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Old 03-19-2004, 12:06 PM   #46
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One thing that is so impressive about Associated is when they do release a new car. It is ready to be released. That is part of the reason that the TC3 has been such a success, they got it right for the most part the first time. The only reason the batteries need to be moved in is because the car was designed for 2000/2400's 3300's are much heavier. There are some drive train improvements that can be made, obviously.

If you knew how much it costs to make a mold for the tub type chassis plus ones for the parts. You would realize why Associated and even Losi aren't coming out with new cars or version every 10-12 months.
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Old 03-19-2004, 12:22 PM   #47
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If I remember correctly the small molds where 5-7k each. And the chassis was 10k.
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Old 03-19-2004, 12:32 PM   #48
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by andsetinn
[B]I know of cars (especially the least expensive ones) that are up to and over 100 grams overweight. Lowering the limit will only help those with the most epensive cars. 2Cents.


I think this is right on. Weight limits are better off higher then lower IMO. Lowering the weight limit would entice companies to release more fragile "lite" parts for twice the price of their "heavy" counterparts that break easy and increase the overall expense of a hobby that has already priced many would-be racers out of it. Overall it would be VERY bad for the hobby and lead to even more of a decline in popularity.

If you are one of the people with the time and money to spend making your car 150 grams underweight, then take a cue from the golf industry and learn to strategically re-distribute that weight to fine tune your cars handling.
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Old 04-07-2004, 11:44 PM   #49
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I think that TC's have come to the point where they have peaked in what features and all that stuff they have. Even if they came out with a TC4 it would prababroly only have some sort of new suspension/a-arm design and maybe better electronics. Theyd prababroly come in Team/Factory team/Racer kits. But although the TC3 is still the reigning car (I think) Maybe the PRO4 will dominate now. Its all a matter of time to me. A TC4 would be cool, but not many new features, unless AE dicides to go so hardcore that they change nearly every feature and maybe make it chain Drive HA!. nah. They'd prababroly leave it shaft drive


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Old 04-07-2004, 11:49 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danny B
One thing that is so impressive about Associated is when they do release a new car. It is ready to be released. That is part of the reason that the TC3 has been such a success, they got it right for the most part the first time. The only reason the batteries need to be moved in is because the car was designed for 2000/2400's 3300's are much heavier. There are some drive train improvements that can be made, obviously.

If you knew how much it costs to make a mold for the tub type chassis plus ones for the parts. You would realize why Associated and even Losi aren't coming out with new cars or version every 10-12 months.
so people aren't moving the batteries to get more weight on the center line? i'm pretty sure that's what they're doing bro. major flaw on associated's part.
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Old 04-08-2004, 12:10 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danny B
One thing that is so impressive about Associated is when they do release a new car. It is ready to be released. That is part of the reason that the TC3 has been such a success, they got it right for the most part the first time.
For the most part is right.
BUT....
Lets do not forget that they first released the racer version and much later on the far more appealing (to racers that is) the Factory... Then the car started to become really popular,,,
The first releases had big issues with the wishbones, if I'm not mistaken.
And again with the release of the new wishbones(2holes).
Also I had crooked rear hubs in my FT kit. Seems one of their molds was out of shape.

Let me first state that they do make good products.
And the TC3 is a good car.
But it certainly was not perfect when they released it.

On the other hand most racers would like to see some changes made and they should be doing with so much demand...
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Old 04-08-2004, 01:59 AM   #52
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Ahhh-not what you think is this thread!!!

Will there ever be another 4wd 190mm sedan that will outdate every other car on the market? Or has the technology in this class hit its pinnacle already?

What will it take in suspension technology or drivetrain technology to truly revolutionize the class?

Ray

Ray, I DON'T know if we have hit the "pinnacle" of technology, but I think we are drawing closer and closer. Just look at off-road vehicles, both the B4 and XXXke2 are beginning to look similar to each other. And if you really think about it, offroad hasn't seen any revolutionary designs like when the XX came out...At some point, there is only so much you can do with a design, before it comes down to product loyalty.

Like Evicerator stated, we are probably going to see more in the way of additional refinements to current cars.

I for one, applaud a manufacturer when they put their support behind one particular chassis, refining and updating it as necessary. I dislike when they develop two or three cars, it puts their loyal customer's into a bind: do they go with the new car, or continue with the old one.

As much as I love Tamiya products, it seems that they have fallen into this trap. This is one of the biggest reasons I have slowed my purchases of their products.

Let's face it, Losi and AE both have some major improvements that they can do to their existing cars. We can all pretty much point out things we like/dislike about each car. I believe that each company is working on something, so let's hope its sooner than later!

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Old 04-08-2004, 09:11 AM   #53
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RCBuddha-I agree-a constant influx of improvements is whats needed on any good platform. A perfect example is the Ferrari Formula 1 car. They have taken the dominant chassis and made it more dominanant and reliable every season. Thats not to say change isnt good. One examlpe would be the 2003 Renault.

Now my friend Seaball started his awesome thread about long vs. short arms and this further proves my point that the Tc3 was truly revolutionary as other RC car companies start to adopt the basic layout of its suspension system.

Also-subtle changes might be a great way to go-not revoltionary for the time being. What I mean is that the Pro4 looks like a carbon fiber Tc3-but the ones who have driven it says it handles much smoother and consistent. I drive a BMI Tc3 and I beleive it to be more consistent than the FTTC3.

SO my long winded point is-maybe refinement at this stage is good, not something totally revolutionary!!!


But-if somethng were to come along that revolutionizes Sedan racing-I am sure all for trying it.

I have been tossing around the idea of designing a Sedan through an Asian company-but its difficult in so many ways. Not the least is how to make something that will work and sell-yet be different enough to differentiate it from all the other cars on the market???
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Old 04-08-2004, 09:53 AM   #54
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Associated cannot really evolve the TC3 any further, I mean, apart from radically changing the layout of the chassis (which could be a backwards step if they get it wrong - HPI Pro 3 anyone?), what can they do?

I believe the HPI Pro 4 is the true successor to the TC3, it's has everything the TC3 didn't; a C/F chassis, tough suspension parts and a good steering rack. Quite insignificant things really.

How much further can you go with the touring cars... mid motor shaft drive? Inboard suspension - like the rare (in the U.S.A) Ttech Predators? Ground effects such as rear diffusers?
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Old 04-08-2004, 10:00 AM   #55
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HeY!!!

i don't really beleave that there is much to change cept for shock position on car, and the a-arms. i sorta want to get a X-ray just to try out a different brand other then AE. i drove one of my freinds and it's really smooth, only think is to get it set up he said, and it tweaks sorta easy. i don't think i am though because my lhs won't store the parts because not enough guys have the car here. pretty much losi, ae, tamiya and now gonna start to store hpi stuff. so yeah.
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Old 04-08-2004, 10:05 AM   #56
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Have you thought about the Corally Assassin for innovation, it's got 2 different drivetrains in the box. You can either use direct drive or twin belt or... you can buy the mid-motor kit and just use the twin belt system.

I prefer to use the rear motor kit with the twin belt setup - even in 27t stock it is plenty fast enough.
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Old 04-08-2004, 10:49 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally posted by CraigH
If I remember correctly the small molds where 5-7k each. And the chassis was 10k.
That may be right, but ( ;-) there has to be a but) if it's so expensive, how can Tamiya keep coming out with so many new molded chassis every year?

Ok, so it would cost 30 grand to move the batterys closer to centerline, design better steering system, stronger arms and hubs. I believe they'd make it back in the first week the parts were on the market.
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Old 04-08-2004, 10:53 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally posted by Liam_Davies
Have you thought about the Corally Assassin for innovation, it's got 2 different drivetrains in the box. You can either use direct drive or twin belt or... you can buy the mid-motor kit and just use the twin belt system.
Ah, good point Liam...

Perhaps the revolution will lie in car's ability to utilize different transmission layouts, all on the same chassis....I think the idea is cool, its too bad Corally isn't available where I am....
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Old 04-08-2004, 01:53 PM   #59
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I was kind of thinking the next change woud be i the chassis itself. ULtra stiff monocoque or ladder frame. Basically untwistable by forces seen in R cars.

Another change might be 4wd chassis thats convertible form a F1/Champ car to a 190mm Sedan to a 200mm Rally car or even truck. Adjustable not only in width, but length.

That woud be fun for the pure enthusiats though-not the hardcore racer.

Ray
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Old 04-08-2004, 01:58 PM   #60
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Hey ray the tc3 can already do over half or those things you mentioned
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