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Old 10-12-2010, 04:04 PM   #1
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Default "Silvercan" Racing - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly

State your case, and let's please try and keep it civil in here

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Old 10-12-2010, 05:11 PM   #2
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State your case, and let's please try and keep it civil in here

the Good...... CHEAP MOTOR.
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Old 10-12-2010, 05:45 PM   #3
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The BAD... not so cheap considering I've been racing a 21.5 for a year every weekend , twice a week sometimes, never done anything to the motor, only gets over 130 on carpet and still running strong... Lets see a silver can do that
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Old 10-12-2010, 05:47 PM   #4
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The good:
Very inexpensive racing...the motor is cheap and the low power puts less wear and tear on your car. Cars break less and tires last longer. And for the most part the motors run fairly even.

The bad:
While most of the motors are fairly even there are some out there that are quite a bit quicker than others and there are ways to tweak the motors to get more performance out of them. So the person with enough money to buy a bunch of motors and the equipment to measure and tweak them is going to have an advantage over people who just want to run it because it is a fun class. And...it is pretty slow so some people are going to find it boring.
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Old 10-12-2010, 05:55 PM   #5
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The ugly:

We have to keep arguing about it cuz when it's not a controlled race it's a modified race mixed with different power levels.
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Old 10-12-2010, 07:20 PM   #6
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The Good:
Good place to learn the craft..

The bad:
no matter who wins there will always be people in the race that claim one motor is better then another.. or someone is cheating. "He only won because of his motor"
This can turn new guys off RC racing.
Honestly There is too much different between motors. Big races should be done on motor hand outs at the race.
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Old 10-12-2010, 07:22 PM   #7
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Cool G,B,U!

Running the mini class with a silvercan is better than good it's GRRRRRRRRREAT! I still have my spec motor from the Nationals and it just keeps getting faster. I dynoed the motor and it pulled 15,000 rpms at 1.4 amps. the com is still shiney! I never tweeked it just cleaned and lubed the motor.
Does anybody know what the CS on the brushes mean or stand for because I'm loving it!

The bad is running it in sedan and pushing the gearing really causes a lot of wear to the motor and can easily over heat if not geared properly. Which means lots of maintanance!!

The ugly is having to buy a tweeked motor just to be competative at certain races and still come in 6th!
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Old 10-12-2010, 08:02 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by warnos View Post
The Good:
Good place to learn the craft..

The bad:
no matter who wins there will always be people in the race that claim one motor is better then another.. or someone is cheating. "He only won because of his motor"
This can turn new guys off RC racing.
Honestly There is too much different between motors. Big races should be done on motor hand outs at the race.
You're really close to being right. Where a lot of people go wrong is in believing there is a huge difference between motors. 90% of the motors wll fall in a narrow 500 rpm range. Very few races are won strictly with horse power. This fallacy is prevalent mainly due to rumor mongering by malcontents.

There is an exception to this tho, and that is with a Red Dot or that type of motor. The difference here is huge and is easily discernable. They sound different, feel different, and GO different.

Curious why so many are opposed to rpm limits when in full scale racing like Formula1, They use rpm limits to help even the playing field. Seems to me to be the simplest way to do this.
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Old 10-12-2010, 08:25 PM   #9
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Good its cheap

The only way to make it even is bring back the rules we had 10 years ago and that was battery capacity. That will limit amps available and run time will come into the mix. If your using lipos make the discharge rate the lowest you can buy and the capacity small and make it harder to make run time so gearing and driving style comes into a count.....
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Old 10-12-2010, 09:25 PM   #10
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You dnyo'ed your silver can... Really!


Yah, I've done it also. When will silver can motors go away. Replace them with 17.5 non-programmable esc.

Snowy.
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Old 10-12-2010, 09:57 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by jjfo80 View Post
Good its cheap

The only way to make it even is bring back the rules we had 10 years ago and that was battery capacity. That will limit amps available and run time will come into the mix. If your using lipos make the discharge rate the lowest you can buy and the capacity small and make it harder to make run time so gearing and driving style comes into a count.....






You're kidding right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Essnowyt View Post
You dnyo'ed your silver can... Really!


Yah, I've done it also. When will silver can motors go away. Replace them with 17.5 non-programmable esc.

Snowy.
I don't think we're trying to go faster, just even out the playing field.

21.5, no boost, maybe even a fixed gear combo.

Mini could rock with this too.

More ugly:
Gonna figure out how to get more out of the next selected motor combo too, even without boost.
Like they say, that's racing.
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Old 10-12-2010, 10:02 PM   #12
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Curious why so many are opposed to rpm limits when in full scale racing like Formula1, They use rpm limits to help even the playing field. Seems to me to be the simplest way to do this.
F1 isn't stock or even spec class racing. I could see using RPM limits in those classes but not F1. F1 was the pinnacle of both drivers and technology. Sadly they have regulated out much of the innovation that once was F1.
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Old 10-12-2010, 10:33 PM   #13
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Formula One should not be silver can. F1 really isn't a beginner's class anyway.

Mini I can see it especially if there are limits on the motor. Many more beginners start with minis and most people are doing it for fun locally.

If anyone runs silver cans, I totally agree with RPM limits or handouts like the TCS Nats. That was fine. There is no point to going to a race where you know there will be 18K rpm motors. Sorry, but that sucks.

Personally, I think that since Novak and Speed Passion offer sub $100 esc/motor combos that are fixed timing ESC, it's hard to argue against brushless.
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Old 10-12-2010, 10:55 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Granpa View Post
You're really close to being right. Where a lot of people go wrong is in believing there is a huge difference between motors. 90% of the motors Will fall in a narrow 500 rpm range. Very few races are won strictly with horse power. This fallacy is prevalent mainly due to rumor mongering by malcontents.

There is an exception to this tho, and that is with a Red Dot or that type of motor. The difference here is huge and is easily discernable. They sound different, feel different, and GO different.

Curious why so many are opposed to rpm limits when in full scale racing like Formula1, They use rpm limits to help even the playing field. Seems to me to be the simplest way to do this.
Grandpa,
I think I have the answer to all the "Silver Can VooDoo" (Current Flow)
Think about this, if you control the amount of current that flows from the Speed Control to the Motor it will not matter what "VooDoo" is performed on the motor??? you can fool around with these little "Silver Can Devils" for ever but the current limiter will control the RPM which controls the Torque???
WaLa!! no more bitching about somebody like me and Bruce and Mr. Hinkley spending there whole life trying to tweak a little more HP out of these "Low Tech Motors" and then nobody has to go buy a brushless set/up I am sure LRP, Tekin, Novak can come up with a Speedo with a current flow limiter for TCS racing???
Just my .50 cents?
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Old 10-12-2010, 11:06 PM   #15
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F1 isn't stock or even spec class racing. I could see using RPM limits in those classes but not F1. F1 was the pinnacle of both drivers and technology. Sadly they have regulated out much of the innovation that once was F1.
Couldn't agree wIth you more that F1 is not stock or spec racing and is the ultimate in technology. However, the motors are rpm limited and they have other stringent rules as to aero, types of materials etc. My assumption is that this was done to "level" the playing field, yet leave room for innovation and to keep costs down. Also would like to point out to you that the racing is much closer and competitive than the halcyon days of unlimited technology. With no rpm limits, didn't McLaren win all but one or two races one season. Drivers were Senna and Prost and power was by Honda or Porsche, but you probably know more about that than I do.

I thought the discussion was about what could be done for Silvercan racing to "level" the playing field and reduce the advantage the Silvercan "wizards" have in the rpm and power dept. I was merely suggesting that rpm limiting the motors was a viable solution and is relatively easy to enforce. F1 was mentioned only to point out that rpm limits are used in even that ultra sophisticated form of racing.
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