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Old 12-22-2009, 03:16 PM   #136
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Rick-No disagreement with you or roar on safety. That should always be first. I just wanted to understand how/why li-fe would be better? I understand that they don't catch fire or explode while charging but what about when they are being overdischarged in a car? So far in my experience, which is limited to my own racing and being at most JBRL events and different races held at Hot Rod Hobbies I have only seen 2 lipos go up and both were at end of each persons race.
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Old 12-22-2009, 03:17 PM   #137
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Well, there goes 15 minutes I'll never get back...

Why complain about .04... Seems a little while ago people were heating their LIPOs to get more out of them.. then the ROAR Rule says room temp.... I've seen people charge their 3800 lipos at 7500... Why because a fast guy told them it will get more power out of the lipo... After 4 charges it started to expand.... Fast guy said don't worry about it.... LIPO go boom and fast guy said cheap battery was the problem, buy these from my sponsor and you won't have a problem.... And guess what... Guy buys battery from fast guys sponsor and reads the warnings about charging at the correct setting... Guy contacts sponsor and sponsor says they do not recommend you charge them at a high rate and you void the warrenty... Fast guy says thats what they all say, don't worry... 3 months later battery starts to meltdown right after charging....

I have 1 question... Does the companies and ROAR agree on this rule?
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Old 12-22-2009, 03:17 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by HenBeav View Post
Isn't that how you race?? At least that's what i learned from nimh.

but i do check them to see if they have fallen off, or for long term storage.
nope, charge them, run the race, go home, show up, charge them run the race go home, don't hardly ever take it out of the car. don't worry about them "falling off", and no such thing as long term storage for me.

btw, isn't that why you switched to lipo, so you wouldn't have to do all the nimh stuff. thats why i did.
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Old 12-22-2009, 03:26 PM   #139
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Originally Posted by Kent Beal View Post
Rick-No disagreement with you or roar on safety. That should always be first. I just wanted to understand how/why li-fe would be better? I understand that they don't catch fire or explode while charging but what about when they are being overdischarged in a car? So far in my experience, which is limited to my own racing and being at most JBRL events and different races held at Hot Rod Hobbies I have only seen 2 lipos go up and both were at end of each persons race.
Even with LiFe, there are going to be people who try and push the envelope to increase voltage. With LiFe, you overcharge or overdischarge and your battery no longer works.

I can look back to my first year racing, 1982. I had raced about 4-times and the first 1/12 Worlds was held at the Disneyland hotel so of course I went to watch. The race was great but only later did I find out that the Jomac team was charing their batteries are very high rates and using them ONCE. That does not seem so crazy now but at the time it seemed ridiculous. My point is that what is happening now has been going on forever.

In my opinion, the solution to battery voltage, special ESCs, etc is to race classes where these things don't matter.
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Old 12-22-2009, 03:35 PM   #140
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ITT: Racers find something else to complain about that should be a non-issue.
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Old 12-22-2009, 03:44 PM   #141
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if u really dont like it. then do a DODC or RCPro and do ur own thing.

honestly, how many roar races does 1 do a yr? i purposely do not attend them. i have my reasons and thats good enuff for me. sad to think that so many club racers out there feel roar has to rule on somethin to make it official.

let your club dictate what works at your track.

i highly doubt some1 is gonna lose a club race b/c the other guy was at 8.44v

R
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Old 12-22-2009, 03:51 PM   #142
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There's no need to go overboard. Most racers who are attending the nationals, who are the ones who have to worry, will either have a charger that has a display, or $10 to buy a cheap meter. As long as you know what your battery on charger/meter reads, and the what the battery on the ROAR meter reads, your fine. You'll know if you're going to be over or not.

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Old 12-22-2009, 03:58 PM   #143
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think clubs are going to alienate their crowds and hurt business by DQ'g people or penalizing them for a battery thats over by a fraction?

when ur at a 'meow' race, then worry bout this rule and ALL THE OTHER DAMN RULES TOO.

honestly, who gives a shite?

Go to ur club, shut up and race. have fun.

R
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Old 12-22-2009, 04:21 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by RCGaryK View Post
Well Rick did bring up LiFE

I just want to go back to when we ran 2000's, no-power motors, low traction tires and realistic bodies. In other words when on-road was fun...
WOW! Are you finally over being taken out at the Tamiya Nats?
It's been like a century, and now you think you had fun?

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Old 12-22-2009, 04:57 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by ultegrasti View Post
think clubs are going to alienate their crowds and hurt business by DQ'g people or penalizing them for a battery thats over by a fraction?

when ur at a 'meow' race, then worry bout this rule and ALL THE OTHER DAMN RULES TOO.

honestly, who gives a shite?

Go to ur club, shut up and race. have fun.

R
I don't think club racing is the topic.
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Old 12-22-2009, 05:01 PM   #146
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I don't think most places check voltage on a battery during a club race. Most of time wether it be a club race or a nationals event people hot lap their cars anywhere from 3 to 10 laps before the race even starts. Has anyone ever checked their batt voltage then, so any advantage would be gone anyways.

Rick- Do you remember the voltage boxes that a pit guy would hook to someones battery after hot laps but before the race? I remember those battery guys too. This one person the orginal owner of racers haven hobbies Martin told me about used to buy a box of hundred cells then assemble them and charge them right off a 30amp power supply, run his race, throw them away and start again. Now thats crazy.
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Old 12-22-2009, 05:26 PM   #147
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Love your pics Rob!

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Old 12-22-2009, 05:48 PM   #148
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LOL, the whole reason Adam says ROAR is doing this is for safety because it is extremely dangerous to charge to 8.44V and could burn down your $2000 pit table but all everyone is talking about it discharging after reaching 8.44V! Where is the safety?

I love toy car racing. We care about .04V
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Old 12-22-2009, 05:50 PM   #149
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I started Multi quoting a few individuals but this would have been a long post.

Bailey: The thought of DQ if it is over the Max but later stating that if someone checks it first but then runs it down out of your site then goes to tech it's ok......that is the epitome of stupid tech rules.

I'm fine with the rule on principal but I question the Accuracy and REPEATABILITY of most Chargers, even if my Ice or older updated CE Turbo 35 BL (which is only accurate to 0.1) charger yeilds a 8.40 in practice it could still yield a 8.41 in Qualifiers. I have seen a 0.02 swing and frankly there are times at ROAR races where I have run multiple classes and it is not always easy to get through tech to check Tech's meter (which by the way is in use by others), then get out of site to inconspicuously discharge your pack and then make it back through tech. In addition where is the standard place to measure the pack because there is a voltage drop for every connector and solder joint so if it is that important not to allow leeway, then they should all have access right at the cell tabs.

To those that wonder why this fuss was not raised with the 8.44 volt limit, most were at 8.42-8.43 and new they were safe and if not the could just bump it in tech to reduce the voltage and still be legal when put on the line, just like adding weight or trimming a wing.

I usually don't agree with much Fred B says (respect his opinion though) but I think it was he that mentioned the over discharged packs. If Safety is the real concern then this would seem a much more crucial area especially en-light of your 'acceptance' of covertly running the battery back down.

ROAR You made 1 Step forward with Brushless and Lipo acceptance but 2 steps back by not foreseeing the Tech explosion and setting a Price cap on motors/speedos, Similar to the Brushed motor limit. And now in today's economy your ready to DQ someone (potentially costing a minimum of 1/5 of their investment for the weekend) or force some to spend more $ on downgrades or new charges.......and for what 0.02 volts per cell...seems to me if that small difference is so dangerous maybe ROAR should have done better research before legalizing this horrendous potential fireball.
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Old 12-22-2009, 06:58 PM   #150
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Exactly... Don't get me wrong, I tend to be a stickler for the rules... but the way Bailey speaks in this thread will keep me far far away from any official ROAR race. The rule of 8.4 with no variance is just fine... its the authoritarian, all-mighty, don't cross me or ill ban you from the event, kind of attitude that is a major turn off.
brandon, i thought you would know better then to let something you read on the internet make a decision for you. Adam is actually one of the coolest dudes at the races.

but as a roar tech guy, you not the most popular guy, in arkansas I watched as adam and to tell a guy that adam and I both watched open a brand new motor that his motor didn't pass tech. adams used to being the bad guy, but rules is rules.

i don't believe adam is talking about banning the guy whos charger over charges, but its more about the guys charging in nimh mode pushing in more volts then safe. and yea, I know a few guys that have updated chargers to get the extra 4 millivolts oh well time for the update to the update
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