R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-21-2009, 08:28 AM   #1
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 55
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default Thinking of switching to on-road... please help!

I just got into the hobby several months ago with a T4 Factory truck and I went ahead and bought all the right stuff (Novak 13.5 BL, GTB, Spektrum DX3S, HiTec Digital Servo, Orion LiPos). I have been running it at my local track and getting better each time but I have not started racing yet... I still am not constistent enough to start racing (well, maybe rookie class).

In any case, I'm finding myself getting frustrated flipping the car over and trying to coordinate my entry speed into corners with taking the bumps and jumps! Also, I seem to be breaking something every time. I guess I'm not yet at the skill level I should be so that I can enjoy it more and spend less crashing.

There is a carpet track at my local shop and I'm thinking that I may be able to pick that up a bit more quickly since I don't have to deal with the jumps and the loose traction conditions. Also, the off-road track is not predictable (great when damp but sucks when dry) and the carpet track is always... well, carpet.

I guess what I'm asking is whether I should stay patient and master the off-road track first and give myself a chance to truly enjoy it or whether I should get into the on-road and start over.

The truth is I wanted to do the on-road because that's what I really like but my local guys at the shop convinced me to start with off-road because it's more forgiving to a novice driver.

Your honest feedback would be greatly appreciated and very helpful to me. Thanks.
t4tx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 08:41 AM   #2
Tech Master
 
PitNamedGordie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Highwood, IL
Posts: 1,789
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to PitNamedGordie Send a message via Yahoo to PitNamedGordie
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by t4tx View Post
I just got into the hobby several months ago with a T4 Factory truck and I went ahead and bought all the right stuff (Novak 13.5 BL, GTB, Spektrum DX3S, HiTec Digital Servo, Orion LiPos). I have been running it at my local track and getting better each time but I have not started racing yet... I still am not constistent enough to start racing (well, maybe rookie class).

In any case, I'm finding myself getting frustrated flipping the car over and trying to coordinate my entry speed into corners with taking the bumps and jumps! Also, I seem to be breaking something every time. I guess I'm not yet at the skill level I should be so that I can enjoy it more and spend less crashing.

There is a carpet track at my local shop and I'm thinking that I may be able to pick that up a bit more quickly since I don't have to deal with the jumps and the loose traction conditions. Also, the off-road track is not predictable (great when damp but sucks when dry) and the carpet track is always... well, carpet.

I guess what I'm asking is whether I should stay patient and master the off-road track first and give myself a chance to truly enjoy it or whether I should get into the on-road and start over.

The truth is I wanted to do the on-road because that's what I really like but my local guys at the shop convinced me to start with off-road because it's more forgiving to a novice driver.

Your honest feedback would be greatly appreciated and very helpful to me. Thanks.
I haven't driven an off road car since I was a kid so I can't say if off road racing is easier or harder. But I can say on road racing can have it's ups and down too. You may not have to worry about jumps or drastic changes in track conditions....but you find yourself worrying about how well you car is turning in or exiting a corner. You'll be searching for corner speed and trying to find that perfect setup that'll shave off .2 of a second

But to me this is the FUN in on road racing...practicing your driving skills, learning how to set up your car...and actually finding the .2 seconds! So if on road is what you prefer then make the switch. But just keep in mind you'll still break and won't be fast right away. The learning experience is part of the fun...at least it was/is for me.

Oh btw, if you have a WGT class at your track...maybe start with one of those. The cars are easier to drive than a TC for sure. I just got one this spring and love driving it...it's my "fun" car...my TC is the car I spend time chasing .2 seconds with
__________________
☆ The Track @ Harbor Hobbies ☆ www.harbor-hobby.net ☆
PitNamedGordie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 08:45 AM   #3
Tech Elite
 
chicagokenji's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 4,210
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by t4tx View Post
Your honest feedback would be greatly appreciated and very helpful to me. Thanks.
If you are breaking stuff and out of control all the time the truck is going faster than you can handle.

Take that 13.5 out, it's too much motor for you. Put a Tamiya silver can motor in instead. (17 bucks). Maybe run 4 cell NIMH too. Slow your truck down considerably and learn how to go around the track without hitting things. Slowing it down means you'll take jumps less aggressively which is good.

ARe you sure you are using the right tires for your track?
chicagokenji is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 09:35 AM   #4
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 55
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagokenji View Post
If you are breaking stuff and out of control all the time the truck is going faster than you can handle.

Take that 13.5 out, it's too much motor for you. Put a Tamiya silver can motor in instead. (17 bucks). Maybe run 4 cell NIMH too. Slow your truck down considerably and learn how to go around the track without hitting things. Slowing it down means you'll take jumps less aggressively which is good.

ARe you sure you are using the right tires for your track?
Thanks all for the feedback.

Well, I may have exaggerated on how much I"m crashing. In 10-12 minutes of run time on my LiPo, I probably crash once or twice... but it's not that bad. I'm just not going that fast around the track. When I do try to increase my speed, I find myself crashing more but again it's not that drastic.

With regards to tires, I'm running what all the guys run... nothing different. My setup is very similar to all the others... it's my driving skills that I need to work on. The problem is that I'm just not finding myself wanting to waste much time on the dirt since my heart is really on the carpet!

What I'm trying to get to from you guys is whether you think I'm better off practicing on the dirt till I become better of if driving on the dirt and become a VERY GOOD dirt driver may not really help me with the carpet. Is the practice time on the dirt really relavant to the carpet or not?
t4tx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 09:47 AM   #5
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 244
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

In my opinion, and my opinion only. I feel that on-road has made me a better off-road racer. Learning how to apex a turn is an art in itself. That relates to both onroad and offroad. And honestly just because the fast guys use a certain setup doesn't mean it's good for your feel. I would say to ask one of the fast guys to check out thier car. Most will obligize and help you out. Take it for a few laps and see what they're setup feels like compared to your truck and make adjustments there.

Honestly.....Like said above. Get you a World GT car with 4cell and try that out. That's a real fun class to run and "learn" from.

Hope I helped out. let me know if you need any other help.
SwampDog32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 09:51 AM   #6
Tech Elite
 
sosidge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bristol, UK
Posts: 3,865
Default

If you're fighting the track in off-road... try on-road.
sosidge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 09:58 AM   #7
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 55
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SwampDog32 View Post
In my opinion, and my opinion only. I feel that on-road has made me a better off-road racer. Learning how to apex a turn is an art in itself. That relates to both onroad and offroad. And honestly just because the fast guys use a certain setup doesn't mean it's good for your feel. I would say to ask one of the fast guys to check out thier car. Most will obligize and help you out. Take it for a few laps and see what they're setup feels like compared to your truck and make adjustments there.

Honestly.....Like said above. Get you a World GT car with 4cell and try that out. That's a real fun class to run and "learn" from.

Hope I helped out. let me know if you need any other help.
Which one would be a WGT car? At my local track, the "rookie" class is 1/10th scale sedan with rubber tires & 13.5 BL. Most of the guys run the XRay or the TC5. There used to be a Vintage T/A 17.5 class but not enough guys were competing so they scrapped it.
t4tx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 10:02 AM   #8
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 244
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

WGT is a 10th scale pan car. There are multiple manufatures that have them. I would recommend the BMI racing 10th scale pan car. Very nice car.
We run 4cell Nimh or 1s Lipo in these cars with Brushless 13.5. I promise you that they are smooth. Or if all else fails go with what most are running in the rookie class and work your way up. But honestly you'd have lots of fun with the WGT. Just my opinion..
SwampDog32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 10:52 AM   #9
Tech Elite
 
niznai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: All over the place
Posts: 2,940
Default

I think the guys at your local shop gave you the right advice when they told you to start in off road. Porbably they know your ability better than us. Apart from understanding how a R/C car behaves you're not going to build too much skill in off road that you can then use on road. But I think it is a first step in building patience and you're going to need large amounts of it in on road.

Some posts above also hinted at some of the experience you might not have yet for on-road racing which is going to play seriously against you. I think this is based mainly on what you say yourself (when you admit that as soon as you start chasing time (i.e. try to go faster), you crash more). This suggests you don't have the experience to master speed. This is one of the fundamental mistakes of the begginer. In on road you find speed by being smooth. As soon as you get there you will see you laptime going down consistently. That's how you find speed, not by flooring it.

My advice if you decide in the end to still go to on road right now get the slowest motor you can (even a silvercan if you want) and race with that (in the lowest class), regardless of what everybody else is running. Remember you are racing against yourself, not anyone else. That frees the mind of the counterproductive temptation of chasing the fast guy which is going to land you in everbody's way and into the wall more than anything.

When you get fast enough, you'll know it, and then it's time to move up to a faster motor and start over. There really is no shortcut. If you just go out and buy the fastest stuff you'll end up being a pain the side for everybody else on the track because your car will not be under control and they'll have a hard time with you on the track (and on-road cars can be seriously damaged in a crash, so you'll get a lot of annoyed looks).

Good luck and enjoy it, because it is all worth it.
__________________
Team Greasy Weasel

The best upgrade to any car is some driver skill.
niznai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 11:07 AM   #10
Super Moderator
 
Cpt.America's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Washington State
Posts: 11,081
Trader Rating: 52 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SwampDog32 View Post
WGT is a 10th scale pan car. There are multiple manufatures that have them. I would recommend the BMI racing 10th scale pan car. Very nice car.
We run 4cell Nimh or 1s Lipo in these cars with Brushless 13.5. I promise you that they are smooth. Or if all else fails go with what most are running in the rookie class and work your way up. But honestly you'd have lots of fun with the WGT. Just my opinion..
Don't give him bad advice. If you DO start in on-road there, buy a car that is actually racing. This advice only works if there IS a WGT class where you run and it is something you want to get into. If all the guys at your track only run Sedans, then a WGT car would be wasted money.
__________________
A big thanks to my sponsors:
- Fantom Racing - www.fantomracing.com -
- Fusion Graphix- www.fusiongraphix.com -
- RCSpecialties -
Cpt.America is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 11:45 AM   #11
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 244
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

sorry to mislead........... IF there is a WGT class that's what I'd recommend because of the ease of driving and tuning. Not giving bad advice....Just trying to help. There's a difference.
SwampDog32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 01:01 PM   #12
Tech Addict
 
Onetrade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 671
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

How long or how many times have you taken the buggy around your track? I started with off-road and on the first time around the track I couldn't even take a jump. I spent the entire time upside down, running back and forth, unflipping myself then going back to the stand going back upside down, running back to flip my car back and I WENT CRAZY!

Came to the forums, got some advice, my slipper was probably causing the lack of power, tightened up the slipper then i sent my car flying over jumps, way over! like, flying into the wall! Couldn't turn properly and off jumps my car would lean forward landing front wheels first always or even flipping over completely.

Then i was taught about drag brake and setting it to zero is the best thing since sliced bread lol. Tires change the way you drive on the track and had to change those.

Then came home took apart the car and greased up the diffs cuz they were squeeky. Still had trouble going around the track. But started doing a little better. Broke a few parts, even broke an outdrive.

Then someone told me my diffs were too loose, tightened those up.

Each time i went to the track i learned something new and drove a little better. each and everytime. I was even able to get around the track 3 times without crashing or flipping.

After changing tires, adjusting the diffs, slipper, changing my spur, fixing my gear and pinion meshing together, changing an outdrive, a few arms my car is still not dialed, I am not a good driver but I am getting better. I still find myself slamming my radio on the driver stand when i flip upside down lol.

Go to the track, see if they rent on-road so you can try it out and make a friend and tell them your situation and maybe they will let you test drive their on road.. Good luck and remember that its all about practice practice practice and in on road you will still be crashing, you may not come crashing down on a jump flipping onto your back but you will definitely find yourself going 40/50mph turning straight into the wall breaking off arms, bumpers, your body, everything...
__________________
-Just Drive It
Onetrade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 02:19 PM   #13
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 55
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Onetrade View Post
you will definitely find yourself going 40/50mph turning straight into the wall breaking off arms, bumpers, your body, everything...
Wow, now I have something to look forward to!

No seriously, thanks for all the feedback and great advice.

I have been consistently getting better as I have had some down time from work and have been going to the track almost daily for 3 to 5 hours. When I first started I could not even take a jump, did not know about using throttle/brake to adjust the car or using the steering to adjust the car in the jump left to right. Now, I know how to take every jump on the track. I am better able to control the car and I can get 5 to 8 laps or sometimes run the whole battery without flipping over at all. I'm really just chasing time now but I feel that I've learned enough about R/C to start doing what I really want... which is on-road. I am not by any means fit to compete in the stock class for off-road so that's what I'm here to find out...

Should I stick with off-road and get really good (which I'm making very good progress with) or should I make the transition now since off-road skills may not really translate to on-road skills.

As for going fast, I'm not one of those guys that wants to goose the throttle every time... in fact, I think I tend to drive like a grandma sometimes for the sake of being smooth and not crashing. I would take the same approach with on-road... just stay in one piece and make it around the track with clean lines.
t4tx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 02:58 PM   #14
Tech Regular
 
xevias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Shanghai, PRC
Posts: 348
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Maybe just another generic opinion...

Off-road really only teaches you throttle control. Speed and torque are the only things you have to worry about to avoid washing out in a corner or making a jump. One basic set up will get you through a summer.

On-road teaches you much more. Not that you don't have this in off-road, but it's much more evident in on-road. Steering and throttle input, corner speed, corner entrance and exit, gearing, traction, chassis set up, differentials...

I believe that if you learn to drive quick and set up your car for different conditions on-road it will transfer over to off-road. But learning to run off-road first does very little to help you with on-road. You might even have to start your learning proces over.

Basically, if you want to run on the carpet, do it. If they have a Trans Am class, that might be perfect for you.

Have fun.
xevias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 03:02 PM   #15
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Frisco, TX
Posts: 230
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

It sounds like you really want to try on road out. I started with nitro onraod and became frustrated that I couldn't get the car to run without a flame out. I lost interest and jumped into 1/8 nitro buggy. The buggy was easier to tune and easier to drive for me but I still had problems getting the buggy to run well.

I took a few years off from rc and my friend got me back into 1/10 electric onroad. He basically borrowed me his GT3 car for a TCS race - I was just planning on hanging out and watching them race. I had a blast even thought I finished last. Well second to last cuz this one guy broke I've been hooked since.

I think maybe you should at least try on road since it seems that although you are getting better at off road ... your heart is in on road. I think off road seems fun but I never once even thought of buying another off road car to try it out now that I'm back in the hobby since I'm having so much fun in on road.
home13oy75 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tekin RX8 1/8 Scale Brushless ESC Thread sharkman Electric Off-Road 18837 11-05-2017 05:29 AM
Tamiya TG10 Mk.2 JLock Nitro On-Road 117 06-19-2017 02:21 PM
team losi muggy exracer15 Monster Trucks 27 02-21-2007 11:02 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 04:29 AM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net