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Old 04-21-2009, 11:51 AM   #1
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Default HELP - I need more traction!

Factory Team TC4 + Mamba Max 5700K + 3s 5400mAh Lipo

Specs:
  • Tires = Sorax 28R
  • Rear Toe = Had a -2.5 X mount. But I ordered the -3.0 to give me more toe in the rear, which should help with traction.
  • Camber = Relativly stock
  • Suspention = The pre-load use to be pretty stiff so the car didnt get to low (worried about banging up the chassis). But i soften up the pre-load some to see if that helps.
  • Droop = Set to full travel so the car isnt so low.
  • Gearing = Is set for top end. So its less punchy then recommended specs

Any recommendations?

Am i going to have to just learn to ease it in to top speed?
I have a bad habbit of just full throttling it.

The car is mostly a parking lot basher, usually up against brushless RC18's (that haul ass).

If i gear it down, its going to be even more punchy and still have traction issues.. hmmm
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Old 04-21-2009, 12:06 PM   #2
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Not enough information to help. What KIND of traction issues? Front end? Rear end? Going down the straight? Entering a corner off throttle? Mid corner? Corner exit on throttle?
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Old 04-21-2009, 12:12 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomTomTuning View Post
Factory Team TC4 + Mamba Max 5700K + 3s 5400mAh Lipo

Specs:
  • Tires = Sorax 28R
  • Rear Toe = Had a -2.5 X mount. But I ordered the -3.0 to give me more toe in the rear, which should help with traction.
  • Camber = Relativly stock
  • Suspention = The pre-load use to be pretty stiff so the car didnt get to low (worried about banging up the chassis). But i soften up the pre-load some to see if that helps.
  • Droop = Set to full travel so the car isnt so low.
  • Gearing = Is set for top end. So its less punchy then recommended specs

Any recommendations?

Am i going to have to just learn to ease it in to top speed?
I have a bad habbit of just full throttling it.

The car is mostly a parking lot basher, usually up against brushless RC18's (that haul ass).

If i gear it down, its going to be even more punchy and still have traction issues.. hmmm
I assume you're just doing speed runs....

If that's the case and you need more rear traction; soften the rear springs and stiffen the front, that'll make sure the weight transfers to the rear on throttle. Also, make sure you're using traction compound on the tires.

It also sounds like your ride height is really high, this will definitely reduce your overall traction, especially if you have no droop because you have the arms pegged down with the preload. I'd lower your ride height and make sure you have some droop on both ends, like 1.5mm or so.
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Old 04-21-2009, 01:19 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
Not enough information to help. What KIND of traction issues? Front end? Rear end? Going down the straight? Entering a corner off throttle? Mid corner? Corner exit on throttle?
See below...
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcterp View Post
I assume you're just doing speed runs....

If that's the case and you need more rear traction; soften the rear springs and stiffen the front, that'll make sure the weight transfers to the rear on throttle. Also, make sure you're using traction compound on the tires.

It also sounds like your ride height is really high, this will definitely reduce your overall traction, especially if you have no droop because you have the arms pegged down with the preload. I'd lower your ride height and make sure you have some droop on both ends, like 1.5mm or so.
Yea, mostly speed runs. But i do take it to the track (oval occasionally)

Besides the smell, are there any draw backs from using tire compound?
I notice the one set of tires i used it before (friends compound) the tire seems ultra soft now? Not sure

I will stiffen the front pre-load and soften the rear..
Or should i change the springs completely?

Yea my droop is completely down, I'll try shortening the droop.

Thanks alot for the feed back!
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Old 04-21-2009, 01:31 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by TomTomTuning View Post
See below...

Yea, mostly speed runs. But i do take it to the track (oval occasionally)

Besides the smell, are there any draw backs from using tire compound?
I notice the one set of tires i used it before (friends compound) the tire seems ultra soft now? Not sure

I will stiffen the front pre-load and soften the rear..
Or should i change the springs completely?

Yea my droop is completely down, I'll try shortening the droop.

Thanks alot for the feed back!
For now you can try softening the preload and moving the top of the rear shocks in a couple holes. That will allow the weight to transfer. If that doesn't do much try a spring change.

Compound will soften the tires which will ultimately reduce the life a little, but for parking lots tires get chewed up pretty fast anyway.

Remember, there's only so much traction to be found on a parking lot that isn't prepped.
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Old 04-21-2009, 01:40 PM   #6
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A 5700kv with a 3s lipo is a LOT of power and it will be tough to get it all to the ground. This is especially true on an unprepared surface where grip is usually low and inconsistent. The 3 degree rear toe blocks will help keep the car straighter when on power but will reduce side bite slightly and make the car drift a little more through the middle of a corner.
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Old 04-21-2009, 03:29 PM   #7
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The ride height and droop sounds like an issue. I would put you ride height between 5 and 6 mm depending on the surface etc. I run about 1.5 mm of droop. Camber is also your friend when it comes to traction. I would start with 1.5 degrees and work from there. More camber= more traction UNTIL you have too much of camber. Try that and like others have reccomended use traction compund it is the very best friend in rc traction problems you have. Paragon, Corally SXT, Sweep Acute Asphalt are all good compounds for asphalt. There are no drawbacks from using it. Hope this helps
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Last edited by #88driver; 04-21-2009 at 09:01 PM.
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Old 04-21-2009, 04:35 PM   #8
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Fantastic, just the info i needed.

Cant wait to try all this out. I'll pick up my own compound tomorrow.

Updates to come!
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Old 04-21-2009, 04:53 PM   #9
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Don't expect traction compound do anything for you. Typically they help when racing... lateral traction (not straight speed runs) on your first lap or two before your tires heat up. You need to to work on your ride height and basic suspension setup.
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Old 04-23-2009, 10:01 PM   #10
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Tips definitely seem to help!!

The car hauls... The diff came loss but right before it did, it was clocked at 55mph in a small parking lot. (radar).

Tighten up the Diff, Find a longer stretch... and i think it will hit 65 ish.
Which isnt bad at all.

I had thread lock on the diff bolt.. And recommendation on how to keep that thing from coming loss? Would it be a bad idea to put a solid diff in the rear? (the front is currently solid)

Also.. Do they make a slipper for TC4? I couldn't seem to find any)
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Old 04-23-2009, 11:02 PM   #11
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since your doing speed runs, do you have an aerodynamic body? I don't do speed runs personally, but once my wing fell off when my car tumbled a few times, and I went around the track like normal. Then when I got to the top of the strait I lost all control of my car and broke an arm. I tried again just to make sure it was the wing, it was.

I don't think my 17.5 gets anywhere near your speeds, but I'd bet one of those nice wedge bodies could get you more top end traction and maybe more MPH.

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Old 04-24-2009, 06:29 AM   #12
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Yup.. you can def do a more streamlined body. Grab some dish wheels if you don't already have em and also you could try to leave a bit more body over the rear wheel and that will cut down on drag if you have a wide enough body to handle the weight transfer if you turn much. I did some wind tunnel testing last year and learned a ton. Definitely make sure to keep an eye on your wing and it sounds like your suspension is heading in the right direction. I do have one question though, why a locked front? I almost locked my rear for straight line traction but left my front unlocked on my weapon to ease with the transition and help with the radius while turning.
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Old 04-24-2009, 08:39 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomTomTuning View Post

Also.. Do they make a slipper for TC4? I couldn't seem to find any)
What is a slipper?

Like jhwnissan said try the spool on the rear and put the diff on the front.

Where you running is it smooth? if it is your ride height should be as low as possible.
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Old 04-24-2009, 09:19 AM   #14
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Body: I have the Protoform DNA2 which is supposedly wind tunnel designed and specifically for racing.

I had Dish wheels but the tires got pretty roasted from me learning to drive the car with the amount of power it has. I plan on getting another set of Dish wheels and Sorax tires again.

It was a fresh (new) parking lot, so it was smooth and pretty clean.

I did the Solid front because i also do some carpet track racing every now and then. And that seems to work great to get out of the corner faster.

So the solid diff in the front helps for carpet, but would work best for speed runs in the rear?

Can some one better explain, where the solid diff would help and for what. Vs where the regular steel diff works and for what? (speed run vs carpet track)
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Old 04-24-2009, 09:46 AM   #15
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If someone could correct me if I'm wrong but I think you will eat up the front tires with a solid front and on carpet especially you may have quite a push as well. The rear weight transfer is more important therefore the rear being almost locked makes sense to help push the car around the corners. It's the same for straight line stability except you need a bit more balance to keep it in a straight line for maximum power without having to correct constantly. Does that make sense or am I off? Someone do correct me if I'm off or not quite there with my explanation.
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