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German Touring Car Outdoor Nationals

German Touring Car Outdoor Nationals

Old 08-30-2004, 01:08 PM
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Default German Touring Car Outdoor Nationals

Last weekend the German Touring Car Electric Outdoor Nationals were held.
Maybe anyone of you guys are interested what was going on there.

The track was the Burgdorf track near Hannover and it´s a mediumsize (in compare to the track from last year) and very interesting track with a good but not extrem grip.
But it´s not that easy for being fast there and the local drivers or at least the one who had been there several times before had a huge advantage.
But some Pro drivers being there the first time showed their skills and were very fast despite this.

The organizers did a great job and had good food for a cheap price for the racers and spectators. Best thing was they had a very large tent with even a wooden floor so you would have a clean and dry pit area even at very bad weather.

As the track for this years Championships is far away for many racers there was the decision not to close the track before the race.
This meant there was free practice possible until Friday evening as qualifying started on Saturday. Some of the drivers were there for nearly the whole week.
I arrived on Thursday evening but too late for any practice this day. There was just too much traffic on the motorways and some other reason so I couldn´t arrive as early as planned.

On Friday there was bad weather so this meant for me no free practice in dry conditions.
Sometimes there just was a wet track and sometimes standing water which is very different for driving.
But most drivers choose practicing in the wet as there was the general opinion the competetion will be held on the same conditions.
I also had 5 runs in the wet and in the end my car was very good under these conditions. But you had to go for a very extrem setup.
For being fast at this track you needed very much steering anyway but in the wet there was so much understeer so I had to go for a setup I never used before. More on this later in the Technical section also.

Lot of drivers were building a brandnew car for the Nationals and it was really crazy to see people using their brandnew EVO IV, 415 or Xray or anything other running in the rain.

For me I had my old and proven EVO III with me for the rain and the new but unfinished 415 for trying in free practice.
As I arrived that late on Thursday it was impossible for finishing and a testdrive that day.

The Take Off CS 27 tire was chosen as a control tire and 2 sets of tires was the limit for the race with a 3. set for the A-Main drivers.
Wheels and inserts were free of choice and any odorless traction compound could be used. But some drivers including me didn´t use any traction compound as a tire used just one time with traction compound isn´t working at all in the wet.
Some guys used tire warmers as it was a little cold in the morning and not very warm all the day. Also for the first laps there was an advantage using tire warmers.

Regarding motors there was a 12turn limit for the modified class as it´s usual here in Europe and I think most drivers used a 12T single wound armature.
For the stock class there was a handout 27T motor made by Team Orion according to the German rules. This motor is completely different to the Roar motors, more on this later in the Technical section.

So Saturday morning arrived and surprise, surprise there was a dry track with the heats to begin.
Before there were three rounds of controlled practice with the first one with a damp track so I choose not too start.
At the next practice round my radio didn´t work so unfortunately I couldn´t start on a dry track. Later I found out my receiver crystal wasn´t working anymoore for whatever reason. The day before I used exactly the same without problems.

In the third round I used another one and everyting worked again without problems. But I just had only one run now on a dry track.
But it was appearent that my car had not enough steering so I had too change for the heats.

Overall there were 5 rounds of qualifying with the 2 fastest rounds to count overall. This wasn´t by laps and time but with the point system as it´s usual here outdoors.
3 rounds were on Saturday and 2 rounds on Sunday.

During all the rounds it was clearly to see the Tamiya team being very fast in the Modifiedclass as supposed before with Marc Rheinard (winning 3 rounds) and Marc Fisher (winning 1 round, one 2. + one 3. place) the fastest.
But also Marc´s brother Tony who isn´t racing that much was very fast ( two 3. places) with some other guys of the TRF team a little bit slower. All of them using 415.

From the other teams especially Sascha Falter and Benni Gröschel showed a very stronge performance both being former National champions Offroad and Onroad.
Sascha Falter (TC3/Reedy) was winning at this track 3 years ago at a very wet championship that time so had a very good track knowdlege before and this paid of.
He was superfast all weekend with winning 1 round and a 2. place in the heats.

Benni Gröschel (HPI Pro4/LRP) hadn´t been any time before at this track but despite this he also was superfast with two 2. places and a 3.place.

Markus Fost (Losi XXX-S G+/GM-Racing) also a former National Champion maybe didn´t find the right setup but qualified for the A-Main.

But one driver needs special attention. It´s young Christopher Krapp driving a TRF415. He had a 5.th and 6. place in the qualifying rounds.
This doesn´t sounds anything special but he just is 11 years old.

So overall it was 7 TRF 415, 1 TC3, 1 HPI Pro4 and 1 Losi XXX-S G+ in the A-Main.

It was in this order on the grid:

1 and TQ - Marc Rheinard
2 - Marc Fischer
3 - Sascha Falter
4 - Benni Gröschel
5 - Toni Rheinard
6 - Steffen Leinburger
7 - Christopher Krapp
8 - Dirk Wischnewski
9 - Markus Fost
10 - Ronald Völker

For the Stock-class it was Nils Kerchner with his Schumacher Mi2 showing a stronge performance with winning 3 of the qualifying rounds.
Dennis Kalinowski was winning 1 round with his new Corally RDX and Michael Kess winning 1 round with his TC3.
Peter Deggelmann (Schumacher Mi2) and Thomas Günsel (TRF415) had a 3. place each.
For the other drivers of the Stock A-Main I can´t say very much as I just don´t know them but as I know there were two X-Rays in.

But it was in this order on the grid:

1 and TQ - Nils Kerchner
2 - Dennis Kalinowski
3 - Michael Kess
4 - Bernd Hasselbring
5 - Tobias Berckmann
6 - Dennis Fadtke
7 - Peter Deggelmann
8 - Thomas Günsel
9 - Björn Brockmann
10 - Stephan Pieper

A-Mains Modified:
There were 3 rounds for the A-Main with 2 rounds counting. At the first round there was a dry track.
After the start there was a close battle but after some laps Marc Rheinard could pull away and winning by about half a lap.
2. place went to team mate Marc Fisher with Benni Gröschel finishing just 1 second later.

About 10 minutes before the start of the 2. round it began raining heavily and the teams had a lot to do preparing for this.
At the start of this final the track was very wet. This means your car feels like on rails if you have enough steering as usually the car understeers much in these conditions.
Also you need much more rideheight as otherwise you will have a lot of drag resulting in a higher ampdraw from your battery.
Next thing is you need some tires without any tractioncompound used on them before otherwise you´re lost completetely.
Right after the start there was a battle between Marc Rheinard and Marc Fisher for most time of the final.
After a mistake from Marc Rheinard Marc Fisher was going inside and taking the lead. Marc Rheinard pushed hard and put a large pressure on Marc Fisher as he was a little faster.
Then Marc Rheinard hit a curb and the gap was larger than before. But with 30 seconds to go Marc Fischer was slowing down and Marc Rheinard could take the lead again to the end and this meant Marc Rheinard was National Champion as he did win 2.Mains now.
At the end Marc Fishers´s car even stopped but at this time race had been over and he was on 2. place in this run. I´m not sure if had a wet motor or a problem with the ESC but whatever it was it caused the battery to dump. But for the last A-Main he was fine again.
In this round four drivers didn´t finished because of a broken car or wet elctronic.

3. round
The track was still wet but not as much water as before. Marc Rheinard didn´t start as he was National Champ already. After the start Marc Fisher was leading but there was a close battle between 4 cars. As the track conditions were more slippery the lead changed but after half of the race Marc Fishers was leading to the finish resulting in a 2. place overall to him.
Tony Rheinard didn´t have the best start but could improve by overtaking Sascha Falter and Benni Gröschel in the same lap resulting in a 2. place for him in this run.
Tamiya F1 world champion Ronald Völker also improved during this final and had a 3.place after the finishline. This meant also 3. place overall for him.
Sascha Falter had a very good car at the beginning but didn´t handle that well in the 2. half of the final. I asked him about this but he didn´t know exactly the reason. He used a front diff in this run all others were on oneways.
Sascha and Benni both were in the group battling out for the lead in the beginning but lost some time later.

Overall standings:
1 and National Champion Modified - Marc Rheinard-TRF415/Team Orion
2 - Marc Fischer-TRF415/Team Orion
3 - Ronald Völker-TRF415/Team Orion
4 - Sascha Falter-Associated TC3/Reedy-Keil
5 - Toni Rheinard-TRF415/Team Orion
6 - Benni Gröschel-HPI Pro4/LRP
7 - Dirk Wischnewski-TRF415/Team Orion
8 - Steffen Leinburger-TRF415/Team Orion
9 - Christopher Krapp-TRF415/Team Orion
10 - Markus Fost- Team Losi XXX-s G+/GM-Racing

A-Main stock:
I don´t have all informations as I had to marshall in one of the rounds and was preparing my car in an other round.
But TQ-man Nils Kerchner did win all of the 3 A-Mains in style with his Schumacher Mi-2. Dennis Kalinowsky starting from 2. place broke in the first round and hadn´t too much luck in the other rounds so just a disappointing 10. place overall to him. He really was fast in the first and secound round of qualifying but after that anything went wrong.
I don´t have any informations regarding the drivers on 2. and 3. place overall. Thomas Günsel was able for a 3. and 4. place in the A-Mains so ended up in 4. position overall with his TRF415.

Overall standings:
1 - Nils Kerchner-Schumacher Mi2/CS-Electronic
2 - Tobias Berckmann
3 - Björn Brockmann
4 - Thomas Günsel-TRF415/Team Orion
5 - Dennis Fadtke
6 - Michael Kess-Associated TC3/CS-Electronic
7 - Stephan Pieper
8 - Peter Deggelmann-Schumacher Mi2/CS-Electronic
9 - Bernd Hasselbring
10 - Dennis Kalinowski-Corally RDX

As soon as ready there will be a Technical section with more informations on cars and other things to follow.
I also have pictures but this need some time for resizing and working on.
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Old 08-30-2004, 01:25 PM
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Nice report V12 ! good job.
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Old 08-30-2004, 01:54 PM
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Thanks a lot V12, Great Report.

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Old 08-30-2004, 02:05 PM
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Nice job V12, looking forward to the pics and technical bits...

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Old 08-30-2004, 03:39 PM
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Darn, missed another one....... First Hokenhiem, now this.......Oh well, due to whats going on around here, I may get to get in and watch one of those races next year.
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Old 08-30-2004, 07:06 PM
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Thanks guys. Here´s an update for the technical section.

Cars and setup:
Regarding cars you could see about every brand of a competition-car there but Tamiya had the largest number with the TRF 415 the most.
There were also some EVO IV but I think very few drivers used them. Most EVO IV drivers also had a 415 with them and used this one instead.
About all of the TRF drivers used the new suspension on the 415 as this had more steering than the older suspension because of the 2° carriers.
But it was also possible being fast with the old suspension. Thomas Günsel who was in the A-Main stock class proved this.
Most 415 drivers used the new low friction belts, front A-bridge block with a C-A configuration and aluminium rear uprights. This was either the Tamiya 1° or the Square 0.5° uprights.
Some also used the titanium wheel axles and ceramic diff-balls.
Setupwise for the dry conditions no rollbars or yellow f + r were used and same springs f + r. Some drivesr used yellow and some used whites. Usually rear toe in was 1.5°
Shock positions were outer hole front and outer hole or one hole in on the rear shocktowers. At the new arms mostly the outer hole on the 2-hole side was used.
Ride height is 5mm most times. Shocks were on 30 or 40 oil with 3 hole pistons.

For the wet conditions there were these changes:
springs: red front, blue rear or yellow front and white rear.
rollbar: no front, blue rear
rear toe in 1°

looks like a crazy steering but this was needed in the wet.

Regarding the EVO 3 I think I was about the only one using this. Some drivers had an EVO3 as a wet car but it looks now it´s just too slow now with the 415 and EVO IV around.

Marc Rheinard and some other 415 drivers had an interesting idea regarding the wheel bearings on the new suspension.
For the front there is no change but at the rear they just used the longer wheelaxles from the old suspension so they could use the larger bearings along with the aluminium 1° uprights. This doesn´t chnge anything regarding the wide of the car but they tried this as they also had problems with the small 950 bearings.
There will be a picture from Marc Rheinard cars showing this.

HPI/LRP used the Pro4 and Benni Gröschel did a great job using one despite the fact he never was on that track before.
But I have to say I don´t have any informations regarding setup.

Keil/Reedy driver Sascha Falter used an Associated TC3 and qualified easily for the A-Main Modified also. His car looked not to much different from out of the box.
He used a rear shock tower on the front with orange Yokomo springs front and rear. Most difference was his chassis as he dremeled the inner part for moving the battery more to the centerline. Also he dremeled some holes into the chassis´s sidewalls for lower weight and better cooling.

The Schumacher Mi2 cars looked like out of the box I didn´t see much changes. Peter Degelmann used Associated red springs front and rear and 1.5° rear toe-in. His drivetrain was very free but he said to mee this is right out of the box and he isn´t using different bearings.
Nils Kerchner also used a Mi2 but I have no information on his car.

There were not too many Yokomo and Losi cars there but Markus Fost qualified his XXX-S G+ into the A-Main modified. He used a different shocktower at the front and green springs front and rear. Despite a large heatsink his car doesn´t look very different from out of the box.

Dennis Kalinowski used a Corally RDX car for qualifying for the A-Main Stock in 2. position. As the car is so new I don´t know if there were made any changes now.
But as the Corally team was in their own tent and not in the big pit area tent I haven´t seen his car.

There were also some Xrays used maybe this is the # 2 car behind the TRF415 at the moment here. The Xrays looked just right out of the box. About all used a saddlepack configuration.

I think some people here know of the Jürgen oneway for the EVO3. I meet Jürgen Horn the maker of this oneway at the Nationals as his two sons were competing there.
He showed me 2 interesting things for the 415. In the meantime he had improved the front diff using the 415 diffrings now which are working better. In the beginning he was using the EVO3 rings as the ones from the 415 were about not available here.
But most interesting he widened the slots in the diffhalves now so blades from the Corally Assasin could be used on the stock Tamiya driveshafts. Until now using a very strong aluminium and anodizing this the wear was very low on the frontdiff. But using the blades the wear is at zero now and the blades are cheap parts to replace. Also the suspension seems working a little better as there is less friction on the driveshafts when the suspension arms are moving. Also there is less wear at the driveshafts pins.
Next thing is he will release also some aluminium diffhalves for the rear! Some of his customers wanted him making these so he did a prototyp. It proved working much better and for longer. Also seems improving the handling somewhat. Later on the pictures there will be one with the prototyp installed in a 415. But the prototyp just is plain aluminium not blue anodized as the final version. All of the diffs and the spool are made now for the Corally blades from now on. The spool will be different also now. Until now some Oneway steel outdrives were pressed and glued into the aluminium unit. Now the whole spool is completely aluminium for lower weight and using the blades there is about no wear.
I just have ordered both front and rear diff and hope getting these in about 2 weeks. He just sold all of his frontdiffs lately. Steffen Leinburger from the A-Final Modified used the new Jürgen spool in one of the wet runs.

Most drivers used the Protoform Mazda 6 some also the Stratus2. Also Stratus 1 and HPI Aero2 could be seen but this is personal preference. Sascha Falter used a Nemesis in one of the A-Main.
Marc Rheinard used a Mazda 6 as most other TRF drivers too.

As said before the Take Off CS27 was the handout tire. Wheels and inserts were free of choice but I know most of the Team Orion drivers used the Orion Asphalt yellow inserts. Some guys used the GM Racing green or CS-Electronic green which seems the same.
Using tire warmers was an advantage. Most drivers using them let them at the wheels until the starting line.
Marc Rheinard used Yokomo digital tire warmers.

later there will be an update regarding motors, electronics and waterproofing

I still have problems with my camera. I´m not able getting the pictures onto the PC. Anything isn´t working with the USB connection anymore as it seems.
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Old 08-30-2004, 07:30 PM
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Thankyou for the info V12! Looking forward to the pics!
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Old 08-31-2004, 04:53 AM
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Congratulations V12!!!

Very good REPORT & DATA. I'm ansious for the pics.
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Old 08-31-2004, 06:03 AM
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thanks for sharing !
can't wait to see the pics
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Old 08-31-2004, 06:08 AM
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Thanks guys.
I will upload pictures in the next time. I just got ready resizing them. It takes a lot of time as I´m not an expert with these things.
But I hope there will be some pictures interesting for you.

You will come to the Bawue-Final race at Althengstett?
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Old 08-31-2004, 06:54 AM
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good job as always V12, thanks for the detailed report.
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Old 08-31-2004, 06:57 AM
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I´m done with the pictures now. Will upload some but not all as it´s too many.

starting with pictures from the track
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Old 08-31-2004, 06:58 AM
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Old 08-31-2004, 06:59 AM
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Old 08-31-2004, 07:00 AM
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pit area
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