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Proposed R.O.A.R. rules change

Proposed R.O.A.R. rules change

Old 01-13-2011, 02:12 PM
  #361  
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Originally Posted by robk View Post
Right now everyone would have to own a Tekin to be competitive the spec mode class, since 208 would be "ok" per IIC rules. Or we would have an ever "improving" spec software...
That is absolutely false! I am surprised to see you continue to make arguements based on personal opinion rather than fact considering your position. It is silly to perpetuate this distrust in the manufacturers.

NO one is going to allow 208. That is a dead horse and the rest of us have moved on. It actually proved it is not going to be a problem because it would not slip by. We are in this together and want the same thing, more people and more fun.

We have a very specific technical specification for the spec mode with 0 timing that everyone agrees with and will have to abide by. There is no hiding, we all have scopes and understand how they work. There will be no improvements in spec software in terms of performance. There is nothing to improve.

The only differences will be component quality, circuit designs and features. That is as close as we will ever be and we can expect.

It all comes down to fear of cheating. There is no other factual, technical, measureable reason to exclude products that are in fact equal in performance.

How cool is it for a new comer to learn in a slow class and then be able to move up to a mild mod speed with a few button pushes and a pinion change on the same motor.

Slow is not the Holy Grail for all of RC. Ever seen a product that attracted a new comer to RC racing that said

“Slowest and can not be made to go faster”?

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Last edited by Tekin Prez; 01-13-2011 at 02:25 PM.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:12 PM
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This thread is riveting
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by skypilot View Post
I traveled from seattle to speedworld to run one class when they hosted the reedy, are you saying I should have stayed home, me and the many others. uumm guess we would all be bitching about low turnouts then wouldn't we.
Last time I checked the RR was not a Roar event.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Xpress View Post
Last time I checked the RR was not a Roar event.
And the Reedy race is the one Exception to the rule that I actually attended and flew coast to coast to run 1 class. But not only do you get 8 practice runs and triple A mains I got to see every one of the best TC drivers in the world at the time race heads up for 8 rounds. No other races can offer that for a single class of racing.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Tekin Prez View Post
That is absolutely false. I am surprised to see you continue to make arguements base on personal opinion rather than fact.

NO one is going to allow 208. That is a dead horse and the rest of us have moved on. It actually proved it is not going to be a problem because it would not slip by. It is silly to perpetuate this distrust in the manufacturers. We are in this together and want the same thing, more people and more fun.

We have a very specific technical specification for the spec mode with 0 timing that everyone agrees with and will have to abide by. There is no hiding, we all have scopes and understand how they work. There will be no improvements in spec software in terms of performance.

The only differences will be component quality, circuit designs and features. That is as close as we will ever be and we can expect.

It all comes down to fear of cheating. There is no other factual, technical, measureable reason to exclude products that are in fact equal in performance.

How cool is it for a new comer to learn in a slow class and then be able to move up to a mild mod speed with a few button pushes and a pinion change on the same motor.

Slow is not the Holy Grail for all of RC. Ever seen a product that attracted a new comer to RC racing that said

“Slowest and can not be made to go faster”?

Tekin Prez
I (for one) would still like to see Tekin come out with a true spec ESC in the sometime in the near future. I mean Spec racing is pretty big and like it or not it's here to stay. Sadly there's only one other brand that's easy to get and offer support on this side of the pond. I believe a true spec Tekin with a budget friendly price tag would be welcomed by many.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Xpress View Post
Last time I checked the RR was not a Roar event.
oh ok, so traveling to the reedy at speedworld and running one class is ok, but traveling to norcal to run roar and doing one class is not, ok, if you say so.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by L.Fairtrace View Post
Here are the classes I would suggest

21.5 no boost
13.5 no boost
Mod

Any speedo is legal just must be apparent that its in blinky mode.

/thread
This is perfect!
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by trerc View Post
I (for one) would still like to see Tekin come out with a true spec ESC in the sometime in the near future. I mean Spec racing is pretty big and like it or not it's here to stay. Sadly there's only one other brand that's easy to get and offer support on this side of the pond. I believe a true spec Tekin with a budget friendly price tag would be welcomed by many.
+1

Mainly for the fact that Tekin's support is top notch and I would like to show some brand loyalty. Since spec is here to stay then trying to sell a $170 speedo against a $60 speedo is a tough sell for a newbie or budget conscious racer. I still have to send my Tekin in to get fixed, but the reason there isn't a rush do so (other than my warranty period is about run out ) is that I bought a $60 ESC to tide me over and it works just fine.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
This is perfect!
Originally Posted by L.Fairtrace
Here are the classes I would suggest

21.5 no boost
13.5 no boost
Mod

Any speedo is legal just must be apparent that its in blinky mode.

/thread


+2

And anyone caught cheating with the blinky mode will be forced to race shortcourse for a year
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:46 PM
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Do a quick business plan to start a business that is equal to ROAR. Then take all the opinions that are on this thread and try to come up with something that would please the majority. Then start this conversation up with the offroad guys and do the same. Chances are you would lose your money and your mind. ROAR works because its been established for a while, so lets see if they do the right thing. Myself I like being able to run two classes, be it stock & superstock or superstock & mod. Its just good for business.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:52 PM
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they tested several esc over here ....like speedpasion cirtix, gm, tekin, hobbywing etc etc running together in "0" mode on a 1/8 circuit and there was absolutly no difference in speed. They were tested by drivers with experience.They were all equal.

Don't believe the hype that there is a difference in blinky mode so all the esc can be binned and you will have to buy a new esc.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Tekin Prez View Post
That is absolutely false! I am surprised to see you continue to make arguements based on personal opinion rather than fact considering your position. It is silly to perpetuate this distrust in the manufacturers.

NO one is going to allow 208. That is a dead horse and the rest of us have moved on. It actually proved it is not going to be a problem because it would not slip by. We are in this together and want the same thing, more people and more fun.

We have a very specific technical specification for the spec mode with 0 timing that everyone agrees with and will have to abide by. There is no hiding, we all have scopes and understand how they work. There will be no improvements in spec software in terms of performance. There is nothing to improve.

The only differences will be component quality, circuit designs and features. That is as close as we will ever be and we can expect.

It all comes down to fear of cheating. There is no other factual, technical, measureable reason to exclude products that are in fact equal in performance.

How cool is it for a new comer to learn in a slow class and then be able to move up to a mild mod speed with a few button pushes and a pinion change on the same motor.

Slow is not the Holy Grail for all of RC. Ever seen a product that attracted a new comer to RC racing that said

“Slowest and can not be made to go faster”?

Tekin Prez
What does ROAR do for on-road now? I mean it. Why do we still care?
Please read this in context-the context of no ROAR to approve products. Do the independent promoters have an approval process out side of, "that will work"? No they don't.

The point of that post is that there would have been no pressure to change the software. The other manufacturers are not going to call anyone out in public as they would be seen as sore losers. All they could do is re write their software to the same level.
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Old 01-13-2011, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Tekin Prez View Post
That is absolutely false! I am surprised to see you continue to make arguements based on personal opinion rather than fact considering your position. It is silly to perpetuate this distrust in the manufacturers.

NO one is going to allow 208. That is a dead horse and the rest of us have moved on. It actually proved it is not going to be a problem because it would not slip by. We are in this together and want the same thing, more people and more fun.

We have a very specific technical specification for the spec mode with 0 timing that everyone agrees with and will have to abide by. There is no hiding, we all have scopes and understand how they work. There will be no improvements in spec software in terms of performance. There is nothing to improve.

The only differences will be component quality, circuit designs and features. That is as close as we will ever be and we can expect.

It all comes down to fear of cheating. There is no other factual, technical, measureable reason to exclude products that are in fact equal in performance.

How cool is it for a new comer to learn in a slow class and then be able to move up to a mild mod speed with a few button pushes and a pinion change on the same motor.

Slow is not the Holy Grail for all of RC. Ever seen a product that attracted a new comer to RC racing that said

“Slowest and can not be made to go faster”?

Tekin Prez
I think the point that was trying to be made was that the IIC allowed V208 to race and it was a non-ROAR race that "loosely" followed ROAR rules. Then ROAR however it was found...found out that V208 wasn’t as "legal" as the rest....and it’s been fixed by ROAR and Tekin. I think he was trying to show that we need ROAR to protect us....just as its showed us it could do with V208. Again if it wasn’t for ROAR we would be in a situation where there would be a "Spec" race to have the best "Spec" or "Blinky" software or everyone would have to buy Tekin esc's to be fast. Now because of this its where we are now....with ROAR wanting to do away with programmable ESC's. Do you blame ROAR for wanting to learn from their mistake? I don’t but everyone wants to exonerate Tekin and punish ROAR...yet they both had EQUAL parts in this problem that its caused. Open your eyes and remove the blinders and move past it....ROAR is looking to never be fooled again....and I for one don’t blame them....nor do I blame Tekin.

I understand exactly what you mean about an ESC that can grow with a racer but with past problems ROAR is looking to prevent this from being something ROAR wants to never have happen again. This is how you move forward from a mistake....you look to eliminate the possibility of the mistake from ever taking place again.
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Old 01-13-2011, 03:05 PM
  #374  
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Originally Posted by robk View Post
The point of that post is that there would have been no pressure to change the software. The other manufacturers are not going to call anyone out in public as they would be seen as sore losers. All they could do is re write their software to the same level.
False again. All of the major manufacturers did contact us very quickly with specific concerns and approached roar with a complaint. There is no doubt we are motivated to police ourselves and they would have gone public even without roar. It is not an issue you need to worry about or convince others to worry about. You are suppose to calm the masses, not create mistrust with what could happen but is not going to.

The issue here is banning products simply because someone might cheat. Which is really sad. False statements such as this from people that are part of the decision process is not helping us come to the right answer.

Secondary is do we need a middle class. We feel strongly that we do and boosted setups are a pretty good answer for that next step.

Last edited by Tekin Prez; 01-20-2011 at 03:12 PM.
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Old 01-13-2011, 03:07 PM
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I hate ROAR
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