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Old 09-16-2009, 11:14 AM   #421
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Originally Posted by Dawn Sanchez View Post
I haven't followed this very closely the last few days.. just a post here or two, so forgive this question.. but, was this ESC run in the stock or superstock type classes?? Or just modified....?

i believe it was run in all pan car classes
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:15 AM   #422
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Finally some one with a commen sense thank you rick for your input

Wild cherry one question for you would you of won if brian was not runnig the speedo ? answer no because your a tool bag i will explain this for the tenth time already the speedo has a built in voltage regulator the speedo will not even turn on with a 3.7 volt 1 cell lipo so thats why the reciever pack goes to the speedo they tested output voltage i n tech after all of the speedo issues were brought up it was the same as everyother speedo.

as for holding out on a advantage doubt that frank didnt even decide to go to vegas till a week before the race. tekin held out of softwear as did KO and no one is bitchin$ about that .

just drop this subject if you want to make it a he should not of been in that class fine but dont make him or CRC out to be cheaters when they did nothing wrong
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:16 AM   #423
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What is fair about using equipment that is not commercialy availible to all the racers??
As far as I can tell there is no rule that says the ESC has to be commercially available.

If I had approached each stock/superstock with aa component that would legally remove .2 sec off each lap time with the understanding that they would be the only driver to receive it, how many would turn it down?? My guess is 0.
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:16 AM   #424
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Originally Posted by HenBeav View Post
you can cut the eleventy-million classes in half at least by getting rid of foam touring
Best post of the thread
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:17 AM   #425
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Yang, please elaborate on how you can cheat.
it ain't cheating is there are no rules. boosting the power inside the speedo is legal. running a cap that provideds extra power is definately legal. running a secondary battery that is used to boost voltage to the motor is illegal, but very hard to find. there are several "legal" way to cheat because, well there are no rules governing what the speedo can and can't do.
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:18 AM   #426
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Originally Posted by chris moore View Post
What is fair about using equipment that is not commercialy availible to all the racers??
Chris, this is not what happened. Let this be cleared for the umpteenth time. What did happen is that some guys found a speed control commercially available in europe and used it at the race. That is what happened.

It is no different than you buying something from a website operated in hong kong or some other city, or ebay.
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:21 AM   #427
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Originally Posted by justmy2cents View Post
I dont agree with Rick.

First, modified in not suitable for all tracks or drivers. It will drive people out of the hobby if you make it so they destroy a car each run.

Second, who decided if I can run Expert, Am, Pro, or whatever you call it?? RC Pro series did that this year. I dont think it was well received.

Third, Its my entry fee money and no ones life is at stake. So if I want to sign up as pro or novice I will. I dont think you should try this idea. If we were really inside the cars racing against each other, and bodily harm was involved you would have a point. You'll get to many people saying " no ones gonna tell me Im not a Pro"

Just my 2 cents
Modified is not a fixed wind like it is in the stock classes. Modified will mean different things to different people. For me it was a 4.5. for others it might be a 6.5. And others a 13.5 or even 17.5.

My point is that you can eliminate the motor of the week, special ESC programs, special ESCs, etc if you eliminate the need for them.
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:23 AM   #428
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Originally Posted by smyka View Post
they tested output voltage i n tech after all of the speedo issues were brought up it was the same as everyother speedo.

they did not test it in tech. as a matter of fact you can not check that with any of the equipment on the tech table. if it were brushed, then yes, you can check it with a dvm. but now with brushless, a simple dvm would not be able to determine the power to the motor. remember the motor wire from the speedos are now the things that make the rotor spin. that is why you have 3 and not 2 wires
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:38 AM   #429
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Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
Modified is not a fixed wind like it is in the stock classes. Modified will mean different things to different people. For me it was a 4.5. for others it might be a 6.5. And others a 13.5 or even 17.5.

My point is that you can eliminate the motor of the week, special ESC programs, special ESCs, etc if you eliminate the need for them.
Some people feel they need to run the fastest motor in open...OPEN means you run what's fastest for you...which is why I hate stock, or fixed motor classes. People cheat. Or you have a slow motor and it doesn't matter how good you drive.

Rick can you send me an email so we can discuss our article?
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:43 AM   #430
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Originally Posted by Mason View Post
Chris, this is not what happened. Let this be cleared for the umpteenth time. What did happen is that some guys found a speed control commercially available in europe and used it at the race. That is what happened.

It is no different than you buying something from a website operated in hong kong or some other city, or ebay.
What is it available so I can purchase?
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:43 AM   #431
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Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
As far as I can tell there is no rule that says the ESC has to be commercially available.

If I had approached each stock/superstock with aa component that would legally remove .2 sec off each lap time with the understanding that they would be the only driver to receive it, how many would turn it down?? My guess is 0.
You are correct as there is and was no specific rule on that issue, that why the op started this thread. But both your first and second statements speak to more a moral and values area than event rules. If you or anyone else here can say that thay are perfectly content to win knowing that you/thay have an advantage that could'nt be overcome and that no other racer could have(at least on that day) well thats a sad statment about that individual. Just because we're racers and want to win we should'nt throw away the idea of fairplay. I'd rather know that I won because I was the better driver so I can say with confidence that I'd say no to your offer; but I'm sure your right and I'm farily alone on that island.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mason View Post
Chris, this is not what happened. Let this be cleared for the umpteenth time. What did happen is that some guys found a speed control commercially available in europe and used it at the race. That is what happened.

It is no different than you buying something from a website operated in hong kong or some other city, or ebay.
True to a point but I've done a little bit of searching and have'nt yet found anyplace that sells these have you? And the question was rasied earier as to if this esc has been used in any europen sanctioned races; to which I have not yet seen an answer.
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:44 AM   #432
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Originally Posted by theisgroup View Post
it ain't cheating is there are no rules..
I just found this part entertaining. That's all.

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Originally Posted by theisgroup View Post
boosting the power inside the speedo is legal.
okay, they need some level of power to function.

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Originally Posted by theisgroup View Post
running a cap that provideds extra power is definately legal.
?? it just smooths out the voltage spikes to quell interference. extra power how? from what? the total energy can only be so much. The boys at the CIA/NSA/DARPA or other secret agencies might want to know how that would work if it was the case.

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Originally Posted by theisgroup View Post
running a secondary battery that is used to boost voltage to the motor is illegal, but very hard to find.
As it has always been. If there is a way to design/make something, there is a way to check/verify something so that its within tolerance of what it was made to be. Otherwise this would be "cutting edge" and this.. is definitely not cutting edge technology unless this was 1980something (and thats a conservative number).

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Originally Posted by theisgroup View Post
there are several "legal" way to cheat because, well there are no rules governing what the speedo can and can't do.
There's only one thing for it to do. Put the available given power from the primary source to the motor in a controlled fashion in the most efficient manner to the track where it can best be used. You can't have timing rules because of the design of the whole system.
Please tell me what can be done to some how "cheat" rules that do not exist.
I give you that there might some how be something that the entire toy car racing electronics industry is keeping back, or not making aware of to the rule makers which I thought helped make up the rules to begin with. But then wouldn't they all be taking advantage of it?
Please give me something specific so I can understand what I seem to be missing or unaware of. I'm on the board that makes rules for a local series here.. so any info is appreciated.
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:50 AM   #433
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Originally Posted by chris moore View Post
True to a point but I've done a little bit of searching and have'nt yet found anyplace that sells these have you? And the question was rasied earier as to if this esc has been used in any europen sanctioned races; to which I have not yet seen an answer.
Advanced Electronics is the company - Fairly generic name so I've found everything from computer chip related companies to bicycles and a lot of stuff in various oriental languages that I cannot read. The name of the product is "Black Diamond". Which searching for that will get you golf courses and all sorts of stuff as well. And its supposedly out of Sweden. I haven't found the home page either but if the people are sponsoring racers they must be somewhere if they want to turn a profit.

According to some its been available since 2008. Chances are its been in a race. Maybe its just finally being used by people who can put it up front.
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:52 AM   #434
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Originally Posted by Mason View Post
I just found this part entertaining. That's all.

okay, they need some level of power to function.

?? it just smooths out the voltage spikes to quell interference. extra power how? from what? the total energy can only be so much. The boys at the CIA/NSA/DARPA or other secret agencies might want to know how that would work if it was the case.

As it has always been. If there is a way to design/make something, there is a way to check/verify something so that its within tolerance of what it was made to be. Otherwise this would be "cutting edge" and this.. is definitely not cutting edge technology unless this was 1980something (and thats a conservative number).


There's only one thing for it to do. Put the available given power from the primary source to the motor in a controlled fashion in the most efficient manner to the track where it can best be used. You can't have timing rules because of the design of the whole system.
Please tell me what can be done to some how "cheat" rules that do not exist.
I give you that there might some how be something that the entire toy car racing electronics industry is keeping back, or not making aware of to the rule makers which I thought helped make up the rules to begin with. But then wouldn't they all be taking advantage of it?
Please give me something specific so I can understand what I seem to be missing or unaware of. I'm on the board that makes rules for a local series here.. so any info is appreciated.
you are just too funny. just tell ferrari that their 10% HP boost from their KERS system (which is a closed system) does not help then in any way.
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Old 09-16-2009, 11:55 AM   #435
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All I know is that CRC better send kn7671 one of these for free for creating this thread. All this publicity is going to cause this speedo to sell like hotcakes when it is finally released!
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