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Old 12-16-2006, 08:33 AM   #1021
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Cool info. on a real car.

I've always had better luck lifting the rear axle rather than the front tires. Usually, if you get the rear even, the front is very close also.
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Old 12-16-2006, 10:33 PM   #1022
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BimmerDriver
Actually the World of Outlaws sprint car that I mechaniced in the 70's and 80's was setup like that. We would put a jack under the center rib of the rear end housing and observed the tilt of the axle. We would also lift the front tires by hand to "feel" the difference in weight. At the shop we used grain scales to measure the car, but in hotel parking lots and dirt track pits lifting the car worked just as good.
Cool! Did you put pennies on the front tires before lifting them?
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Old 12-18-2006, 10:20 AM   #1023
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best method to file down the steering blocks and how much?
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Old 12-18-2006, 11:30 AM   #1024
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl Giordano
best method to file down the steering blocks and how much?
The best way is on a mill, but I've done them with a dremel, you just have to be careful and measure often. We usually cut 'em down .030"
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Old 12-18-2006, 12:35 PM   #1025
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Exactly. Thank you for backing up the method that I described. Your sprint car has a solid rear axle, correct? So, you're doing the same thing that I'm suggesting by lifting the car from the rear at an unsprung point in the center of the car. In fact, you probably had a solid front axle too, so it would work at either end of the car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BimmerDriver
Actually the World of Outlaws sprint car that I mechaniced in the 70's and 80's was setup like that. We would put a jack under the center rib of the rear end housing and observed the tilt of the axle. We would also lift the front tires by hand to "feel" the difference in weight. At the shop we used grain scales to measure the car, but in hotel parking lots and dirt track pits lifting the car worked just as good.
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Old 12-18-2006, 12:38 PM   #1026
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Does Bruce sell machine steering blocks? Looked on the website and can't find any? Thought I'd ask before butchering a bunch of steering blocks?
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Old 12-18-2006, 12:59 PM   #1027
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So I've been bitten by the 12th scale bug and I am looking at picking up a car. I have narrowed it down to either the 4.5R or the new Gen X. I've been leaning towards the 4.5R because of it's simplicity and the fact that I drove a friends and it drove well. However, I was told that getting ahold of parts and customer service is less than desireable. I heard that when you place an order, the order will arrive and ship at any given time with it taking up to a month to receive items that were supposedly in stock at the time. Is this the norm or a 1-off freak? Bruce has always been friendly and approachable at the races so I find it hard to beleive that he would jeopardize his companies reputation on poor customer service.
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Old 12-18-2006, 01:18 PM   #1028
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carl- I know he did at one point, I dont know if he currently has any in stock. I dremeled mine down to .060" to be able to run a bit smaller tires and still make ride height at big races, and honestly you can get very close with a dremel, just take your time and keep checking on the calipers.
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Old 12-18-2006, 01:27 PM   #1029
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stormperson
carl- I know he did at one point, I dont know if he currently has any in stock. I dremeled mine down to .060" to be able to run a bit smaller tires and still make ride height at big races, and honestly you can get very close with a dremel, just take your time and keep checking on the calipers.
Thanks...I'll just take my time....I assume you just use a sanding drum?
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Old 12-18-2006, 01:28 PM   #1030
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Ian, Shoot me an e-mail bro, we need to talk...... [email protected]
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Old 12-18-2006, 03:43 PM   #1031
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Default Steering response

This is really a general 12th scale question but I own a Rev 4 and decide to post here instead of flooding the forum with new threads!

I currently run a Rev4 with a new style front end (IRS+Assoc). Got a Futaba 9602 high speed servo on trinity aluminium angled mounts. The car is setup pretty stiff front and rear. Regular steering blocks (not the more responsive linear axles), steering is set to linear on my radio, end points are as far as the wheels go either direction without rub or binding. I am able to drive it just fine on the carpet track (The fastests guys run low 11's, I'm a b-main level racer at mid to high 12's but CLEAN 8min run) so I'm not a total dumba$$.

My issue is steering response. A fast TC racer tried out my car and said I had way too much steering. I know my steering is very sensitive the way it's set, I only need to turn the wheel like 1/3 in each direction to navigate through most of the track, rolling off and on the throttle compensates for the rest of the steering(torque steering). The smallest circle I can make at full throw and crawling speed is like 2 feet diameter! He said that it was alright to practice with this kind of setup, but when I race and have other cars to deal with, any irratic steering response to avoid other cars can be disasterous. I've gotten used to driving this way for a long time, but should I try and turn down the dual rate(since I didnt need that much steering really) or add expos to make the steering less sensitive? I know it's somewhat personal preference, but I'd like to slowly change my ways if I"m doing it wrong and I "could" end up faster by changing... Can someone shed some light on this matter?
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Old 12-18-2006, 04:30 PM   #1032
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I have been told that some of the top notch drivers in the world have an intense amount of steering (like what you describe). I have also been told that if I can learn to drive like that (and do it well) that it would make for a better driver. However, if you are making your car slow down for the corners by purposefully scrubbing off speed using the front end (by using more steering that the car can grip with), then you are doing yourself a disservice. When the front tires finally decide to turn, the car will get extremely unpredictable. It will also lead to pre-mature wear on the front tires. I am not going to type a response that what you are doing is all wrong. Just make sure you are taking your corners properly..
good luck.
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Old 12-18-2006, 05:28 PM   #1033
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I have changed from a fairly tight turning radius to a much wider one and went much faster. In the past, I would set the car up to turn in a cirlce in less than half of the track width (about 3 foot circle). Now, I set it up to turn in a circle about 2/3 of the track width (about 4.5 feet).

Josh Cyrul is the one who gave me that advice. I was fast the old way and could drive the car, but, just like the previous post said, I was scrubbing speed in the corners. I was using a large amount of steering to get the car to turn in, then mid corner, the car would get really loose. The weight was transfering, then breaking the rear loose. I went to like 50% steering throw (turning a circle about 2/3 of the track width or more) and doped more of the front tire to get the turn in. Much, much faster corner speeds. Took me from 0.7 seconds a lap behind the top racers (factory, national level guys) to right with them.

I would recommend giving that a try. It worked very well for me.
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Old 12-18-2006, 05:46 PM   #1034
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I think it's alright if you are gonna tell me what I'm doing is wrong as long as you tell me what I'm suppose to do thats gonna be right! If I'm a full second behind the fast guys, so theres sure as hell something they are doing that I'm not! I know I"m a second behind but I also know where on the track I'm losing about 0.5 seconds! There are 2 chicanes that I'm not going through fast nor smooth enough. The car is good but I don't got the confidence to fly through that quickly. After a LONG hibernation from 12th scale and carpet, I started running 13.5 second laps with 3300's on practice day 1. Practice day 2 I was turning 12.7 to 13.1 and on practice day 3, I had 3800's(as if I felt like I needed better cells?) and was turning between 12.4(twice) to high 12's. Maybe I just need more practice? But the cornering thing raised a concern that I think I should take care of first.

As for setting turing radius, theres a lot of options. Which should I go for? I mean I can turn down the dual rate and get a larger turning radius. Or should I change settings on the car? Change tires? Put less traction compound on front tires? Stiffer front? Softer rear(side)?
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Old 12-21-2006, 11:09 PM   #1035
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Tem-What is your car settings currently? If you post them on here then mabye I could help you with what to possibly change on your cars setup! Thing is, I don't want to tell you what to change until I know how the car is setup.
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