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Old 04-09-2002, 11:27 AM   #16
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Hobbipro and others that don't understand the terms- here's a quick definition so you can follow along:

Ride Height- The distance between the racing surface and the bottom or lowest measuring point of the chassis when the car is at full race weight (minus the body for convenience) and the suspension if fully adjusted.

Droop- What it ACTUALLY is, is the downtravel of the suspension from loaded to unloaded under racing conditions. What is NORMALLY measured and reported on set up sheets is the distance from a certain point of the suspension arm to the racing surface (with the suspension unloaded) that is only relative to the type of tool being used and the way the person is measuring it. This is the measurement that we are bringing to attention here in this thread becasue it lacks a standard method measuring and reporting.

You should NEVER (as far I know) run your car with the droop screws forcing the ride height down. Tossolini say the suspesion is "sprung" in that condition. I call it preload which is not good for these r/c cars. In some larger (read- much, much heavier) racing, there is a time when you might use preload. Of course, I'm only talking about cars with a spring suspension- not rigid.

Dave- I just read your last post and I agree that droop is very important. I just had a thought- maybe we should get away from the confusing term "droop" and start calling it what it is: downtravel. I don't know of any other type of racing where they call the downtravel of the suspension from loaded to unloaded "droop" ..... Droop is what the old lady next door's........ maybe I better not describe it... LOL

Last edited by BigDogRacing; 04-09-2002 at 11:35 AM.
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Old 04-09-2002, 01:58 PM   #17
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haha, it is tough for someone (even myself) to make sense of it because it works backwards. ex: your droop is at 5mm and you want to add 2mm of droop what would it be? To add 2mm, your droop would be 3mm. No big deal, but it confuses people that to add you have to subtract.
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Old 04-09-2002, 02:19 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by BigDogRacing

..... Droop is what the old lady next door's........ maybe I better not describe it... LOL
mawhahahahaha, damn that was funny BDR.
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Old 04-09-2002, 02:20 PM   #19
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I'm coming in to this late, but (as if you needed another reason...)

A problem that I find frustrating is when you are trying to use someone elses setup and they say they are running N droop. It's rarely stated where exactly they are measuring from. Each of my cars hub carrier assembly is different and there are often several places that you could measure droop from. The question always comes up "did he measure from the lowest point, the center of the hingepin, etc?" I like the idea of the difference in ride height and full suspension extension.
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Old 04-09-2002, 02:58 PM   #20
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Do I set droop for high traction to bumpy to high traction right?
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Old 04-09-2002, 02:59 PM   #21
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According to the AE manual (Shock travel) they mention the following:

If your track is bumpy, you may want to add droop to your car by going to a lower gauge step, if your track has very high traction, then you may want to take droop out of your car by going higher on the droop gauge. Too little drrop will cause a loss of traction.

The settings in the manul call for the car to be at 6mm ride height front and rear. If this holds true then you want to set your down travel by the conditions of the track not by the ride height.

bumpy track, little traction = less droop
high traction smooth surface = more droop

Is this correct?
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Old 04-09-2002, 03:19 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mike F

bumpy track, little traction = less droop
high traction smooth surface = more droop

Is this correct?
Nope, this is incorrect. Lets take the high traction track settings. You would actually run less droop (higher # on the gauge). This takes away shock travel and gives the car less roll, so the car will become more agile / quicker response as opposed to running more droop (lower # on gauge) because with more the car has more travel and is allowed to roll deeper (farther) so it will take longer for it to switch left to right. The benefit of more droop is on bumpy tracks, makes the car react slower so it doesn't get thrown around as much.

If you have trouble remembering what it is, replace the word droop with travel. So for a high traction track you want less travel and for a bumpy track you want more travel.
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Old 04-09-2002, 03:34 PM   #23
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aah hha (said like Eddie Murphy in coming to america). Thanks, make sense David.

I see in the manual where it shows that.

Higher Traction
less droop(travel) (higher number on the gauge)
<-----------------

More bumps
more droop(travel) (lower number on the droop gauge)
------------------>

Last edited by Mike F; 04-09-2002 at 03:38 PM.
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Old 04-09-2002, 06:29 PM   #24
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One more thing about high grip. If you run a lot of droop, you will be more likely to traction roll. Take some droop out and it can help a lot.
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Old 04-09-2002, 07:46 PM   #25
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So do you want more rear droop? or is it a personal preference? I would think a standard value, say 3mm would make the car seem flatter, or is more rear droop desired because most of the enertia and weight transfer takes place in the front in a corner?
Also, how do you set "tweek" on a TC? I know you check it by lifting the front, or rear in the center of the chassis at that end to see which tire comes off the ground first. But what next? How is it corrected? With the car I have the battery runs down one side, and naturally that side is a little heavier than the electronics side, so is'nt tweek inevitable? Again, thanks for any info.
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Old 04-10-2002, 10:53 AM   #26
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psycho - good point, this is a great way to stop that.

hobbipro - I always start my droop the same front to rear and then adjust to personal tastes. For instance right now my car is running more droop in the rear because I want more off power steering. By having more travel in the rear, it will allow for more transef of weight to the front wheels while off power.

Now (tweak) once you see the right wheel lift first in the front, tighten the left rear shock collar about a quarter turn and try again. remember that everytime you check the tweak to press down on the opposite end of the suspension to set it to correct ride height. Repeat this process until they lift evenly. Be aware that a old set of spring could have different lengths (shoot even new springs for that matter) so sometimes one collar will be much lower then the other. It is real bad, then you may want to unload your whole car (unless you have a xxxs), you do this by loosening your top plate and twist the car a little, set on a flat surface like a car stand and tighten the screws back down. This lets some of the memory go and allows it to reset itself.
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Old 04-11-2002, 09:28 AM   #27
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Hobbipro- assuming you are starting from a conservative and equal downtravel (front to rear) that is about correct for the type of racing surface you will be racing on, increasing the downtravel on one end of the car will increase traction on the opposite end. So if you need more steering (not turn in, just overall steering) increase the rear downtravel.

Here's a Q for you Dave- Say your car is set with 3mm downtravel front and rear, and the car is a little assy. How do you know whether to increae th front downtravel, or decrease the rear downtravel? Obviously the best answer is to try both, but that's not alway possible when time is a concern.

Just so you guys know- Dave is an awesome racer with a lot of experience. Atomic Ron (19turn Snowbirds winner) wouldn't be anywhere near as good as he is now without Dave. Ron was good before- don't get me wrong- but not on the national level like he is now.

Hey Dave, are you guys going to run the Mod Off Raod Nats in New Caney? I'm trying to figure out a way to scrape up the cash to run...
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Old 04-11-2002, 09:41 AM   #28
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BigDogRacing - That is a great question and I honestly couldn't tell you the answer, they are both right and would accomplish the same thing, something I need to test.

I am running the mod nats this year, Ron is staying at the shop.
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Old 04-11-2002, 10:19 AM   #29
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hey arent droop gauges like the hudy and integy(i own) just for making sure that your droop settings are the same from left to right and to compare front to rear. i think that it would be a good idea to have a standard test so we could compare settings but cant everyone just make there own adjustment from stock. also i just finished building my new xxxs today and was thinking that i might just leave the droop screws out and adjust it with shock length. it seems as though the bumpers are a little too flexy.
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Old 04-11-2002, 10:26 AM   #30
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OK I have read this thread now about 3 times and I think I have the general idea; but I am still a bit confused.
Could some of you more enlightened ones tell me if this is a good way to set the droop on my TC3?:

1. Back out the droop screws so that they are no affesting anything
2. Set the ride height using the threaded shock collars
3. Screw the droop screws back into the wishbones until the springs are nearly 'trapped' - with about 1mm gap so that you can grab the spring and move it up and down a bit.

This method seems to give me unevenness (sp?) from side to side ie the shock collars are at different places on the shocks and the wishbones (unloaded) are not equal - say the right one is angled down 5 degrees and the left one is horizontal for example.

Is this an ok way of doin it or could anyone suggest a better way please.
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