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Old 05-23-2011, 03:47 AM   #481
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I seem to have blown up the nose bearing on my D3, motor arm is fine, inside the can is unmarked and all the end plate and sensor are fine also. The nose bearing though as yuo turn over the motor by hand sounds wrong, and when powered up off a speedo (only to a very low RPM) the motor is really noisey.

Does anyone know what exact size these bearings are ? I may well replace all mine with Ceramic's (I have 2 D3's and a couple of D2's)

thanks
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Old 06-03-2011, 11:16 AM   #482
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Default Base setup for boosted class

Can someone recommend me a base setup for the duo 3 in 17.5 turn boosted class with a Hobbywing extreme stock ESC?

Am currently deciding to run an FDR of 6.65 with the following settings

End bell timing 0 deg.
Punch: 7
Start rpm: 4000
Boost: 40deg
Turbo: 18 deg
Boost ramp: 350rpm/deg (equals to end rpm of 18000)
Turbo ramp: 18deg/0.1sec
Delay: 0.2sec

Would like to get some opinions on this set of values before I run in case I cook the motor within a minute.

Some comments would be much appreciated. Thanks.
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Old 06-04-2011, 06:35 AM   #483
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I think I may have blown both my d3 21.5 motors. I ran what was I thought to be conservative settings. Well they were conservative at least when I ran them with a 5.4 ratio. The only change I made was change the ratio to 6:1. The car ran good for about 2 minutes before it came to a crawl. Checked temps with the temp gun but the motor's didn't measure hot. I've taken them out of the cars and noticed that the motors now have a lot of resistance inside them. The resistance doesn't feel like the magnet resistance you get when spinning the motor. Feels more like binding. I can't find anything obvious within the motor to say it looks like it is blown.

How exactly can you tell if a motor is blown?
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Old 06-04-2011, 09:35 AM   #484
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J-PaP View Post
I think I may have blown both my d3 21.5 motors. I ran what was I thought to be conservative settings. Well they were conservative at least when I ran them with a 5.4 ratio. The only change I made was change the ratio to 6:1. The car ran good for about 2 minutes before it came to a crawl. Checked temps with the temp gun but the motor's didn't measure hot. I've taken them out of the cars and noticed that the motors now have a lot of resistance inside them. The resistance doesn't feel like the magnet resistance you get when spinning the motor. Feels more like binding. I can't find anything obvious within the motor to say it looks like it is blown.

How exactly can you tell if a motor is blown?
Are your solder tabs broken or touching? when the tabs touch you get a drag break "feel". take it apart and check all the tabs. if they touched while you were running the motor is most likely fried
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Old 06-04-2011, 09:56 AM   #485
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I found the problem. Don't know how I missed it. The motor has clearly overheated because there is melted plastic or glue that has come from the strator and is rubbing against the rotor.

Now I'm wondering what is the best course of action:

1. buy a new motor. Would the rotor still be good or not if the strator has had what I described happened? Perhaps can use the rotor's as backups?

2. cut the glue away so it doesnt bind on the rotor. Has the motor lost performance now that if I get rid of the glue it will still not be 100%

3. Buy a new strator. Would the rotor and other bits still be good or not?

Time for a new temp gun as well as the motor's have been seeing 50-70 degrees Celsius on average including today according to the temp gun.
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Old 06-04-2011, 05:15 PM   #486
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Try option two, it wont cost you anything and if you still have no joy then maybe look further.

I am sure I read on this thread that someone else had a similar problem and they just cut the glue or plastic away (what ever it was) and she was good to go.

If I remember there was photo's also showing what happened.

Good luck.
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Old 06-06-2011, 08:33 AM   #487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J-PaP View Post
I found the problem. Don't know how I missed it. The motor has clearly overheated because there is melted plastic or glue that has come from the strator and is rubbing against the rotor.

Now I'm wondering what is the best course of action:

1. buy a new motor. Would the rotor still be good or not if the strator has had what I described happened? Perhaps can use the rotor's as backups?

2. cut the glue away so it doesnt bind on the rotor. Has the motor lost performance now that if I get rid of the glue it will still not be 100%

3. Buy a new strator. Would the rotor and other bits still be good or not?

Time for a new temp gun as well as the motor's have been seeing 50-70 degrees Celsius on average including today according to the temp gun.
Try cutting out whatever is causing the bind and see how the performance is. You might not need a new motor. It's worth a shot.

I think you probably overheated it by being under geared. 6:1 FDR seems extremely high for a 21.5. What speed control? Boosted or non-boosted?
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Old 06-06-2011, 08:58 AM   #488
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I've put a new motor in for now and run that at the next race with my old settings. In the mean time I'll cut the gunk out of the motor and run that in one of the races during the day and compare the times. That should indicate if the motor is any good still. The gunk has set pretty hard so will have to use a dremel (blade wouldnt cut into it)


Running 21.5 boosted with a speed passion gt2.1 pro stock esc.

According to the speed passion thread when I asked for some help with settings. was told me the ratio of 5.0-5.4 is too low and I should be running 6-6.5 by the speed passion rep. Clearly that was wrong given what has happened so I've reverted back to a 5.2 ratio as last race I ran a 5.0 and wasn't happy with the midfield speed.
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Old 06-06-2011, 09:12 AM   #489
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Originally Posted by J-PaP View Post
I've put a new motor in for now and run that at the next race with my old settings. In the mean time I'll cut the gunk out of the motor and run that in one of the races during the day and compare the times. That should indicate if the motor is any good still. The gunk has set pretty hard so will have to use a dremel (blade wouldnt cut into it)


Running 21.5 boosted with a speed passion gt2.1 pro stock esc.

According to the speed passion thread when I asked for some help with settings. was told me the ratio of 5.0-5.4 is too low and I should be running 6-6.5 by the speed passion rep. Clearly that was wrong given what has happened so I've reverted back to a 5.2 ratio as last race I ran a 5.0 and wasn't happy with the midfield speed.
When I was running the Speed Passion speedo with a Duo2 17.5 I was running about a 5.0-5.2 for 17.5 boosted, I always found the SP speedo needs much more gear than a Tekin. So I would think you should be in the mid 4's for the FDR with a 21.5. Just food for thought.
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Old 06-06-2011, 09:16 AM   #490
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I was running a 4.2 and averaging temps of around 70degrees c. Then another guy with the same motor/speedy switched to a 5.1-5.2 and was getting better top speed than me while running at only 50-60 degrees c. Hence I started looking at trying a different ratio.

Funnily enough I had better acceleration/midfield performance with the 4.2 ratio than I did when I tried a 5.0 ratio. Though with the 4.2 I lacked top speed. Seems a bit backwards to me but I guess the esc settings affected that.

Last edited by J-PaP; 06-06-2011 at 09:57 AM.
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Old 06-15-2011, 08:57 PM   #491
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Default What went wrong?

TRACK: basically size of two tennis courts with max 70 feet straight + infield.

Running Tekin RS Pro with 21.5 D3

Initial testing on weekend gave me the following setting:
FDR 6.44

Start 2800
End 10000
Boost: 50
Turbo: 12
Delay:.04
Ramp: 3

Motor timing: + 2, I think this is 16 Deg? (Correct me if wrong)

I kept temping motor after every 2 min and was coming off at 50 - 65 c.

Then did a 5 min run with above settings and came off at 70 dec c. all seemed ok unit race night.

1st Race: Felt good throughout race, managed to pick up 3rd.

Then i changed the following on the RS:

End RPM: 11800
Turbo: 10
Ramp: 2

2nd Race: POOF smoked it
Had heaps of pace for first 2min and then dropped off really noticably and then came to complete STOP!

I'm trying to understand where things went wrong as testing was pretty gradual and I was watching the Temps regularly...one conclusion is Motor was over timed and second race I changed too many variable at once...ANY IDEAS
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Last edited by Ravz; 06-15-2011 at 10:20 PM.
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Old 06-15-2011, 09:41 PM   #492
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Not sure if I am following your notes correctly...

Are you are running 50 Boost, 10-12 Turbo ("timing" by your description) and 16 degrees on your motor?

That is way too much timing for that poor 21.5 to cope with.

I do not use any timing on the D1/D3 motors when using ramped modes. All timing came out of how I programmed my RS2.

In you testing you may have initially gotten in a few "hot laps"; but, I doubt that lasted very long if you ran full throttle most of the time.

Others may have more to say about your gearing and 21.5 motors. I got out of TC several months ago.

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Old 06-15-2011, 09:57 PM   #493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravz View Post
TRACK: basically size of two tennis courts with max 70 feet straight + infield.

Running Tekin RS Pro with 21.5 D3

Initial testing on weekend gave me the following setting:
FDR 6.44

Start 2800
End 10000
Boost: 50
Timing: 12
Delay:.04
Ramp: 3

Motor timing: + 2, I think this is 16 Deg? (Correct me if wrong)

I kept temping motor after every 2 min and was coming off at 50 - 65 c.

Then did a 5 min run with above settings and came off at 70 dec c. all seemed ok unit race night.

1st Race: Felt good throughout race, managed to pick up 3rd.

Then i changed the following on the RS:

End RPM: 11800
Timing: 10
Ramp: 2

2nd Race: POOF smoked it
Had heaps of pace for first 2min and then dropped off really noticably and then came to complete STOP!

I'm trying to understand where things went wrong as testing was pretty gradual and I was watching the Temps regularly...one conclusion is Motor was over timed and second race I changed too many variable at once...ANY IDEAS
That is a lot of timing, but I think you are way under geared more then anything. I run my boosted 17.5 TC at 5.9-6.0 FDR on a similar sized track. Not to say that is 100% your problem because I also had a D3 go for no inexplicable reason...
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Old 06-15-2011, 10:33 PM   #494
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Well needless to say I've had to go back to the drawing board on this one...

I've ordered a new stator and will take an extreemly conservative approach next time.

1. FDR 6.7+
2. Motor Timing 'ZERO' - to start with...
3. Tune RS to get max timing whilst keeping temps way cool
4. Get new and more accurate Temp gun!

I've been running SP b4 and no issues with temps.

I've been in the hobby 3 years+ now and this was my first cooking, bit disappointed I guess!
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Old 06-15-2011, 10:43 PM   #495
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Understood about disappointed; but, now educated in one variation of over-timing and under-gearing.

Bill...a pretty conservative motor/ESC tuner when I was doing TC...
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