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Old 10-04-2009, 03:56 AM   #1
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Default 1s LiPo Touring - the answer to clever ESCs?

Is there any potential in the idea that 1s Lipo with open motors could replace 2s Lipo with limited motors in stock classes?

My simplistic view is that if people can choose whatever motor they want, there is no need for ESC's with complicated programs. Just run the fastest motor the tyres can handle. The lower voltage will limit speeds more effectively than a limited wind.

Might stop some of the moaning about "hidden" advantages in ESC software. At least a motor can be stripped and have no secrets.
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Old 10-04-2009, 04:23 AM   #2
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Is there any potential in the idea that 1s Lipo with open motors could replace 2s Lipo with limited motors in stock classes?

My simplistic view is that if people can choose whatever motor they want, there is no need for ESC's with complicated programs. Just run the fastest motor the tyres can handle. The lower voltage will limit speeds more effectively than a limited wind.

Might stop some of the moaning about "hidden" advantages in ESC software. At least a motor can be stripped and have no secrets.
The evolution of ESC's are never going to end. They will always come out with something better and we will have to spend more money. Like the ESC that was run by the CRC guys at the IIC. They were using a 1s pack in their 1/12th and 1/10th pan cars that take 3.7 volts and make it 6 to the motor. They had a clear advantage. Its never going to end. We are just going to have to keep spending money. You really don't need a progamable ESC to run mod.
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Old 10-04-2009, 06:46 AM   #3
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The evolution of ESC's are never going to end. They will always come out with something better and we will have to spend more money. Like the ESC that was run by the CRC guys at the IIC. They were using a 1s pack in their 1/12th and 1/10th pan cars that take 3.7 volts and make it 6 to the motor. They had a clear advantage. Its never going to end. We are just going to have to keep spending money. You really don't need a progamable ESC to run mod.
That's about the most uninformed statement I've heard about that ESC yet. Maybe have a read through this thread: http://www.rctech.net/forum/electric...-opinions.html , there's plenty of ACCURATE info in here.
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Old 10-04-2009, 06:51 AM   #4
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so in attempt to slow cars down and take speedos outta the game... by doin what u've proposed we have...

sped the cars up b/c now they can grab the most heat the tires can deal with.

and...

now the speedo is more important than ever since the cars will be even more dependent on help from clever engineering and programming in the form of anti-lock braking/engine braking, traction control, launch control, KERS, and who knows what else folks will dream up.
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Old 10-04-2009, 06:59 AM   #5
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I do like the idea of 1s as long as the cars get lighter with it. I don't see any drawbacks to making cars lighter. But the speedo technology is going to continue to evolve. Embrace it.
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Old 10-04-2009, 08:49 AM   #6
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I think touring cars are too heavy for 1s. When they started experimenting with 1s in 1/12 the big problem was enough speed. The first solution was to run a 13.5 motor against 4 cell cars with 17.5 motors. That's gone away since they were never really equal and 1s is now the 1/12 standard.

Also if anything the slower speed would put more emphasis on the speed control, and creative software. So your idea would make the problem worse.

Funny how everyone complaining about brushless speedo software conveniently forget the software changes made in brushed speed controls, or does no one remember the 7 different profiles the Novak GTX had?
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Old 10-04-2009, 08:59 AM   #7
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A single cell lipo with a 10.5 would be great in a spec sedan at around 900 grams, if you could balance the car. The 2011 cars will be great for this. Right now, only the Losi type R and possibly a Shumacher Mi4 could be balanced properly and still take advantage of the weight reduction needed to get the benefit of 1S lipo.

I've been looking for a $300 sedan and have been holding off buying an Mi3.5 or T2R because of the balance thing. Most of the guys I'll be running with are running Mi4's and I'm not sure if I can make next years weight limits with an Mi 3.5.
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Old 10-04-2009, 09:15 AM   #8
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I think touring cars are too heavy for 1s. When they started experimenting with 1s in 1/12 the big problem was enough speed. The first solution was to run a 13.5 motor against 4 cell cars with 17.5 motors. That's gone away since they were never really equal and 1s is now the 1/12 standard.

Also if anything the slower speed would put more emphasis on the speed control, and creative software. So your idea would make the problem worse.

Funny how everyone complaining about brushless speedo software conveniently forget the software changes made in brushed speed controls, or does no one remember the 7 different profiles the Novak GTX had?
Those were basically just punch settings, there was no timing advance, becasue you cant w/ BR. If we still had Fixed Timing in BL (motor and ESC) in spec classes, the speeds wouldnt be quite so insane (remember when BL was first adopted, 27t was still faster in stock). The best solution IMO would be to develop A123 (LiFe) packs into something we can use in TC, those are 6.6V packs, would help slow us down a little..
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Old 10-04-2009, 09:18 AM   #9
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That reminds me of a few years ago they were trying to run 4 cell mod in touring cars.
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Old 10-04-2009, 09:30 AM   #10
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i remember 6 cell 12th scale oval )
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Old 10-04-2009, 10:02 AM   #11
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and seven cell modified ............
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Old 10-04-2009, 10:04 AM   #12
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And that most important modification that lead to where we are now. The Parma micro resistor for a speed control.
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Old 10-04-2009, 10:07 AM   #13
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How about 6 cell mod 1/12 on carpet? Those were the days......
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Old 10-04-2009, 10:45 AM   #14
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It's no secret that sedan is dieing off in a lot of areas. The big question is, will single cell help with all of the things that people normally complain about with sedans.

Single cell will drive a ton of changes in sedan unless the exact same size/weight batteries are used. Run a really small 1/12th sized pack and it's going to take a new chassis layout to make it work. Cost and a "chassis of the month" are two of the things that I've heard people complain about with sedans.

My personal opinion is that lower voltage will not take the speed control/motor out of the picture. I think that it would actually make the speedo and motor even more important. It would be slower than what we have now but the speedo's and motors would make a big difference.

That being said, I do think that slowing stock back to a point where new people can learn to drive is a good thing. Might not be a good option for some of the huge tracks overseas but it makes sense for a lot of the tracks here in the states. If you can't get fresh blood into the hobby/sport then it's doomed to dwindle out just like slot cars did back in the day.

There are plenty of stock guys out there that refuse to move up a class and give new racers a chance to learn how to drive. Most new racers "want to go fast" at first and then realize that they can't even handle our slowest class. Plus, because they can't drive yet they get yelled at by all of the "serious" stock racers out there. Soon after they quit.

So, single cell as an option? Yes.
Will it "save the sedan class"? Probably not.
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Old 10-04-2009, 11:12 AM   #15
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This idea will eliminate (or at least reduce) the speedo issues but open up another one. BATTERIES. The issue will not be how much motor the car can handle, it will be how much motor the batteries will handle. Not to mention lipos don't like being sucked dry.

So yes, speedos wont matter much but instead of spending money on a new speedo every now and then you will be spending LOTS of money on new batteries all the time.
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