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Old 06-16-2010, 06:12 PM   #241
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Wow, thats a bit harsh. Apparently you didnt read enough.
The esc situation is handled and quite easily. The ROAR list makes sense and the SP Cirtix is an available option. Clearly it will be the popular choice simply based on price but at least there's choices. And the 21.5 will be available as an option to those who want it.
Tires haven't changed...except any club or race organizer has the additional option of the 2 compounds of HPI 26mm slick. No temp ranges, no major choices....Just 2 compounds. Dont use them or use them....Only 1 insert is being proposed. HPI #4677. Which happens to be the same insert that comes with the x-patterns.
As for gluing...you're right. Its a fact of life and a minor situation at best.
Wheel choices remain large.....another reason for pushing the HPI 26mm slick.
And manufacturer support is exactly WHY this proposal is being made. HPI is the most important supporter and I think we all know it. Every effort is being made to keep that relationship strong and indeed strengthen others (like SP ) without isolating others for no good reason.
Read that again...you'll find that there isn't a huge departure from the existing rules....just updating them. If anything they should help to strengthen the program and make things more stable...which is what every new driver looks for. And yes, VTA is a damned good example but RCGT isn't VTA and it isn't TC. As for a bridge....couldn't care less. Like I said before....the ladder is always there, some will climb it and others won't. Pray that I'm right or you'll have a very transient driver base in spec specific classes like VTA. God knows I don't see you guys grooming people to LEAVE VTA...if anything you've made a considerable effort to keep them involved.
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Old 06-16-2010, 06:19 PM   #242
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See ...we weren't that far apart after all. But I appreciate it none the less. It won't get solved unless everybody talks honestly. Lord knows we wouldn't expect anything less from you.
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Old 06-16-2010, 10:43 PM   #243
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and whats arong with this?

Here is how to get the RCGT Challenge started at your local track:
- Any 1/10th scale 4WD Touring Car chassis.
- Any "realistic/scale" Touring Car/GT body (No "Race" bodies, Stratus, Mazda 6 etc.)
- Bodies should represent models that are running or had been run in the Touring Car, GT2, GT1 classes in ALMS, LeMans, Speed Challenge etc.
- Any 26mm spoked wheels (no dish wheels)

Allowable X-Pattern tire choices are up to the race organizer, with competitiveness and cost in mind:
- HPI #4790 X-Pattern Radial Tire 26mm D-Compound (base spec tire)
- HPI #4490 X-Pattern Radial Tire Pro Compound 26mm (stickier compound for improved traction)
- HPI #4495 X-Pattern Radial Belted Tire Pro Compound 26mm (sticky and belted tire, allows for more speed)
- Kit Lexan wing (flat realistic wing if included) or Plastic realistic wing set(s) only (keeping in mind the spirit of realism of the class)
- 27T/17.5 Motor Limit.
- 6 cell NiMH or 2 cell LiPo 7.2/7.4v battery limit.
- Suggested minimum weight limit: 1450 grams
- Sportsman ROAR ESC or Scale Nats ESC selection



Keeping the spirit of the class, scale realism, the final decisions on specs should be decided by each local track/organizer and should reflect the local flavor of the track/racers.

sounds like a winner to me
Only thing I would change is the NiMH and weight to 1475.

Ok, I am just being cantankerous now. I like this list! I'd still make a strong pitch to Citrix combo and, if later it proves very well and durable, the Blast Off tires.

We're trying to make the RCGT class as appealing and inviting to beginners as possible. So if we can keep the costs down as much as possible, then blamo, the class should take off in my opinion.
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Old 06-17-2010, 07:17 AM   #244
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I took a look at the tires you guys were talking about. 4435 is the B 15-40, which is the Pro2 tire. That is a decent tire. The 4415 is a slick, but the same material as the pro compound X patterns. I would think the 4435 would be better, especially as HPi says "These excellent tires are longer-wearing than our Pro Compound Slicks, but provide more grip. "

The insert, 4677, is the low bounce insert, which actually should work very well. It is a LOT different than what comes with the Xpattern, it's more like a memory foam.

If you guys are serious about changing tires, it would probably help if somebody tests this stuff. Preferably at a track that is eating the current tires.
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Old 06-17-2010, 08:16 AM   #245
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I took a look at the tires you guys were talking about. 4435 is the B 15-40, which is the Pro2 tire. That is a decent tire. The 4415 is a slick, but the same material as the pro compound X patterns. I would think the 4435 would be better, especially as HPi says "These excellent tires are longer-wearing than our Pro Compound Slicks, but provide more grip. "

The insert, 4677, is the low bounce insert, which actually should work very well. It is a LOT different than what comes with the Xpattern, it's more like a memory foam.

If you guys are serious about changing tires, it would probably help if somebody tests this stuff. Preferably at a track that is eating the current tires.


That would be my track. I should take a picture of the surface and how coarse it is. Even parking lots have smoother surfaces.

I'm not joking either, but I will snap a picture and let you all be the judge.

But in defense, it is one of the best tracks around in my opinion.
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Old 06-17-2010, 08:58 AM   #246
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If you guys are serious about changing tires, it would probably help if somebody tests this stuff. Preferably at a track that is eating the current tires.
Our track has a smooth surface, but it is grippy for asphalt and can create the X-Pattern death groove pretty quickly.

I want to test the 4435 slicks and 4677 inserts as soon as I can get my hands on some. Does anyone know a place that has them in stock?
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Old 06-17-2010, 09:10 AM   #247
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Theres a few on Ebay, Pete. I'll be testing them in 2 weeks myself. Happened to have 2-3 new sets from awhile back and now I get to use them. Being a belted radial, I'm hoping the wear is quite good. Also, that insert is actually suggested for use with this tire on the HPI site.
The last time I tried these they were pretty damed good. I had planned on a Touring Car Oval class and they were the tires of choice. With 19t power in oval on our concrete surface they worked really well.
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Old 06-17-2010, 09:11 AM   #248
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woops, sorry...double post
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Old 06-17-2010, 09:15 AM   #249
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I took a look at the tires you guys were talking about. 4435 is the B 15-40, which is the Pro2 tire. That is a decent tire. The 4415 is a slick, but the same material as the pro compound X patterns. I would think the 4435 would be better, especially as HPi says "These excellent tires are longer-wearing than our Pro Compound Slicks, but provide more grip. "

The insert, 4677, is the low bounce insert, which actually should work very well. It is a LOT different than what comes with the Xpattern, it's more like a memory foam.

If you guys are serious about changing tires, it would probably help if somebody tests this stuff. Preferably at a track that is eating the current tires.
I actually called HPI regarding those inserts. Can't guarantee that every CSR knows their products well but I was told the 4677 insert was the same as in the x-pattern. Somebody confirm when they get a set.
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Old 06-17-2010, 09:37 AM   #250
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I want to test the 4435 slicks and 4677 inserts as soon as I can get my hands on some. Does anyone know a place that has them in stock?
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Theres a few on Ebay, Pete.
Are they normally more readily available? Definitely something to consider if supply is flaky. One of the good things about X-Patterns is that I've never had anything close to a problem getting my hands on them.
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Old 06-17-2010, 09:56 AM   #251
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I actually called HPI regarding those inserts. Can't guarantee that every CSR knows their products well but I was told the 4677 insert was the same as in the x-pattern. Somebody confirm when they get a set.
The xpattern insert just regular open cell foam. The low bounce is denser, and more rubbery. Yokomo used to sell a "non-repulsion" insert, which was similar.
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Old 06-17-2010, 10:01 AM   #252
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Tamiya tires, like the one that came in my TA-105 v2 with Upgrade Pack has tires with a similar foam as well. It feels like the foam in temperapedic bed, but much softer and forms back into shape after being pressed.
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Old 06-17-2010, 10:43 AM   #253
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Ok All...great news. Just got off the phone with HPI and it looks like we won't have much of a problem with their support for the rule updates !! Thanks Andy !!
Regarding the tires: Rob, you were right....I asked Andy for clarification on the 4677 inserts and they ARE different and in his words....better !!
I asked about availability. Tires, like any other product , go through phases of availability. At some times good and other times a bit leaner. On the business end, HPI IS moving toward making some changes in the tire line. Whats of great interest is that they are getting support for slick tire choices from their outside corporate interests. As we all know, some rc companies produce "branded" tire lines. Bottom line is that availability is only a part of the equation. Tire choices, like any other aspect, can be adjusted at a later time but at least it looks like slick tires will be a viable option in the rules. Things are looking good. I've promised Andy I'll submit the entire revised list of rules via e-mail and, if he sees no problems, he'll post them in the rcgt section on HPI's site. It was a great conversation and I think HPI will be happy with our efforts.
We, as drivers , will still have to help administer things. There's no way we can expect HPI to run the "daily" operation of the RCGT program. I'll volunteer my help. Anyone else please PM me and we'll talk.
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Old 06-17-2010, 10:49 AM   #254
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http://www.hpiracing.com/products/en/4677/

If you want to read more about the inserts and what they look like.

Evoracer, that is awesome news!! Any other details you can share with us?
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Old 06-17-2010, 11:03 AM   #255
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Let me gather all the details and I'll post the rules package in a little bit. These are all the things that we've discussed and seen a general acceptance of. No need to rehash anything. And remember. everybody realizes that rules won't be popular with 100% of the people. If you're part of that minority please try and remember something my favorite Vulcan once said...."the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" Thanks again to everybody who's been involved with this discussion. It really has been a good one.
On that note, I'd like to start a new RCGT thread as soon as I get all the details to HPI and feel confident we have a go. I know one exists in the Racing forum but I'd like to see one on this forum. Any thoughts ??
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