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Old 11-11-2010, 09:15 AM   #16
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If you know what you are doing, you can achieve what may seem like spectacular results, without advancing the timing. Interesting how people bandy around the term "cheating", when they really mean "if your motor is faster than mine, you must be cheating". I for one am sick and tired of it.

If you've got a slow motor, learn how to make it faster. If you can't do that, buy a Red DOT or find someone who knows how to do it and use one of his. All this "cheating" talk isn't very constructive. Word of warning tho, learning how can be a time consuming and expensive proposition.
It wouldn't be so expensive if u just told me how to do it
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Old 11-11-2010, 10:29 AM   #17
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It wouldn't be so expensive if u just told me how to do it
Actually, it would still be very expensive. I had most of the equipment that I used to start and a good friend is a talented machinist who helped me build my motor jigs. I did it mainly as an academic exercise and spent many enjoyable hours, in retrospect, figuring out a process that would produce a motor that would spin faster, but would be raceable.

For the basic cost of the commercially available equipment, you could buy 20-30 of Doc's motors. The jigs would cost you another 10-15 motors if you had to pay a machinist. Why would you want to do it, unless you just want to see if you could. I was fortunate, cause my out of pocket costs were less than $200.

Last edited by Granpa; 11-11-2010 at 10:31 AM. Reason: add
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Old 11-11-2010, 10:53 AM   #18
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What equipment would run you $900-$1300 to tune a silver can?

What is a motor jig used for?

How about some pics and descriptions of this stuff.....
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Old 11-11-2010, 11:25 AM   #19
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Wut I really want to know is how to achieve high rpm and torque numbers by breaking it in correctly. The last break-in process I used worked great. The method I used seemed to reduce the notchy cog of the motor which in turn gave it more rpms. The motor did fall off after several hours of racing but was worth the 25 bucks I spent on the motor and motor cleaner. Wut caused the motor to loose its notchy cog?
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Old 11-11-2010, 11:50 AM   #20
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Wut I really want to know is how to achieve high rpm and torque numbers by breaking it in correctly. The last break-in process I used worked great. The method I used seemed to reduce the notchy cog of the motor which in turn gave it more rpms. The motor did fall off after several hours of racing but was worth the 25 bucks I spent on the motor and motor cleaner. Wut caused the motor to loose its notchy cog?
That could've been the magnets getting weak, which would result in the motor having slightly more RPM under no load but having less torque under load. The latter is what is important. As you want a lot of torque for heavy sedan classes but don't need as much for F1 or Mini
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Old 11-11-2010, 12:31 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by NWlosiracer View Post
What equipment would run you $900-$1300 to tune a silver can?

What is a motor jig used fo

How about some pics and descriptions of this stuff.....
Look, just go buy one from someone. It just isn't worth the effort and expense to do your own. When I started, Doc wasn't selling his and the only way to keep up was to learn how to do it myself.
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Old 11-11-2010, 12:46 PM   #22
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I am not interested in spending $40+ on a single $10 motor.

I do like to tinker and knowledge is fun. I just don't see how someone can spend $800-$1300 on any commercially known equipment to tune a silver can.

And the whole jig thing confuses me, what would use a jig for. Zapping the magnets to advance timing? Crank the comm?

Sorry, just some of what you are saying doesn't make any sense and when people question it, you guys always seem to duck the questions.
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Old 11-11-2010, 01:10 PM   #23
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Will someone please just tell me the BEST way to break-in this damn 540j. Pm me if you want.
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Old 11-11-2010, 02:49 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by NWlosiracer View Post
I am not interested in spending $40+ on a single $10 motor.

I do like to tinker and knowledge is fun. I just don't see how someone can spend $800-$1300 on any commercially known equipment to tune a silver can.

And the whole jig thing confuses me, what would use a jig for. Zapping the magnets to advance timing? Crank the comm?

Sorry, just some of what you are saying doesn't make any sense and when people question it, you guys always seem to duck the questions.
Okay, yes we do duck some questions. I am under no obligation to tell you or anyone else what I do to build a decent motor. Also, one question leads to another and so on. Yes, tinkering is fun, but this isn't tinkering. You do have to invest in some serious $$$$$. I blew up, set fire to, and otherwise ruined about 40-50 motors before getting a decent motor. You can add those to the expenses. Following is some of the stuff I use.

Equipment------Minimum requirement. A 30+amp LINEAR power supply and preferably 50 amps or better. I used a 30A supply and it's sort of limited. I don't trust a switching power supply like most of us use for chargers etc. These power supplies aren't cheap and if you can find one for less than $400, PM me your source. Fantom or Facts Machine dyno with computer---new $1200+, used, if you can find one, considerably less. If you decide to go the Zapper route add about $800 to that total. You also need a power source with variable voltage and a timing device---I found one for about $160, but it's operating on the ragged edge of capacity so I'll need to design and build one.

I only have two hands and without jigs, no racial slur intended, to hold things in place you couldn't operate the equipment. There are multiple ways to do this stuff and my metods are simpler than most---but effective. It took 3 attempts to build the stupid damn jig.

Now, I hope you understand why my usual advice is to just go buy one.
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Old 11-11-2010, 02:51 PM   #25
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the only reason I said cheat is the statement... advance the timing stuck out. sorry if I stood on any toes but that is one thing u cant do to a silver can and get away with so why would you write that??
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:15 PM   #26
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Is the power supply for the dyno?

Timing device?

The whole point of this website is to share knowledge and have fun, go faster and win races. While I understand some people don't want to give up their speed secrets, it sure helps to know how things are done, saves everyone time, money, and keeps people in the hobby.

In the end, all our tinkering cost money. Thats what this hobby is mostly about.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:28 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Granpa View Post
If you know what you are doing, you can achieve what may seem like spectacular results, without advancing the timing. Interesting how people bandy around the term "cheating", when they really mean "if your motor is faster than mine, you must be cheating". I for one am sick and tired of it.

If you've got a slow motor, learn how to make it faster. If you can't do that, buy a Red DOT or find someone who knows how to do it and use one of his. All this "cheating" talk isn't very constructive. Word of warning tho, learning how can be a time consuming and expensive proposition.
+1
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Old 11-11-2010, 05:19 PM   #28
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Back to the good ol' sivercan question again...

Why not just go spec brushless and be done with it?
Like 13T 3000kv ezruns, cost 80 bucks incl. shipping....

Problem solved!
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Old 11-11-2010, 05:35 PM   #29
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Will someone please just tell me the BEST way to break-in this damn 540j. Pm me if you want.
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Old 11-11-2010, 05:50 PM   #30
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PERROTTO, try 12 hours at 2volts. Then just have fun bashing or racing.

jjfo80, yes timing advance is cheating in the spirit of silvercan racing. Problem is you cannot tech timing advance via magnet zapping.

Here is what I've seen in the silvercan racing.
- magnet zapped, more power
- Tamiya sportuned motor sandpapered the can to look like a silvercan
- silvercan armature replaced by a lower wind, carefully done
- silvercan springs massaged to give right power
- cranking the comm
- extra magnet placed on the outside of the motor, then pocketed before being teched

Silvercan racing is the art of not getting caught. It is what it is.
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