
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Old 07-21-2011, 05:33 PM   #218
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The question here is why short course took off so quickly and inspired people to race? Was it the cost? I doubt it...most of these cost as much if not more than on-road cars. Maybe the scale looks then? Again I'm not so sure on that as otherwise VTA and RCGT would be much bigger than they are now. So what is this elusive formula that Short Course has seemed to hit on that is not only bringing old racers back but bringing in new racers? Or is it really bringing in new racers at all? Locally here it seems like it mostly just brought back old racers.
Initially it was the spec, price and scale looks. It was just one truck - the Slash - and it was an RTR. It was also the only one of its kind, at the time. With on-road, there are way, way too many chassis out there to choose from and they require way, way too much setup. A Slash, you simply took out of the box, charged batteries, put the right tires on and drove it around the track. There was some tweaking to get the best performance by the top drivers, but it was easy to do. On-Road is just way too high maintenance to attract casual racers, the way short course has. Beginners should not have to buy set-up stations and gain an understanding of caster, camber, toe, tweak, droop, suspension, etc... That should all come later.

Honestly, I tried to get into on-road and there's a lot that I do like about it. I was really interested in creating a spec that would attract newcomers...however at every turn, I found that there's a contingent of existing racers that seem to actively work against creating something that will bring in new blood. There's a major "cultural" difference between on-road and off-road that has something to do with the preventing a new spec class for beginners from really taking hold.

Just my $0.02 as someone who wanted to get into on-road, but ultimately got soured on it due to a combination of some of the people involved, the politics and the complexity of car setup.
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Old 07-21-2011, 05:56 PM   #219
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Problem is in VTA or RCGT you can do all that for about the same cost if you go with an RTR HPI or something like that. Not to mention our SC class started out as pretty much an anything goes class and have people running motors anywhere from 17.5 to 8.5 and again VTA and RCGT both have that same "spec" type aspect to them. Plus these days there are all kinds of high end SC trucks and the class is still going gang busters. So while I do feel that all of those were contributors to the success of SC...I'm thinking we are still missing something. I think in addition to all that the size is a factor as well...SC is bigger than the old classes in off-road physically...nearly an 1/18th scale even. Maybe it is time for the Super sized class to make a come back with an inexpensive RTR car. Something that is bigger but yet still small enough to run on existing tracks. I know I keep eyeing an old Tamiya TGR one of my LHS's still has on the shelf and making an electric version of it.
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Old 07-21-2011, 06:11 PM   #220
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Problem is in VTA or RCGT you can do all that for about the same cost if you go with an RTR HPI or something like that. Not to mention our SC class started out as pretty much an anything goes class and have people running motors anywhere from 17.5 to 8.5 and again VTA and RCGT both have that same "spec" type aspect to them. Plus these days there are all kinds of high end SC trucks and the class is still going gang busters. So while I do feel that all of those were contributors to the success of SC...I'm thinking we are still missing something. I think in addition to all that the size is a factor as well...SC is bigger than the old classes in off-road physically...nearly an 1/18th scale even. Maybe it is time for the Super sized class to make a come back with an inexpensive RTR car. Something that is bigger but yet still small enough to run on existing tracks. I know I keep eyeing an old Tamiya TGR one of my LHS's still has on the shelf and making an electric version of it.
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we need to bring back mini.
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Old 07-21-2011, 07:18 PM   #221
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I think short course is popular because you can go off-road, do jumps and kick up dirt. The fun stuff.

No on-road model can equal that factor.
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Old 07-21-2011, 07:32 PM   #222
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Firstly, I will apologise from the start. I have not really read or kept up with this thread so forgive me if I'm not fully clued into whats already been pointed out.
Going from the title or should that be headline Question...
I believe, even though this may not be a very popular idea, that we need to change the rules within the classes often.
Weather it be on road, off-road, large scale or 1/18th.
Changing the rules often, not drastically, will keep people on their toes and force even the fast guys to allways being looking for the fast way of doing things within the new rules.
Maybe going to rubber only..... not running any wings at all on touring cars??!
Maybe forcing electric touring cars to run 20 minute or 30 mins mains??!
Battery changes? ... that would be interesting.
Finding a different class always stirs interest for a few years.... but then we need to mix things up. Change a few things, just small things to re-ignite the class but not effect the class fundamentals.
Its just an idea but theres always going to be new cars, hop-up parts etc how else are car and part manufacturers going to make a profit!?? So why not change the rules and the racing to take advantage of these ever changing cars and new parts?

In 1/10th F1 your starting to see mandatory pit stops, stop/go penalties. Even 2 lap only qualifiers!!
All these little things keep things interesting.

Its just an idea.

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Old 07-21-2011, 07:37 PM   #223
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Here's another idea.
How about 2 car only qualifiers 1/2 a lap behind each other, for a minute. Fastest lap qualifies first?

Just an idea. I'm sure we can all think of many more

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Old 07-21-2011, 07:48 PM   #224
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i think if we say electronic gadgets we cant tell how durable it is.it depends to the people who use it.thats why others may say they used it well but others may say they are not working well.i thinks electronics life depends on how we take care of it.
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Old 07-21-2011, 07:56 PM   #225
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SC took off for a lot of reasons, It is the "scale" appearance, the relatively low cost, the RTR versions, the size, and the ability to run it anywhere, not just at the track. That last item will always hold down on road to some extent. Pan cars are reasonable in cost, but difficult to set up for a newcomer. Touring Cars are easier to make drivable, though equally difficult to make fast, but they are expensive. I think you have to be dedicated to race 1/12th or TC to a level that is not necessary in off road. And you never know what someone you help will do. I met a guy starting 1/12th, a nice guy. We became friends and I helped him with his car at every race. He came to me and said he was going to quit because he couldn't drive the car. I offered to let him use my car at the next race and I would be his pit crew. He came in excited and proceeded to TQ and win the novice class. Then he came to me and said he was going to quit because if he couldn't build a car as good as mine after all the time he spent on it, he never would. He never came back. What can you do with something like that? It would help if a cost controlled class was somehow made popular. It would help if a raceable RTR was available. It would help if the cars were more realistic. beyond that I'm not sure what to do.
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