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Old 01-14-2010, 08:13 AM   #76
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What Mark and I have found when the grip comes up at places like Rug Racers and Eversley on the Sweep tires is to reduce the droop all round and widen the car on the front hex. Also tend to start with a slightly heavier oil compared to, say, Carpet Wars and Sorex tires.
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:33 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by Skiddins View Post
What sort of things did you undo, in other words what did you do initially to try to get rid of grip roll?

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I had originally laid the front shocks down (which gives more of a progressive spring rate because the angle of the spring to the arm keeps getting closer to 90') and now I've raised them up a bit (which sped up the whole weight transfer) and the car is understandably better in the quick left-right-left corners.

I had also reduced camber to get rid of grip at/near max corner load, but now I've come back up to normal amounts (1.5-2').

Where I had originally been unable to use any additional camber gain, I've now gone crazy adding camber gain into the front end and it just keeps gaining traction.

Since I started gluing the sidewalls of my front tires, the changes I've made have allowed me to consistently go 3/10ths faster.
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:34 AM   #78
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its not easy to drive a nervous car,I can do it, but its not very comfortable....
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Old 01-14-2010, 11:22 AM   #79
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Originally Posted by Greg Sharpe View Post
I had originally laid the front shocks down (which gives more of a progressive spring rate because the angle of the spring to the arm keeps getting closer to 90') and now I've raised them up a bit (which sped up the whole weight transfer) and the car is understandably better in the quick left-right-left corners.

I had also reduced camber to get rid of grip at/near max corner load, but now I've come back up to normal amounts (1.5-2').

Where I had originally been unable to use any additional camber gain, I've now gone crazy adding camber gain into the front end and it just keeps gaining traction.

Since I started gluing the sidewalls of my front tires, the changes I've made have allowed me to consistently go 3/10ths faster.
What class, car, and tire are you using?
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Old 01-14-2010, 12:35 PM   #80
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Good engineering analysis, its more like what we learn in automotive engineering book

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Soften the suspension so that it can absorb the cornering load and not put it into the wheels/tires. A stiffer suspension transfers that load right to the tire and over you go ....
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Old 01-18-2010, 05:46 AM   #81
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Tried using softer springs at the weekend, went down from 3.0-2.6 to 2.8-2.6. This did help reduce the traction roll, only had it a couple of times in the final.

I didn't want to drop the rear too much as I was loosing steering as it was.

What sort of things would you guys change to bring some steering back?

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Old 01-18-2010, 07:16 AM   #82
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You can give it more Ackerman or caster (directly with different blocks or indirectly with more anti-dive).
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Old 01-18-2010, 08:04 AM   #83
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You can give it more Ackerman or caster (directly with different blocks or indirectly with more anti-dive).
anti-dive will give you less caster, not more, and therefore more initial steering (less on the way out of the corner)

I think you mean kick-up rather than anti-dive
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Old 01-18-2010, 08:31 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by Spdjunky View Post
What class, car, and tire are you using?
17.5, Losi Type-R, Jaco Blues, Jack the Gripper, racing at Horsham R/C in PA.
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Old 01-18-2010, 08:32 AM   #85
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Yep, sorry, my mistake.
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Old 01-18-2010, 07:44 PM   #86
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You can give it more Ackerman or caster (directly with different blocks or indirectly with more anti-dive).
Ackerman does absolutely nothing for traction flipping.

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17.5, Losi Type-R, Jaco Blues, Jack the Gripper, racing at Horsham R/C in PA.
What diameter are you truing the tires down to? What is your ride height and droop set at?
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Old 01-18-2010, 07:52 PM   #87
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Ackerman does absolutely nothing for traction flipping.
Read more carefully. He wants to get back some steering.
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Old 01-18-2010, 07:55 PM   #88
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just realized I can use the gluing the tire method on my vehicle in USVTA. thought it was illegal but I guess not.

Should I try this first or try setup changes?

reason being, the car other than the traction rolling issues works excellent.
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Old 01-18-2010, 07:57 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by niznai View Post
Read more carefully. He wants to get back some steering.
The only thing Ackermen does is affect how 'twitchy' or 'quick' the steering is at initial turn in. Full throw steering is still full throw. This doesn't affect wheel grip.
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Old 01-18-2010, 07:59 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cain View Post
just realized I can use the gluing the tire method on my vehicle in USVTA. thought it was illegal but I guess not.

Should I try this first or try setup changes?

reason being, the car other than the traction rolling issues works excellent.
Cain, please please don't glue your tires
Keep working on it. I've followed your posts and can tell you will figure it out. It will vastly improve your setup experience once you have it mastered. Give it time and maybe even consult a few local guys that are 'seasoned' racers.
It is a long slow learning curve.
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