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Old 10-04-2010, 12:40 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by skypilot View Post
The idea of zero timing is good, other then the fact the some esc's are better then others. But its always been that way hasn't it.

Btw cherry, weren't you just complaining that 17.5 with boost is just as fast as mod and needs to be slowed down.

Fact. Sp 2.0 pro with zero timing software is faster then SP stock spec zero timing esc
But the sp Gt 2.0 pro has hight ampage fets ie 120 amps
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Old 10-04-2010, 12:54 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by sidecarphil1 View Post
All i have had all year is cooked motors and flat lipos , this isnt because i am stupid and cannot progam my speedo it is just because i want to be as fast as i can , this is racing after all. This was not a dig at you personally just an counter rant
None taken, nor was anyone being called stupid. This is a forum after all, filled with opinions.

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Originally Posted by NovakTwo View Post
This industry needs an event in which newcomers can get involved in R/C without spending a lot of money on complex, racing electronics.

Also, why would long-time racers even want to compete against these newbies in Sportsman?
I agree, but i feel the issue is on a local level. Everyone, including newcomers, wanna be winners. Few want to be losers. Few newcomers want to accept that they will be or are losers. Seasoned racers dont even like to admit that. Thats why you see them in the lower classes trying to get that first place ribbon.

You have to admit though, if manufacturers would limit the products they produce to a few categories... such as RTR use or for racing only... and didnt flood the market with sooo many options to confuse a newcomer... or to give a seasoned racer a 'class to be fast in'... then potentially our hobby would likely be in a better place, as far as RACING goes.

I imagine the industry wouldnt be as profitable though. I mean, a company would make more money off of 100,000 newcomers buying INTO the hobby, than 10,000 racers staying IN the hobby. Right?
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Old 10-04-2010, 01:41 PM   #18
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We customized a program in participation with the USVTA to help level the playing field and attract new racers. It can be done when RDs realize that they want fun races and more participants who can afford to participate.

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...You have to admit though, if manufacturers would limit the products they produce to a few categories... such as RTR use or for racing only... and didnt flood the market with sooo many options to confuse a newcomer... or to give a seasoned racer a 'class to be fast in'... then potentially our hobby would likely be in a better place, as far as RACING goes.
We make products for all levels of racing and have exhaustive info on our web-site so that customers can research products and make comparisons.
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Old 10-04-2010, 01:57 PM   #19
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Pretty sure the Citrix isn't zero timing. Locked, timing, yes, but not zero.
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:11 PM   #20
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I run the Speed Passion stock Cirtix system with the stock Speed Passion V2 motor and love it. I am only running a few tenth's slower hot laps than with my open speedo car. Racing with other stock systems we all seem to be about the same on the straight but I love the punch Speed Passion has on infeild.
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:19 PM   #21
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How can a non-timing esc have "punch"?
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:30 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by NovakTwo View Post
This industry needs an event in which newcomers---not the experienced racers who post here on RCTech---can get involved in R/C without spending a lot of money on complex, racing electronics.

Whether this event is the "non-timing" ROAR Sportsman division, or something else, is yet to be determined. I have always been a vocal supporter of an entry-level division that does not allow any advanced timing, or PC programmable, escs---even ones made by Novak.

We offer a comprehensive program that allows new racers to upgrade to more competitive products as their skill and experience improve. No newcomer should have to purchase a 200.00 esc to get started and be competitive.

Also, why would long-time racers even want to compete against these newbies in Sportsman?
Because we've gotton a LOT older and haven't raced for over 15 years!!!

Hohoho--- Novak has ALWAYS been on the side of GROWING our hobby---and will make/produce anything we need to support it!! Both speedo's have a place in our hobby---what we need is the ROAR organization---AND our local tracks SUPPORT entry level racing and MAINTAIN the rules to keep people from trying to change constantly in the name of speed. WCRC has created a GREAT entry level class in the 21.5 "Super GT" cars---now just be CONSISTANT with enforcing the rules---and let the newer guys RACE!!!
It's all for FUN and TOY cars!!!
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:39 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by NovakTwo View Post
This industry needs an event in which newcomers---not the experienced racers who post here on RCTech---can get involved in R/C without spending a lot of money on complex, racing electronics.

Whether this event is the "non-timing" ROAR Sportsman division, or something else, is yet to be determined. I have always been a vocal supporter of an entry-level division that does not allow any advanced timing, or PC programmable, escs---even ones made by Novak.

We offer a comprehensive program that allows new racers to upgrade to more competitive products as their skill and experience improve. No newcomer should have to purchase a 200.00 esc to get started and be competitive.

Also, why would long-time racers even want to compete against these newbies in Sportsman?
Easy win duh lol.
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:43 PM   #24
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Easy win duh lol.
Pretty sad.....
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:53 PM   #25
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I've always like the idea of a claiming race. A race where you could buy anyone else's car for a set price. If you could lose your car for $150 dollars cash you wouldn't be using high tech stuff.
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:56 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Craig W View Post
Hi guys


Was wondering what the best esc to use in zero timing as at out local the going to start running a heat for 13.5t
This is another example of a question on RCTech that is impossible to get a right answer among all the junk that will be posted over the next few days.
This is racing! Why would any bloody racer broadcast the answer before they woop up on the rest of the racers searching for the answer?

The no timing/no boost ESC specification was originally intended to slow down the 17.5 class for a Sportsman class in hopes of increasing TC participation of the new racers. Why are you guys speeding it up again and running a heat of 13.5?

Here are 2 suggestions on how to answer the question yourself:
  1. There are over 28 approved ESCs on the ROAR Approved Sportsman ESC's list. Buy 3 of each and do an empirical test and comparison. After you spent 6 months and over $10,000 testing, you are guaranteed to have your answer.
  2. Put your hands on the first ESC you can get. Then get a 10.5 Trinity Duo 1 and put the blue endbells from a Duo 1 13.5 on it. Go out and win a few races in a spec class (no timing/no boost). Contact the ESC manufacturer and get sponsored.
When either 1 or 2 is done. Come back on RCTech and tell everyone you found the fastest ESC.
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Old 10-04-2010, 03:12 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by NovakTwo View Post
Also, why would long-time racers even want to compete against these newbies in Sportsman?
I've been asking myself that for a long time. We have a small racing community in NZ, but still get the same issues. Right now for our regional champs, we have olne of our most senior/experienced touring racers in the 13.5 class, not mod.
Having top racers stepping-down to be the big fish in the small pond has turned me off 13.5 to the point where i'll probably put a silver can back in my car...
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Old 10-04-2010, 03:46 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by JR007 View Post
I've been asking myself that for a long time. We have a small racing community in NZ, but still get the same issues. Right now for our regional champs, we have olne of our most senior/experienced touring racers in the 13.5 class, not mod.
Having top racers stepping-down to be the big fish in the small pond has turned me off 13.5 to the point where i'll probably put a silver can back in my car...
Interesting thought, but doesn't that just create a domino effect?........Who will post next that they're sad that you, JR007, have moved back into silver can? And a bigger question, why do you feel you need to step back just because some hot shoe is running in that class. Rather than take that attitude, why not accept it as a challange and try to beat them.......I mean its racing and anything can happen.

I work with a lot of kids in different forms of racing and usually when they feel provoked like that I simply tell them that we will just have to go out and beat them next race....and usually do.

And I'm not picking you out JR007 as I'm sure there are lots of others out there that feel the same, just trying to figure out why.
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Old 10-04-2010, 03:55 PM   #29
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I have no idea whether the no-timing ESC profiles are as equal as they SHOULD be.

All I know is that the motors we drive them with are NOT equal. Some come with enormous advance out of the factory, which renders the other specified dimensions worthless.

For no-timing to really work, we need fixed timing motors to go with it.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:14 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by sosidge View Post
I have no idea whether the no-timing ESC profiles are as equal as they SHOULD be.

All I know is that the motors we drive them with are NOT equal. Some come with enormous advance out of the factory, which renders the other specified dimensions worthless.

For no-timing to really work, we need fixed timing motors to go with it.
Very true. I know when it was decided that this format would be used locally, we started to test, and the first two things that came to me when I did the first run, was I need to gear up and I need to crank the timing up. So now we are back to flogging the motors to the nth degree to get performance out of them, probably rendering them pretty useless after a weekend, if your lucky enough for them to last that long. Or go back to the boosted speed controls where you could adjust them beyond your driving capabilities and still come off with a cool motor. It just sounds like mod racing is really the answer, I dunno any more.
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