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Old 05-14-2009, 09:55 AM   #16
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Good thread for once.
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Old 05-14-2009, 11:31 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Dragonfire View Post
+1

Should provide better balance

I would think a 19t should be quicker than a 13.5 but the 19t will require more work to make it fast. You will have to test back to back to work that out for your self but I would suggest that a 13.5 will make a really good practice motor at the very least. On a tight track like the one in the pic I think the torque of the 13.5 might be quicker in the tight stuff.

BTW: I hardly ever race on carpet but when I do I go for a oneway. There is no comparison to anything else on carpet.
I don't think a one way would be good for this track, I think it is to tight. I could be wrong though, I always used them on sweepeing tracks. What would putting a one way up front do?


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Originally Posted by MikeXray View Post
I would try running no sway bars, and running 35-40wt in your rear shocks.
Why drop the rear oil down so much? To increase the rear traction to compensate for the sway bar being removed up front? It might give me to much if I have the rear sway bar off and go lighter. Or should I lighten it up all the way around?

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Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
When you accelerate, and your car squats (leans to the rear) you are losing traction up front... which is why you are pushing, on throttle. "anti-squat" will help your car by restricting how much weight is shifted to the rear, when you hit the gas, therfore increasing steering when you are on the throttle. Anti-squat increases front traction on throttle.

Did you check out the link I provided you up above? It's got everything you will want to know.

Here... ill copy and paste it for you:

"Anti-Squat

More anti-squat generally makes the rear of the car more sensitive to throttle input. The car has more steering while braking, and also a little more powering out of corners. On high-traction tracks, it may feel as if the car momentarily has more rear traction accellerating out of corners. off-power. A lot of anti-squat (4 or more) can make the car spin out in turns, and make the rear end break loose when accellerating. "


It also might help you a bit to losen up yoru front. Try a slightly softer spring combined with slightly lighter oil. This will add a bit of roll to your front end, helping your outside front tire bite more going around the corner. You could also try running only a rear anti-sway bar... which will also help shift traction to the front end. (be advised, that the springs/oil/ARB will also shift traction to the front end everywhere else on the track too).
Yea, I have the link and I like alot of it, I just have to print it the next time im in class. I have the Hudy Guide printed and that is why I didn't think of it. According to Hudy More Anti-Squat will do the following

- Less weight Transfer to the rear of the chassis on-throttle
- Chassis compresses or drops less on-throttle
- Decreased steering responce
- Increased rear traction
- Better on a smooth track

Kind of threw me off because it says less weight transfer to the back and chassis drops less on-throttle. That made me think it would free it up some, but then it said increased rear traction. So I was all confused on it lol.

What would raising my roll center in the rear do? It would let me transfer left to right quicker wouldnt it?

I have an 18lb front spring on there now and the next one down is a 16lb, I could do 16lb with like 50 up front.

I can also lower my diffs which would give me alot more traction to play with, but I don't think I need that. If I run my front diff lower than the rear I think I would have way to much oversteer.

Edit: What size shims should I add to up the Anit-Squat, is there a mm to Degree conversion or something :/

Last edited by JoshM20; 05-14-2009 at 11:42 AM.
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Old 05-14-2009, 11:57 AM   #18
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Why drop the rear oil down so much? To increase the rear traction to compensate for the sway bar being removed up front? It might give me to much if I have the rear sway bar off and go lighter. Or should I lighten it up all the way around?

--

To increase roll, not all changes affect only one aspect of the car, I don't think I've ever run my car with the same oil front and rear, you want the chassis to roll, especially if you're lacking grip, just how much is going to take trial and error though.
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Old 05-14-2009, 06:30 PM   #19
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Dubious explanation there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
When you accelerate, and your car squats (leans to the rear) you are losing traction up front... which is why you are pushing, on throttle. "anti-squat" will help your car by restricting how much weight is shifted to the rear, when you hit the gas, therfore increasing steering when you are on the throttle. Anti-squat increases front traction on throttle.
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Old 05-14-2009, 07:11 PM   #20
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For the setup you have posted for the Mi2ec. And you are looking for mid and exit steering. I would try 1st: Put black sway bar on the rear and drop rear camber link on the tower to lower hole. At the same time while your at it I would move the ball stud out to the outer hole on the rear hub. After that and still need more raise the rear roll center .5mm.
Hope this helps.

If you add any kickup or anit-squat to the Mi2ec. I wouldn't do anymore than .5mm. It puts the screws on an angle in the chassis. With impacts, it will pull the screws up through the chassis in time. I had it happen twice. One time was a realy hard impact.
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Old 05-14-2009, 09:24 PM   #21
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Dubious explanation there.
am i wrong?
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Old 05-14-2009, 09:38 PM   #22
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I just think that the fundamental mechanism of tuning that many people in the R/C community point to - that being that roll and pitch of the chassis changes weight distribution enough to dominate handling and tuning - is rubbish. Someone dare to run the math on the change in weight distribution of a touring car in a corner? Say in a corner with the left side of the chassis at 2mm off the ground, right side at 6mm off the ground, the chassis is maybe 140mm wide, and the CG is maybe 15mm off the ground.

All the textbooks on full-scale car tuning I've read state the the fundamental mechanism of tuning is that tires don't gain traction with added 'weight' on them as fast as they lose traction with less 'weight' on them. So, if front-rear weight distribution is 70-30, the front tires carry 70% of the weight but can only generate maybe twice as much cornering force as the rear tires, so the car will push. In the case of anti-dive, under acceleration the anti-dive stiffens the rear suspension, causing the rear to be stiffer in roll than it is off-power or braking. Being stiffer causes the rear end to take more of the weight imbalance (demanded by lateral/cornering force and CG above track surface), killing net rear end traction and adding to net front end traction, so the car gains extra steering on corner exit.
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Old 05-14-2009, 09:43 PM   #23
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It's not encouragement for the thread started, but I've got to say that IMO only the top few percent of racers really know how to get more speed out of their car. Even guys that can be considered really good club racers have no idea what it takes to fine-tune a setup to be as fast as possible. These guys can generally fix a car setup that sucks, but getting that last 5 tenths out of the car's setup just doesn't happen.
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