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Old 03-19-2010, 04:01 PM   #226
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All of these crazy rules are just blowing my mind and are totally unnecessary...

Lets keep it simple

Sportsman (no sponsored drivers): 21.5 motors
Stock: 17.5 motors
Mod: any motor (Only class ran at the national event level)

Speed controls simply won't matter if you limit the power of the motors. Yes things will get faster, but that has been the natural progression of racing since the dawn of time. In mod the speedo has never been a factor...always goes back to the power of the motor.

I am sure you will all find a way to pick this apart..so have at it. Nothing is going to change unless we find an easy solution. The more complicated the rules the harder it will be to get newer people into the hobby.
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Old 03-19-2010, 04:02 PM   #227
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Originally Posted by L.Fairtrace View Post
I like what you are saying can I subscribe to your blahg?

Seriously though when is someone going to step up and have a real Euro style carpet race here in the us. A track that is 160x90 where mod laptimes are in the 18 second range like the ETS races?

One thing I love about Roar is the fact they run Triple A mains, ALL BIG RACES SHOULD FOLLOW THIS FORMAT. Its lovely we race all week have 4 tries at qualifying and get peeled on the first lap from behind int he main an the last 4 days mean nothing.

ALL big races should be qual points also. I know this may hurt a guy like me but I think it would help us all be better racers. Roar should change all onroad races back to this format including the carpet nats.
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Old 03-19-2010, 04:03 PM   #228
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Originally Posted by syndr0me View Post
The Europeans manage to run mod even on the tight tracks. Although can you imagine this track with 2x4's? I think you're on to something here.

+ YouTube Video
ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


I'm still firmly in scrubville based on my big-race performances, but... I raced 17.5 on a 96x42 track last night (typically I run 13.5, and have been practicing with 5.5) and it felt like a giant turd. Driving strapped everywhere and having to keep the car an inch from the boards? Man, you can keep it. There are so many guys out there far better than myself that seem obsessed with going slower. Guys that get parts for cheaper or free. I don't get it.
Look at all those Hotlaps.
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Old 03-19-2010, 04:12 PM   #229
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I agree onthis to a point. I think th classes should be:
21.5 sportsman-no sponcerships
17.5/13.5 to be determined by track size
Mod
If you win in sportsman you move up to the 17.5/13.5 class. If you win 17.5/13.5 class you move up to Mod.

Quote:
Originally Posted by artwork View Post
All of these crazy rules are just blowing my mind and are totally unnecessary...

Lets keep it simple

Sportsman (no sponsored drivers): 21.5 motors
Stock: 17.5 motors
Mod: any motor (Only class ran at the national event level)

Speed controls simply won't matter if you limit the power of the motors. Yes things will get faster, but that has been the natural progression of racing since the dawn of time. In mod the speedo has never been a factor...always goes back to the power of the motor.

I am sure you will all find a way to pick this apart..so have at it. Nothing is going to change unless we find an easy solution. The more complicated the rules the harder it will be to get newer people into the hobby.
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Old 03-19-2010, 04:57 PM   #230
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Originally Posted by Rich Browne View Post
Each type of racing would have it's own ranking.

Each type of event (local, sectional, regional and national) would carry a weighting profile.

Only specific types of racing would count (TBD).
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Originally Posted by trackdesigner71 View Post
1. Rich sends me a list of the types of racing that will be ranked
2. work out a basic mathematical equation to calculate points and determine the appropriate weighting profile and calculate that into the formula

It shouldt take calculus to do something like that...a lot of keyboard work Im sure but teh math shouldnt be hard once all that is mapped out
And another rathole begins with who makes the weight system and what each track/race is worth....
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Old 03-19-2010, 06:28 PM   #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syndr0me View Post
The Europeans manage to run mod even on the tight tracks. Although can you imagine this track with 2x4's? I think you're on to something here.

+ YouTube Video
ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.
This is Alexander Hagberg's quote from his blog about that exact track:

"It was a shame really. The track layout was, in my opinion, too narrow and too technical for touring car racing."


http://hagberg.blogs.se/2010/03/08/c...rctic-8141324/

What would be said about our tracks?
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Old 03-19-2010, 06:32 PM   #232
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Also, this was proposed in like 2002, yet here we are 8 years later......

http://www.rctech.net/forum/electric...ts-system.html


It's all laid out, there is no rathole. This CAN be done
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:09 PM   #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robk View Post
This is Alexander Hagberg's quote from his blog about that exact track:

"It was a shame really. The track layout was, in my opinion, too narrow and too technical for touring car racing."


http://hagberg.blogs.se/2010/03/08/c...rctic-8141324/

What would be said about our tracks?
Wow, I would love to try some euro style tracks. I do agree with him though I feel that many of the tracks are way too tight and far better suited to 12th scale.
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:10 PM   #234
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I don't go along with everyone going 1 cell lipo. But then I'm just a member.I'll go on a subject about ROAR that I know all to well - the Region directors.They have been and all have been under used - treated like a Red Headed step child.Again what is there job now since 2004 to the present?They catch or used to catch all the heat at any race they attended.They were underpaided and most suggestions were put on the burner. Then after reading here come some of my suggestion that were made years ago.
National-AMA has there yearly nationals at the same place I believe.I made the same suggestions many times in the past.
Changing the subject on the rubber tires on TC cars was put there because it was supposed to give drivers a even chance. All that HP could not be put to the ground. Well the foam guys got cut out and complained and TC started allowing foam tires.
No matter what with motors and ESC things will ALWAY get faster.When I started every year the motors got faster.We are now faster than mod was when I started.
Also when I started there was just two types of car 1/12th and 1/8th nitro 2wd. When 4wd came in for the nitro guys and the expense got higher they started losing drivers.The same could be said about TC the expense of the car is driving racers away. When a pan car is as much as a off-road car why?There is way less parts- boy have I heard that many times.
I'll think of more stuff to put out there since I don't have to watch what I say anymore.
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:37 PM   #235
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A couple things.

First off we never had smoke filled back rooms, unfortunately it was snail mail, conference calls and a fax, if you where lucky.

ROAR had tried advertising in different mags a few times in the past.

What ROAR gets you? Although everyone is looking from the bottom up, you should remember that, if not for ROAR, there would be no seats for competitors in the IFMAR Worlds competitions.

ROAR should look at taxing (for no better word) every item that is sold as as a ROAR approved piece, then with that money income they could have a better operating budget to do some of the things that are suggested all the while having lower membership fees. It would also give ROAR some bite in having a say in what is and what is not allowed. ROAR approved used to mean something, now its just a after thought, importers and manufacturers don't really need the seal of approval. How does the power get back into ROARs hands.

With the above said ROAR should sell themselves to these bigger races such as the IIC or Birds. I don't think a take over is the answer as they both seem to have their shows well established, but to have some presence at these races in a official capacity could be a step in the right direction. Or even just giving it the ROAR approved thumbs up event seal of approval. Perhaps making one into some form of a "National" regognition type race.

Ranking should be pretty easy, track size makes no difference. Its done in so many different forms of competition that never have similar standards, but still done. (Remembering its still toy cars racing for bowling trophies, its just a number). The thought of top positions in regionals to seat for nationals has been considered before, but it seems as though Nationals not being filled to capacity numbers makes this a useless criteria.

I still think that just lowering the capacity of the 2s Lipo and decreasing the weight would be a better alternative to 1s or LiFe. JMO
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Old 03-19-2010, 09:29 PM   #236
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Hey Johnny, that's not a half bad solution you bring up - I've thought of that a few times myself:

Option 4) Change the battery dimensions (which then changes the available capacity) to about 1/5th of what it is now for Stock. That would put the packs at about 1000mah capacity. Before you laugh, give it some thought: It doesn't matter what motor you run, you are limited to only drawing that 1000mah over the course of the race. Gearing and motor selection become priority (and YES Seaball, this is looking backwards to the point of a cricked neck) to make run time.
No blown motors
"Boost" ESCs - will they help or hurt?
Lighter cars = less breakage and tire wear
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Old 03-19-2010, 09:45 PM   #237
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Palmer View Post
Option 4) Change the battery dimensions (which then changes the available capacity) to about 1/5th of what it is now for Stock. That would put the packs at about 1000mah capacity. Before you laugh, give it some thought: It doesn't matter what motor you run, you are limited to only drawing that 1000mah over the course of the race. Gearing and motor selection become priority (and YES Seaball, this is looking backwards to the point of a cricked neck) to make run time.
No blown motors
"Boost" ESCs - will they help or hurt?
Lighter cars = less breakage and tire wear
Of course, using that 1000mAh (100% depth of discharge) effectively kills that pack, dropping the per cell voltage below the safe voltage per cell. So now we're supposed to use one run LiPo packs? NiMH was more tolerant of over-discharge than LiPos are. LiPo cutoffs in the ESC will be kicking in well before the race is over. That will be popular with the newbies.
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Old 03-19-2010, 09:57 PM   #238
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So what do you propose as a solution Joe?

Its too easy to shoot holes in everyone else's thought process - that's not what we're here for. We're listening - talk to us.
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Old 03-19-2010, 10:14 PM   #239
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I agree completely.


Quote:
Originally Posted by artwork View Post
All of these crazy rules are just blowing my mind and are totally unnecessary...

Lets keep it simple

Sportsman (no sponsored drivers): 21.5 motors
Stock: 17.5 motors
Mod: any motor (Only class ran at the national event level)

Speed controls simply won't matter if you limit the power of the motors. Yes things will get faster, but that has been the natural progression of racing since the dawn of time. In mod the speedo has never been a factor...always goes back to the power of the motor.

I am sure you will all find a way to pick this apart..so have at it. Nothing is going to change unless we find an easy solution. The more complicated the rules the harder it will be to get newer people into the hobby.
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Old 03-19-2010, 10:20 PM   #240
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+1 to simple.
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