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Old 01-30-2010, 11:08 AM   #61
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The decline in on-road is directly related to basing class's on the motors & not by experience....

And the fact that factory drivers are racing stock has only made this problem even more dire..

The new racers ?

They have no class to play and thus there is no new blood coming for the sport to live on...

DOOM to Fail

unless this all changes.....
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Old 01-30-2010, 11:14 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cherry View Post
The decline in on-road is directly related to basing class's on the motors & not by experience....

And the fact that factory drivers are racing stock has only made this problem even more dire..

The new racers ?

They have no class to play and thus there is no new blood coming for the sport to live on...

DOOM to Fail

unless this all changes.....
So what's the answer? I assume that you run offroad so where do you put the new racers at the track?
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Old 01-30-2010, 11:21 AM   #63
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Now that I've put my foot in the circle I'll share a little background.

20yrs ago I raced 1/8 2wd onroad and 1/10 elec off. (claim to fame in 1/8 was a "D" main at the "McCoy" race... But I digress..) Had the same issues then with elec. 1/8 not so much. You knew what you were getting into.

So, fast forward to about a year ago. Thought it would be cool to get back into it with my 12yr old son. Our track has a stock 18r class. Seemed a good place to start. After the first day I found out that "stock" was a pretty blurry line. Stock meant a "dime" sized pinion, lipo, and aftermarket tires..Hmmm. No biggie. You adapt. Or not. That was the choice. (Was fun to watch my kid lap guys with highend aftermarket chassis though.)

Now I'm doing the 17.5 class. Won't call it stock as some alluded to already. You know the rest. Maybe that's the answer in part. What the class is called. Would people be happier if it was called something different? Then you'd know what you were signing up for.

All I know is that we're having fun racing and hanging out with friends, trying to better ourselves on the track. It would be nice if our numbers were higher. Right now the biggest class is the "Slash" class. We through out some wooden box jumps and everyone laughs for 5 minutes. Go figure...

I know this did'nt solve any problems, but could it be we have a tendency to make them bigger that they are?

Rob.......
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Old 01-30-2010, 11:26 AM   #64
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The answer is simple

Stop the experience drivers from racing stock....

In off-road the experience & best drivers do move up to mod ....

They do not have Barry Baker's or Ryan C racing stock off road ....
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Last edited by Wild Cherry; 01-30-2010 at 11:59 AM.
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Old 01-30-2010, 11:53 AM   #65
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Aha! Maybe onto something here.

Other forms of competition I've done have been rated by ability. Novice, intermediate, expert. Amature, pro.
I know we attempt that by having some stock and mod classes. It's "assumed" stock is for novices and mod for those of higher skill. That is'nt working is it?

Would'nt be easy to pull off but I don't think there is an easy answer...

Rob..........
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Old 01-30-2010, 12:05 PM   #66
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Maybe this is too obvious of a solution....???

If TC races were extended in length, say from 5 minutes to 7 or even (***gasp***) 8 minutes, this might help to slow down the relative speed of the classes. Advanced timing, mechanical and electronic, would have to be reduced to make the longer run times.
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Old 01-30-2010, 12:14 PM   #67
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Maybe this is too obvious of a solution....???

If TC races were extended in length, say from 5 minutes to 7 or even (***gasp***) 8 minutes, this might help to slow down the relative speed of the classes. Advanced timing, mechanical and electronic, would have to be reduced to make the longer run times.
Exactly my point.... but some will argue to say it would then boil down to the battery war...

Its nice to see others with the same thoughts as mine...
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Old 01-30-2010, 12:39 PM   #68
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Good call on the race time idea. It was mentioned elsewhere about times past and how a premium was placed on strategy. Gear too high and you dump. I remember that. Then back to the battery issue.... Always going to be a compromise.

That may slow down the "stock" classes. Now how do we make it inviting for someone looking into the hobby? A safe place for them and the more skilled drivers? Right now a "slower" stock class is still no place for a beginner/novice.

Rob.......
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Old 01-30-2010, 12:45 PM   #69
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Another possibility is to fix the FDR for each class. Adjusted accordingly for the layout at each track. Keep batteries at a given set C rating (ie. no more than 30 or 40C). Keep this conditions the same for a full season, then adjust accordingly for next season.

Also, like many have mentioned already, divide the classes based on driver experience. If you want to go faster than stock, but not willing to go mod, then run super stock (13.5 BL motors). It is a nice "in between" class.
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Old 01-30-2010, 01:25 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cherry View Post
The answer is simple

Stop the experience drivers from racing stock....

In off-road the experience & best drivers do move up to mod ....

They do not have Barry Baker's or Ryan C racing stock off road ....
Back when I raced BMX, everything was based on skill level and age. How about skill level and motor for RC. Beginner 17.5, sportsman mod, and pro mod.

With the pro's out of 17.5, it would leave more room for basic equipment in 17.5. Newbs wont go out and buy a RS Pro and a 50c TP pack. So all the newbs could somewhat be on the same playing feild. Once they get good, they go into sportsman mod by amount of wins or podium finishes. Many off road tracks use a similar system and it should be used in on road.

Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Filipow View Post
Maybe this is too obvious of a solution....???

If TC races were extended in length, say from 5 minutes to 7 or even (***gasp***) 8 minutes, this might help to slow down the relative speed of the classes. Advanced timing, mechanical and electronic, would have to be reduced to make the longer run times.
I love and hate this idea.

Hate: The idea of slowing down the racing. Why do all these people wanna slow down racing? It takes a true pro to race at a fast 5 minute pace. Why do all these people wanna take the easy road out? And you would have to have the best batteries again, to make time. Speed is already limited by track size and traction levels in mod. Why make the addition of time?

Love: It will take a true driver to make time and not dump. Now, 6 or 7 minute mod should work with the new technology. But then again, why make it so a racer has to have the best technology? For some people this is a hobby, not a way of life. If we make it a way of life (as in spending huge sums of money to keep up) we will make it impossible to have huge entry numbers in on road. Which is already happening..

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Another possibility is to fix the FDR for each class. Adjusted accordingly for the layout at each track. Keep batteries at a given set C rating (ie. no more than 30 or 40C). Keep this conditions the same for a full season, then adjust accordingly for next season.

Also, like many have mentioned already, divide the classes based on driver experience. If you want to go faster than stock, but not willing to go mod, then run super stock (13.5 BL motors). It is a nice "in between" class.
FDR would be as impossible to tech as speedo software is. People can have new pulleys machined, have different gears with numbers that are untrue milled into them, all kinds of things can happen. It's a idea, for the perfect world. And 13.5 still has all the problems 17.5 has. ESC, battery, $$$$$$$.
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Old 01-30-2010, 02:26 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cherry View Post
The answer is simple

Stop the experience drivers from racing stock....

In off-road the experience & best drivers do move up to mod ....

They do not have Barry Baker's or Ryan C racing stock off road ....
The problem is 90% of experienced drivers don't have the budget to run Modified competitively.

Baker and Cavalieri both MAKE money from this sport, and most likely never ran as competitively as they do now when they weren't "works" drivers.
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Old 01-30-2010, 02:35 PM   #72
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The problem is 90% of experienced drivers don't have the budget to run Modified competitively.

Baker and Cavalieri both MAKE money from this sport, and most likely never ran as competitively as they do now when they weren't "works" drivers.


I only race mod myself, would still be racing Mod on-road but for this very issue....

Price , money or even speed ?

Not the problem ...


Sponsored racers filling the stock class @ the local & national events ?

The real problem ...
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Old 01-30-2010, 02:49 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by Danny-b23 View Post
The problem is 90% of experienced drivers don't have the budget to run Modified competitively.

Baker and Cavalieri both MAKE money from this sport, and most likely never ran as competitively as they do now when they weren't "works" drivers.
As much money that is being spent on the timing advance wars, I don't think it is any cheaper than mod.

Maybe, I don't know
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Old 01-30-2010, 03:30 PM   #74
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The problem is 90% of experienced drivers don't have the budget to run Modified competitively.
But they have all kinds of money to buy something each week that they think will make them go .01 per lap faster.

Funny thing is if you have a product that advertised it would make your stock motor as fast as a 3.5 modified motor then everyone would flock to buy it.

With modified you can one time more power than you will ever need. With stock you are always chasing tenths of seconds. I really don't think mod costs more in the long run.
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Old 01-30-2010, 03:35 PM   #75
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More people need to step up to mod. I did because of the way the spec on road classes have gone. I now am going to be racing offroad mod.
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