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Old 12-29-2006, 11:07 PM   #1066
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Originally Posted by Mike Dumas
Happy Holidays to all...

TEM-I would also have to say your setup is stiffer than usual. I would agree with eforer. Try that first and if you still have problems or want your car to do something else just give us a jingle back on here..

Carl-I guess it could include sanding but Bruce and myself don't even do that on my car except for the battery slots.
I ended up softening up the car a little; .020 front springs, blue sides. But at the same time I changed tires (as I said I was going to jaco's). Originally I was on TRC purple fronts and pink rears. Now Jaco purple fronts, and grey rears(rears trued to about 47mm, fronts 45mm). Like some of you said; with the purples it should push like a SOB. TRC purples were fine(they are a much sticker tire than jaco). With the Jacos, it started to push at around the 4-5 min mark. The steering response of the car was similar to before (very sensitive, 2 foot circles at full throw). They changed the track layout but I was hanging with the same group of guys (about 1 second per lap slower than the fast guys). Still got some jaco 2 stage I'm going to try out on my next outing.
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Old 12-30-2006, 07:03 AM   #1067
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Unless you have alot of bite, neither Jaco nor GRP purples will steer. grp stuff is a bit softer and slightly different construction than jaco however its not different enough as where jaco guys are running different compounds that grp rubbered guys at the same track. Normally at big races all of the parma guys run purple/grey and the jaco guys will run black/yellow (black is the hardness of a purple but different construction since jaco purples will add steering during a run and yellow is inbetween a white and grey, or it might be inbetween a black and grey, not sure, but it is very similar to a parma grey). wraps arent going to fix the push, softer front tires probably will though. I would suggest trying Parma magenta/ grey, or magenta pink, and you should be dialed.
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Old 12-31-2006, 12:37 AM   #1068
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Had my 4.5 out for its first race day today, and so far I'm VERY impressed with the car. I do have a few questions...

First round I ran Parma purples and greys. The car was very stable but just a bit lazy on the steering. Second and third rounds I ran Parma blacks front and rear. The car was still nice to drive, but carried more speed in the corners and needed less throw on the steering to get around.

For the main I tried some Jaco double pink wraps front and rear... about five laps into the main the rear of the car just started going away. The car was so loose by lap 10 that I just pulled it off before something ugly happened.

The track is medium/high grip Ozite, we run Paragon. I was saucing the whole rears, inner half in front.

I guess I'm curious if anyone else has seen the Jaco wraps go loose like that early on in a run, and does anyone know the cause/prevention?

The blacks were great, I still want to try grey/magenta or maybe grey/violet out too.

I ran the car with 40wt and red center spring, blue side springs, .020's up front and CRC blue cap in the dampers. 3 1/4 mm ride height front, 3.5 in back, and just enough sag so the main chassis sat level at ride height. A little bit of droop in the pod when lifted. Protoform Speed 12 body.
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Old 12-31-2006, 09:19 AM   #1069
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Trips,

The double pink wrap Jacos will work extremely well with the Speedmerchant. It sounds like in your main the front end picked up too much bite and created oversteer.

For med to high bite, you have to put CA on the front tire sidewalls. Put a good, thick bead all the way to the running surface. This will smooth out the steering and prevent the oversteer.

Another item may be your side springs. Many of the racers use the Speedmerchant .023" side springs with a little preload. This keeps the front end from dumping too much in the corners. Your blue springs may be a little on the light side for your traction conditions. They may work OK, though, if you put some preload on them.
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Old 12-31-2006, 09:25 AM   #1070
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Somehow I can't figure out using the same compound for front and rear in a pan car except for years ago when greens all around "worked" but ofcourse we were going a lot slower then. I've been used to softer rears. Were these brand new tires you just trued? You might want to sauce them up good a couple times before they get "lively". Like fronts I'd sauce full for the first run of the day (I only get to go to the track every 2nd week if I was real lucky), then the rest of the day; between 1/2 to 5/8's sauce.
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Old 01-01-2007, 07:25 PM   #1071
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Going stiffer ono the side springs seems counter-intuitive, but I'll give it a shot... also I'll CA the sidewalls before the next time out.
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Old 01-01-2007, 07:51 PM   #1072
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Quote:
Going stiffer ono the side springs seems counter-intuitive
Yeah, I know. It just seems that the stiffer spring keeps the front end from dumping and creating too much traction on the outside tire. To enhance rear traction you may want to try a little sag in the chassis, 0.5 to 1.0 mm, and equal front and rear ride heights.

Also, my son Jeff runs a little stiffer center spring and 20,000 wt. in the side dampners, but you should be OK with your current setup until you get to the point where the car drives well and you need that extra 1 or 2 tenths per lap.
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Old 01-01-2007, 09:12 PM   #1073
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Larry, thanks for taking the time to answer... I switched the side springs from the blues to whites (I don't have a selection of Bruce's new side springs yet) and I'm going to go a little heavier in the damper tubes. What center spring would you suggest in place of the red? I have a black center spring but I think that might be too much...

I will also get the rear ride height down to match the front and with the slight sag I have in the chassis the hinge point will be the lowest spot on the car, it'll be like 3.5 front and rear and 3 or 3.25 at the hinge line.
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Old 01-02-2007, 06:33 AM   #1074
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What center spring would you suggest in place of the red? I have a black center spring but I think that might be too much...
Most of the drivers were using copper, and Jeff uses black or copper depending on conditions. Sometimes the red is fine, though.

Your ride height sounds fine. In Cleveland Jeff's car was around 4mm ride height F & R, 3.25-3.5mm at the hinge line (rear of main chassis).
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Old 01-02-2007, 11:06 AM   #1075
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Dumas
Novak Super Flex 16 gauge wire for motor
Mike, I can't find Novak 16 gauge wire at any of the distributors, and novak doesn't list it on their website... Do you know a part number?

Thanks...
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Old 01-02-2007, 12:19 PM   #1076
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you can also get T.Q. DRAG WIRE it is made for slot car stuff most of the crc guys have been using this for a while its great ..
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Old 01-02-2007, 01:15 PM   #1077
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Anyone know if Bruce is away? I placed a small order from the speedmerchant on-line store about 2+ weeks ago and still no delivery?
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Old 01-02-2007, 02:17 PM   #1078
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smyka
you can also get T.Q. DRAG WIRE it is made for slot car stuff most of the crc guys have been using this for a while its great ..
Thanks Mark,

I've got TQ dragwire on the car now, I guess I'll just get some more of that...
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Old 01-02-2007, 08:38 PM   #1079
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Strasnick, what the heck are you doing at a touring car race? Next thing we'll all hear is that Jeff Brown will be moving back to Michigan!
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Old 01-05-2007, 02:57 PM   #1080
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Way to go Greg, meantion his Brownness and Markie in the same ost and kill the threat... Wait a sec, I know that guy... oops, nevermind.
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