The reason for the lack of mod drivers...
06-17-2009, 01:33 PM
#106
Tech Initiate
if you tell me that are some specifications can limit the overall performance i agree but not the size.
what kind of motor size do you run?
iīm sure you run 540 size isnīt it, so itīs limited but not the way you like.
06-17-2009, 02:10 PM
#110
Tech Initiate
I want to undersatand you guys but itīs difficult for me
What i listen is that most of the pilots donīt want mod because is too fast, bla,bla,bla
but when you have to choose stocks, most of you guys like 10,5; 13,5 why?
because are the fastest?
So why not 21,5? itīs more like the argument you use to be against mod.
let mod be as it is and if you donīt like it at all, continue doing stocks (but the fastests ones)
What i listen is that most of the pilots donīt want mod because is too fast, bla,bla,bla
but when you have to choose stocks, most of you guys like 10,5; 13,5 why?
because are the fastest?
So why not 21,5? itīs more like the argument you use to be against mod.
let mod be as it is and if you donīt like it at all, continue doing stocks (but the fastests ones)
06-17-2009, 03:22 PM
#111
this exercise will help you with that...
4) put it on a 40'x90' indoor track, and try to appear as though you've raced an r/c car before. then come back and post your findings.if you found this exercise easy to accomplish, one of the two following things are likely:
(when i tried it, i had more than one person suggest that my radio may be broken.)
(from that day forward, i look straight down at my radio each time i make a driving error. if it's a really bad error, i may even hit a few buttons or toggle something that makes noise
).
1) get a sedan
2) strap in a 3.5
3) power it with a 7.4v lipo
now, this is the tricky part:2) strap in a 3.5
3) power it with a 7.4v lipo
4) put it on a 40'x90' indoor track, and try to appear as though you've raced an r/c car before. then come back and post your findings.
a) you fit squarely in the majority of racers who think they are doing things much better than reality would suggest.
b) we will be seeing your name in headlines shortly.
b) we will be seeing your name in headlines shortly.
(when i tried it, i had more than one person suggest that my radio may be broken.
) (from that day forward, i look straight down at my radio each time i make a driving error. if it's a really bad error, i may even hit a few buttons or toggle something that makes noise
).
06-17-2009, 03:34 PM
#114
I can't trust you, so I had to google joe klebau to make sure it wasn't a she-male stripper or worse 
. Here's all I could find . . .
http://www.clevelandcarpetracing.com...%20Stock-3.pdf
I'm not as nervous now, haha.
. Here's all I could find . . .http://www.clevelandcarpetracing.com...%20Stock-3.pdf
I'm not as nervous now, haha.
06-17-2009, 03:35 PM
#116
I've seen a former Schumacher driver do this repeatedly at each round of the Northeast Grand Slam. And it wasn't seaball.
06-17-2009, 04:25 PM
#117
Tech Adept
a very interesting topic, i think mod would increase if we didn't have 2 stock classes (21.5/13.5 or 17.5/10.5 depending where you live). Both classes are so close why even have both? This might bring larger numbers to mod, becuase for many good drivers a 17.5 or 21.5 motor is too slow to be challenging.
My opinion on the mod motors is move to rubber tires as the limiting factor, imposing a control tire at big events. Tires are easy to control and monitor, leave the mod motor, speedy etc open. Driving skill also includes having to control a big power motor on a small tire. The fast guys in mod already know when to run a 5.5t vs. a 4.0t motor, the new guys will learn laptimes are not just about raw power. Especially if you only have 3 sets of tires to manage over 10 races.
My opinion on the mod motors is move to rubber tires as the limiting factor, imposing a control tire at big events. Tires are easy to control and monitor, leave the mod motor, speedy etc open. Driving skill also includes having to control a big power motor on a small tire. The fast guys in mod already know when to run a 5.5t vs. a 4.0t motor, the new guys will learn laptimes are not just about raw power. Especially if you only have 3 sets of tires to manage over 10 races.
06-17-2009, 05:26 PM
#118
If rubber tires were the answer to having everyone run mod why are there only 13 entries in mod rubber at the IIC this year so far. I know some have not signed up yet, but if rubber mod was the answer why don't we have as many drivers in that class as one of the European Rubber races in mod? Why are the 13.5 rubber guys also not signing up for mod rubber if it is better or more controllable than mod foam?
Granted there are only 3 for mod foam mainly because the drivers that normally race mod foam choose to run rubber, wgt, 1/12 mod, or 13.5 foam. If you take those drivers, add then to mod foam instead of one of their other classes to make 3 classes but still stay in mod rubber you end up with 10-13 mod foam drivers and 13 mod rubber drivers. Isn't the goal here to get more people racing mod? People are complaining, ah I dont want to run mod foam, at the carpet nats there were only 12 guys running it. Well when it is all said and done there might be 15-20 rubber guys at an international race. So if you are racing 12 or 20 guys to me that still su$ks for attendance and racing.
I am still sticking with, you need to have Stock and mod, move the drivers up on my list and you get 2 really competitive classes instead of 3 mediocre ones.
Are the mod cars too fast for the average guy, yea they are but they should be running stock. Can we slow down the mod cars and make it a little easier and possibly more fun, sure. I still get hung up on the fact that the best drivers should be racing the fastest car and all of the guys on my list can do it.
Here's something you can research. I looked at the 2005 IIC results, if you want to know why no one is racing mod, ask these guys why they don't race mod tc or r/c anymore. Maybe they have the answer that we can work on fixing.
Jake Pritchard
Jon Orr
Andrew Grey
Barry baker
Josh Neman
Todd Hodge
Chad Kremer
Al Bella
Mark Adams
Ron Matteucci
Chris Tosolini
Mike Dumas
Matt Francis
Ron Rosetti
Matt Lee
Gil Losi Jr.
Mike McMahon
Andrew Cartwright
Ryan Cavalieri
Paul Wynn
Greg Hoddap
Granted there are only 3 for mod foam mainly because the drivers that normally race mod foam choose to run rubber, wgt, 1/12 mod, or 13.5 foam. If you take those drivers, add then to mod foam instead of one of their other classes to make 3 classes but still stay in mod rubber you end up with 10-13 mod foam drivers and 13 mod rubber drivers. Isn't the goal here to get more people racing mod? People are complaining, ah I dont want to run mod foam, at the carpet nats there were only 12 guys running it. Well when it is all said and done there might be 15-20 rubber guys at an international race. So if you are racing 12 or 20 guys to me that still su$ks for attendance and racing.
I am still sticking with, you need to have Stock and mod, move the drivers up on my list and you get 2 really competitive classes instead of 3 mediocre ones.
Are the mod cars too fast for the average guy, yea they are but they should be running stock. Can we slow down the mod cars and make it a little easier and possibly more fun, sure. I still get hung up on the fact that the best drivers should be racing the fastest car and all of the guys on my list can do it.
Here's something you can research. I looked at the 2005 IIC results, if you want to know why no one is racing mod, ask these guys why they don't race mod tc or r/c anymore. Maybe they have the answer that we can work on fixing.
Jake Pritchard
Jon Orr
Andrew Grey
Barry baker
Josh Neman
Todd Hodge
Chad Kremer
Al Bella
Mark Adams
Ron Matteucci
Chris Tosolini
Mike Dumas
Matt Francis
Ron Rosetti
Matt Lee
Gil Losi Jr.
Mike McMahon
Andrew Cartwright
Ryan Cavalieri
Paul Wynn
Greg Hoddap
06-17-2009, 06:35 PM
#119
Tech Adept
If rubber tires were the answer to having everyone run mod why are there only 13 entries in mod rubber at the IIC this year so far. I know some have not signed up yet, but if rubber mod was the answer why don't we have as many drivers in that class as one of the European Rubber races in mod? Why are the 13.5 rubber guys also not signing up for mod rubber if it is better or more controllable than mod foam?
Granted there are only 3 for mod foam mainly because the drivers that normally race mod foam choose to run rubber, wgt, 1/12 mod, or 13.5 foam. If you take those drivers, add then to mod foam instead of one of their other classes to make 3 classes but still stay in mod rubber you end up with 10-13 mod foam drivers and 13 mod rubber drivers. Isn't the goal here to get more people racing mod? People are complaining, ah I dont want to run mod foam, at the carpet nats there were only 12 guys running it. Well when it is all said and done there might be 15-20 rubber guys at an international race. So if you are racing 12 or 20 guys to me that still su$ks for attendance and racing.
I am still sticking with, you need to have Stock and mod, move the drivers up on my list and you get 2 really competitive classes instead of 3 mediocre ones.
Are the mod cars too fast for the average guy, yea they are but they should be running stock. Can we slow down the mod cars and make it a little easier and possibly more fun, sure. I still get hung up on the fact that the best drivers should be racing the fastest car and all of the guys on my list can do it.
Here's something you can research. I looked at the 2005 IIC results, if you want to know why no one is racing mod, ask these guys why they don't race mod tc or r/c anymore. Maybe they have the answer that we can work on fixing.
Jake Pritchard
Jon Orr
Andrew Grey
Barry baker
Josh Neman
Todd Hodge
Chad Kremer
Al Bella
Mark Adams
Ron Matteucci
Chris Tosolini
Mike Dumas
Matt Francis
Ron Rosetti
Matt Lee
Gil Losi Jr.
Mike McMahon
Andrew Cartwright
Ryan Cavalieri
Paul Wynn
Greg Hoddap
Granted there are only 3 for mod foam mainly because the drivers that normally race mod foam choose to run rubber, wgt, 1/12 mod, or 13.5 foam. If you take those drivers, add then to mod foam instead of one of their other classes to make 3 classes but still stay in mod rubber you end up with 10-13 mod foam drivers and 13 mod rubber drivers. Isn't the goal here to get more people racing mod? People are complaining, ah I dont want to run mod foam, at the carpet nats there were only 12 guys running it. Well when it is all said and done there might be 15-20 rubber guys at an international race. So if you are racing 12 or 20 guys to me that still su$ks for attendance and racing.
I am still sticking with, you need to have Stock and mod, move the drivers up on my list and you get 2 really competitive classes instead of 3 mediocre ones.
Are the mod cars too fast for the average guy, yea they are but they should be running stock. Can we slow down the mod cars and make it a little easier and possibly more fun, sure. I still get hung up on the fact that the best drivers should be racing the fastest car and all of the guys on my list can do it.
Here's something you can research. I looked at the 2005 IIC results, if you want to know why no one is racing mod, ask these guys why they don't race mod tc or r/c anymore. Maybe they have the answer that we can work on fixing.
Jake Pritchard
Jon Orr
Andrew Grey
Barry baker
Josh Neman
Todd Hodge
Chad Kremer
Al Bella
Mark Adams
Ron Matteucci
Chris Tosolini
Mike Dumas
Matt Francis
Ron Rosetti
Matt Lee
Gil Losi Jr.
Mike McMahon
Andrew Cartwright
Ryan Cavalieri
Paul Wynn
Greg Hoddap
Stock and Mod is what got us through the 1980's, 1990's and early 2000's with no real complaints or issues. I still think rc will eventually go back to Stock and Mod class model as chicky is wanting. Stock needs to be a 13.5 and Mod unlimited. And as Josh has suggested, limit the LiPO milliamps so Mod drivers can't just rip on the throttle the full 5 or 8 minutes making setup, driving and strategy very important (not that it isn't already in Mod)to keep from dumping. And then keep WGT as the spec class. So there is Stock, Mod and WGT. Now we know 1:12 and WGT run foam. Running foam or rubber in Touring really never became an issue in the U.S. until a handful of years ago. Before the rule was rubber on asphalt and foam on carpet which is something that rc racing in the U.S. needs to get back to to keep from diluting the classes by offering a rubber and a foam class. Just stick with rubber on asphalt and foam on carpet. Just my $.02.
06-17-2009, 06:48 PM
#120
The first thing that should be solved is making mod the same around the world. 5 cell is nice, but it's based on NiMH, which is clearly on its way out.
So, at the risk of offending the open mod purists... what about a World Spec Modified class? Something that's (hopefully) adopted around the world as the new mod, keeps the door open for NiMH or LiPo, and slows things down enough so they're still within reach of today's racer. Someone mentioned 10.5 max, which seems as good as anything, 'cause it's still rather fast, and is already easily available as a spec wind.
This seems to make sense on short tracks, which is where a lot of racing is done around the world. Obviously on bigger tracks, something like open mod might make more sense.
So, at the risk of offending the open mod purists... what about a World Spec Modified class? Something that's (hopefully) adopted around the world as the new mod, keeps the door open for NiMH or LiPo, and slows things down enough so they're still within reach of today's racer. Someone mentioned 10.5 max, which seems as good as anything, 'cause it's still rather fast, and is already easily available as a spec wind.
This seems to make sense on short tracks, which is where a lot of racing is done around the world. Obviously on bigger tracks, something like open mod might make more sense.