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Old 11-22-2009, 01:25 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by or8ital View Post
Racing in the stock class now is closer than I ever remember it in the brushed motor days.
+1 - Racing is certainly closer, and thanks to BL and LiPo a lot easier for new racers to learn what matters - practice, chassis setup, and more practice.

The new ESCs might be a point of contention when used in the context of "maintaining an even playing field"; but they are here to stay, and we should be allowed to utilize every advantage they offer. Everyone makes choices when buying new equipment - do your research, and choose wisely.
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Old 11-22-2009, 07:55 PM   #62
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There isn't a stock class anymore now that "stock" motors cost the same as "mod" motors.
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Old 11-22-2009, 08:12 PM   #63
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You could eliminate a spec speed control by using a spec rubber tire. If you're limited on traction, you're limited on how much HP you can use. Just ask the off road guys.
Thats the best solution I have heard
p.s. - Nascar still sucks
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Old 11-22-2009, 08:18 PM   #64
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It seems with this new technology that a given wind motor (13.5t, 17.5t, etc.) is no longer a common ground. Just when we had true, controllable spec horsepower with lipo and BL we now have power disparities between those who have $200 speed controls and those who don't. This new technology has it's place for sure but should it be legal in all stock classes, whose purpose was to keep the playing field level and less expensive?
Some people will always find "tricks" to gain an advantage in spec class racing. At least with the timing advance ESCs they are available to everyone instead of 1 or 2 people figuring out how to do it without everyone else knowing about it.

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Old 11-22-2009, 09:46 PM   #65
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There are a couple problems with that statement...first off that would exclude any new drivers who happened to buy the wrong ESC before they started racing and force them to buy a new one when they did. The second is in a combination of teching and manufacturing. Eventually you would see manufacturers making ESCs with hidden profiles that can be disabled at the radio prior to tech inspection.

These are exactly what happened in the paintball industry when they went to electronic triggers and what I had warned about early in the BL debate. At the time people said that wouldn't happen in our industry...well it has.

Backyard bashers aren't going to be buying spec ESCs for playing around. They are going to buy the most powerful ESC and motor combination they can get. Now when they decide to come racing they'll be willing to change motor usually but not motor and ESC. So the people who end up racing a spec class will be the better racers that have the money to buy another ESC and not the group of people the class is intended to benefit.
well then ppl who bought a advanced ESC should get purnished to bieng "updated' or informed?

that what is the slae and buy thread or the ebay is for. I been using LRP TC for 1 season then found out about RS Tekin only about 2 month ago, it cost me only $40 to get updated, how ? yes I sold my TC for $100 and bought a RS for $140. I love technology! if we keep banning technology advancing there is no WWW, Ebay Tekin RS or no advancing in anything period.



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Some people will always find "tricks" to gain an advantace in spec class racing. At least with the timing advance ESCs they are available to everyone instead of 1 or 2 people figuring out how to do it without everyone else knowing about it.
well next time when you find "new trick" or came up with a good idea please post it on this RCtech or craig list or NY times, or why don't you start spilling some beans from your next posting for us?
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Old 11-22-2009, 09:57 PM   #66
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well next time when you find "new trick" or came up with a good idea please post it on this RCtech or craig list or NY times, or why don't you start spilling some beans from your next posting for us?
How about you go back to school to get smarter so you can figure things out yourself?
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Old 11-22-2009, 11:36 PM   #67
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How about you go back to school to get smarter so you can figure things out yourself?
yes thats what me and rest of the racers been doing, using my own knowledge to come up with a new own "trick" to go faster than others.

IMO set up or tuning is about having better (right) idea, not trick anyone.
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Old 11-23-2009, 06:44 AM   #68
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i think the most straight forward answer to the specific question in the title is pretty simple:

esc with boost in stock class = yes
esc with boost in spec class = no

isn't spec class meant to be a true spec class? as long as i have been around r/c, the r/c stock class has been limited by the motor....

also, i think the idea of spec tire really does help for those who want to help "level the playing field". if the playing field was perfectly level, how many people reading this thread would enjoy going to the local track to "turn some laps"? after all, that's all it would be if the field were level - it wouldn't be racing! i like how a local track here does it - 13.5 spec rubber, 17.5 spec rubber. plain and simple choose your class, race, have fun, and just end it

most of the time, people who see r/c as STRICTLY a hobby do not race. those who see r/c as a way to race enjoy the competition and respect the time and/or effort it takes to develop into a better competitor are probably frustrated after reading the debates on this thread
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Old 11-23-2009, 06:57 AM   #69
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[...]

if the playing field was perfectly level, how many people reading this thread would enjoy going to the local track to "turn some laps"? after all, that's all it would be if the field were level - it wouldn't be racing!

[...]
I would.

So shall we understand that Nascar or other forms of "spec" competitions are not racing?
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Old 11-23-2009, 07:07 AM   #70
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I would.

So shall we understand that Nascar or other forms of "spec" competitions are not racing?
no, we shall not especially since that is not even close to what to what i believe my post intends.

let me explain part of it a little better for you...

turning laps is turning laps, it is NOT consistently trying for better laptimes, as in practice!

spec class is spec class, stock is not spec class. i think this is pretty simple, right?

also, i'll replace "level field" with field and all competitors perfectly equal, in every way - i still don't think this would be fun
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Old 11-23-2009, 10:44 AM   #71
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You could eliminate a spec speed control by using a spec rubber tire. If you're limited on traction, you're limited on how much HP you can use. Just ask the off road guys.
That won't work unless you use an absolute crap tire like drift tires. The timing comes on after reaching normal top speed. The correct solution will be that only the boosted people have to use the tires that comes with the Tamiya kits

Last edited by redbones; 11-23-2009 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 11-23-2009, 10:51 AM   #72
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I have seen this at our track too. Those tekins especially, the keep updating the software and it gets faster. Where will it hit a ceiling? Then it becomes a speedo war and things get out of hand like it is now. Our 17.5 class was a very competitive (driving wise) class until some showed up with a tekin...


So the people on this thread that are completely for it, do you guys go and buy that "ESC of the month" every time a manufacturer finds a way to make the motors go faster? Because that's what you are telling the other racers to do if they want to be competitive. So we had perfectly even battles and all of a sudden you have to buy a tekin system. It will discourage lots of racers. I've seen this happen many times in the past.

Last edited by redbones; 11-23-2009 at 11:35 AM.
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Old 11-23-2009, 12:07 PM   #73
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So the people on this thread that are completely for it, do you guys go and buy that "ESC of the month" every time a manufacturer finds a way to make the motors go faster? Because that's what you are telling the other racers to do if they want to be competitive. So we had perfectly even battles and all of a sudden you have to buy a tekin system. It will discourage lots of racers. I've seen this happen many times in the past.
The trend seems to be swinging toward making the firmware in ESC's updatable by the end user. Some of the better brands are still resisting this (LRP), but I think eventually you'll see that become the norm for a lot of things in RC. It's happening with chargers (Hyperion DUO) now, and will no doubt find its way everywhere eventually.
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Old 11-23-2009, 12:21 PM   #74
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The trend seems to be swinging toward making the firmware in ESC's updatable by the end user. Some of the better brands are still resisting this (LRP), but I think eventually you'll see that become the norm for a lot of things in RC. It's happening with chargers (Hyperion DUO) now, and will no doubt find its way everywhere eventually.
I'm pretty sure this whole timing thing is at it's peak already. There's only so much the motor can handle before it grenades. Once the others gets their speedo to match Tekins, things should level off.

But let me end this with the fact that an experienced driver (consistency well below .5) using the Tekin is about 0.5 sec faster than his rival using an SPX. The top speed on that thing is phenomenal.
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Old 11-23-2009, 03:59 PM   #75
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At my track the noone likes the Tekin and one of the best ESCs is the KO which is basically as good as it gets as far as TRUE programmability. You can customize it to your hearts desire. At my track we have SPXs, KOs, Spheres (TC and 1st Gen) Speed Passions and noone wins because they have the newest Speedo alone. I love the new ESCs funny thing is my 17.5 car is as fast maybe faster than my 13.5 was not long ago, the limiting factors will be the motor but more importantly the driver/car so keep the advances coming and just drive the [email protected]&!

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