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Old 01-15-2010, 05:14 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by ckaspar View Post
I have an idea.

Open motor, open to all drivers, Qualifying is not separated out by class or motor , just times. The faster X percent are in the Pro Class, the next X percent are in Expert, the next X percent are in Sportsman the remainder go in novice.

It seems to me that would stop the sandbagging/moaning/whining/etc.

In short, I could be in a Qual race with Barry Baker, I know he is going to whomp me! He quals for Pro and me for "Get the heck off the track you don't even belong here".

Or for smaller club races base it off of practice times throughout the day or something.

The "Class" seems subjective to me. Am I a Novice or am I Sportsman? Who knows? The only real determination is the amount of times I can get around the track in 5 minutes, how clean I run, etc. That is the real determination in my mind.
That's how the gas guys do it but with that you know where you stand. Unfortunately there are to many electric classes.
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Old 01-15-2010, 05:23 PM   #122
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That's how the gas guys do it but with that you know where you stand.
But it still doesn't stop peeps from sandbagging. One can easily "break" on qualifiers and miraculously win the mains.
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Old 01-15-2010, 05:43 PM   #123
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NO I didn't. (said it last, got my fingers crossed) If I save $10 on a motor, the discount didn't make me faster. I was going to buy the motor anyway. If I bought 9 motors and you could only afford 8 with the same money, did I really get an advantage over you on the track? The same motor, car, speedo, etc... is available to everyone else in the market. My point is that if I drop my sponsors, I'm still the same driver, with the same talent. Now I just pay more for my stuff.

Answer to this problem is: create a new NOVICE / AMATEUR class but still allow sponsored drivers to race 17.5. Choose whatever motor you want for novice, but why force other drivers into a faster class when they are happy with the one they're in?

well said as well as your prev post.... AFter all we only race one set of tires, one motor and one ESC at a time... Having 10 of each in the pits dont help you once u hit the track. Great drivers win races...
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Old 01-15-2010, 05:47 PM   #124
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well said as well as your prev post.... AFter all we only race one set of tires, one motor and one ESC at a time... Having 10 of each in the pits dont help you once u hit the track. Great drivers win races...
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Old 01-15-2010, 05:58 PM   #125
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Surprised no one has mentioned it yet. The one thing it may do is make a few manufacturers rethink some of the 50% sponsorships that they use to move products out the door at a higher price that wholesale. I could see where a bunch of local hobby shops might stand to gain, keep tracks open, giving new racers a place to start.

Talk about thread drift

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Old 01-15-2010, 06:10 PM   #126
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So what wins sells ans at the end of the day money is the goal. People do get faster when they have the best gear because that plays a big role in performance along with practice. So to answer your question that you didn't get faster with discounts is yes you did. .
Using that logic, we should create classes based on your gross income. Because it wouldn't be fair for a grown adult making $100,000 a year to race against a teenage making $1,000 a year. One will clearly have a larger racing budget, regardless of driving talent.


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Originally Posted by stiltskin View Post
NO I didn't. (said it last, got my fingers crossed) If I save $10 on a motor, the discount didn't make me faster. I was going to buy the motor anyway. If I bought 9 motors and you could only afford 8 with the same money, did I really get an advantage over you on the track? The same motor, car, speedo, etc... is available to everyone else in the market. My point is that if I drop my sponsors, I'm still the same driver, with the same talent. Now I just pay more for my stuff. ?
Well put. And it should be noted that a very large percentage of sponsored drivers are just 50% deals. And that is 50% off MSRP, not street pricing. Which in the end works out to only a marginal discount. A full factory driver who gets paid to race probably doesn't belong in stock class. Most of the examples in this thread are for 50% drivers that at most, drive at the state level. Some might only club race. There are a lot of large companies that offer sponsorships to help sell product and grow their company's visibility to the general club racers/bashers. The sponsorship doesn't mean you are a national caliber driver.
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Old 01-15-2010, 06:11 PM   #127
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paraphrasing one of the few bumperstickers I actually like:

Shut up and drive!!

I mean, really... pick a class, build your car, practice, race, lose, learn, its all fun. There are plenty of 'slow' options for novices in VTA, F1 silvercan, TCS, Mini, etc...
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Old 01-15-2010, 06:11 PM   #128
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Using spec tires would be the easiest and very cost effective way to regulate how fast the cars in the lower level classes can go and let people run any motor and esc they wanted. It wouldnt matter how fast your car was if you didnt have the traction to use it. Also racing with tires that didnt have the best traction would help the drivers to develop car and throttle control.

Just a thought....
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Old 01-15-2010, 06:16 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by RC Racer OG View Post
Using spec tires would be the easiest and very cost effective way to regulate how fast the cars in the lower level classes can go and let people run any motor and esc they wanted. It wouldnt matter how fast your car was if you didnt have the traction to use it. Also racing with tires that didnt have the best traction would help the drivers to develop car and throttle control.

Just a thought....
That is exactly the premise of VTA/RCGT.
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Old 01-15-2010, 06:23 PM   #130
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Not really...I don't know about RCGT but VTA also keeps the motor within limits of the traction of the tires for the most part. Limiting traction alone only creates unsafe cars as people largely will overdrive the tires. The best way to limit speeds is through limiting power...after that you can think about limiting traction.

Besides...I for one don't find it enjoyable to drive a loose car...some people do, some people don't.
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Old 01-15-2010, 06:28 PM   #131
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Not really...I don't know about RCGT but VTA also keeps the motor within limits of the traction of the tires for the most part. Limiting traction alone only creates unsafe cars as people largely will overdrive the tires. The best way to limit speeds is through limiting power...after that you can think about limiting traction.

Besides...I for one don't find it enjoyable to drive a loose car...some people do, some people don't.
You want to talk about creating unsafe cars? When was the last time you watched people run 1/8 scale cars on a club race night?

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Old 01-15-2010, 07:05 PM   #132
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It has been awhile since we haven't ran 1/8th out here in over 10 years for on-road...but yeah that's a good example of too much power and not enough traction and how dangerous that can be.
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Old 01-15-2010, 07:38 PM   #133
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Using that logic, we should create classes based on your gross income. Because it wouldn't be fair for a grown adult making $100,000 a year to race against a teenage making $1,000 a year. One will clearly have a larger racing budget, regardless of driving talent.
Thats not even close to the point I was making.
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Old 01-15-2010, 07:44 PM   #134
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But it still doesn't stop peeps from sandbagging. One can easily "break" on qualifiers and miraculously win the mains.
This is true.
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Old 01-15-2010, 07:46 PM   #135
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Originally Posted by stiltskin View Post
NO I didn't. (said it last, got my fingers crossed) If I save $10 on a motor, the discount didn't make me faster. I was going to buy the motor anyway. If I bought 9 motors and you could only afford 8 with the same money, did I really get an advantage over you on the track? The same motor, car, speedo, etc... is available to everyone else in the market. My point is that if I drop my sponsors, I'm still the same driver, with the same talent. Now I just pay more for my stuff.

Answer to this problem is: create a new NOVICE / AMATEUR class but still allow sponsored drivers to race 17.5. Choose whatever motor you want for novice, but why force other drivers into a faster class when they are happy with the one they're in?
You will always have skill. It's that set of tires you'll wish you had that you got for free before you dropped your sponsor

I'm done stirring the pot.
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