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Old 11-04-2003, 09:57 AM   #61
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Default Re: charlie's post

Quote:
Originally posted by howard hudson
just wondering if any of you brushless guys even read charlies post ( He works at novak ya know ). tell ya what Ill just put some of it up


"Soon BUT NOT YET there will be a an SS4300 motor. It is lower performance than the SS5800 even in the unlimited profile. this is just the motor to be used with the Super Sport Brushless ESC.

The Super Sport and the SS5800 are faster than a stock motor in any profile. By a lot. We just missed our test points is all. We could try to change the software but that would be "Service Nightmare" so we arent' planning on any changes to the ESC. The limited mode is still a bit too fast for stock class because folks gear them to the moon for top speed. It takes a little punch feel away, but it is still on par with a decent 19 turn motor."

so there it is right from the source. nuff said

on par with a decent 19t imagin that

Charlie is correct the Super Sport esc and the SS5800 are about on par with a 19t motor.

What may have gone over looked above is that the new 4300 version in ANY mode on the Super Sport esc performs like a tuned 27t stocker. From Dyno results of several differnet brand stock motors and tuners.

Just wanted to clarify this distinct difference.
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Old 11-04-2003, 09:58 AM   #62
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I have a few hypothetical questions for all you guys.

Lets imagine that you are at a "National Race" of some sorts... lots of racers and lots of pros and lots of bowling trophy's to be had. Now lets imagine that you have every piece of equipment in the world... but you can only race one class.

1) Given that there was equal racers/pros in the brushless class and the brushed class, which would you want to be in and why?

2) How about where there was 80% of the drivers/pros running in brushless and 20% were running in brushed. Then which would you run and why?

3) Number 2 reversed. 20% racers/pros in brushless and 80% in brushed. Which would you run and why?
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:02 AM   #63
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That is besides the point. The discussion is weather or not to run Brush and Brushless in the same race.... thats it.
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:06 AM   #64
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1) Given that there was equal racers/pros in the brushless class and the brushed class, which would you want to be in and why?

Brushless, so I didn't have to spend any time maintaining my motor.

2) How about where there was 80% of the drivers/pros running in brushless and 20% were running in brushed. Then which would you run and why?

Brushless, so I didn't have to spend any time maintaining my motor.

3) Number 2 reversed. 20% racers/pros in brushless and 80% in brushed. Which would you run and why?

Brushless, so I didn't have to spend any time maintaining my motor.

Wouldn't win anything anyway
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:08 AM   #65
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Nice!
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:08 AM   #66
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Angry off subject

come on guys lets not get into the personel insults. Lets keep focused on the issue at hand mmmmmmmkkkkkkkkk.
now as far as Iam concerned.Until R.O.A.R or N.O.R.C.A deems the BL motor legel to run as a stock motor it should have its own class period. now If a bl wants to run with the stock racers thats fine as long as all the other racers are made aware of it before the heats start. and all are in a agreement. But when it is kept to one or two ppl and not to the rest. To me my friends thats the same as cheating. But if thats OK with all of you then I will start using a 19t in stock. ( not like I would)
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:12 AM   #67
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Quote:
Originally posted by holycow
The discussion is weather or not to run Brush and Brushless in the same race.... thats it.
The answer is simple... if you have enough racers in each group, then you split them up... if not, then dont.

If you have enough racers you can even split them up by people who have blue bodies and those who have red bodies.

Face it... this question only pertains to local club races... "larger" races will have them seperated or have restrictions.
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:13 AM   #68
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Quote:
come on guys lets not get into the personel insults. Lets keep focused on the issue at hand mmmmmmmkkkkkkkkk.
now as far as Iam concerned.Until R.O.A.R or N.O.R.C.A deems the BL motor legel to run as a stock motor it should have its own class period. now If a bl wants to run with the stock racers thats fine as long as all the other racers are made aware of it before the heats start. and all are in a agreement. But when it is kept to one or two ppl and not to the rest. To me my friends thats the same as cheating. But if thats OK with all of you then I will start using a 19t in stock. ( not like I would)
exactly
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:14 AM   #69
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Default Re: Re: charlie's post

Quote:
Originally posted by rocketron
Charlie is correct the Super Sport esc and the SS5800 are about on par with a 19t motor.

What may have gone over looked above is that the new 4300 version in ANY mode on the Super Sport esc performs like a tuned 27t stocker. From Dyno results of several differnet brand stock motors and tuners.

Just wanted to clarify this distinct difference.
true BUT ... as charlie stated it is not out YET
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:17 AM   #70
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Default Re: Re: Re: charlie's post

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Originally posted by howard hudson
true BUT ... as charlie stated it is not out YET
Again your correct but they are and have been being used and tested over the last 3 plus months.
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:20 AM   #71
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: charlie's post

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Originally posted by rocketron
Again your correct but they are and have been being used and tested over the last 3 plus months.
but that does not make it ok for the average joe to go out and buy a bl system and run it in a stock class when there was a BL class to run in at the same event or does it
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:23 AM   #72
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: charlie's post

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Originally posted by howard hudson
but that does not make it ok for the average joe to go out and buy a bl system and run it in a stock class when there was a BL class to run in at the same event or does it
who did that? Or more to the point... who let that happen?
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:40 AM   #73
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: charlie's post

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Originally posted by Cracker78
who did that? Or more to the point... who let that happen?
lets just say it did happen and I am not going to drop any names. I didnt even run stock that day and it pissed me off and it should not have happened
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:40 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally posted by Evoracer

Won't make any difference trf......It seems there are just going to be a few people out there who feel more comfortable knowing they might have an edge over another driver if tweaking a motor is still part of the game.
You just don't seem to get it. Even in FULL size racing, "Tweaking" is part of the game. Looking for that slight advantage over your competition and stay within the RULES. There is no SECRET to tuning a Stock Motor, anyone can do it. What is difficult is finding a Motor that performs better than the average one (and they are out there).

The RULES do NOT allow for BL Motors in Stock class and for very good reason. If you Guys are pushing for BL "Stock" in the same class with the brushed Motors, I'm sure it's not just because there is less maintenance.

add another $2.00 to the pot.
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Old 11-04-2003, 10:47 AM   #75
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: charlie's post

Quote:
Originally posted by howard hudson
but that does not make it ok for the average joe to go out and buy a bl system and run it in a stock class when there was a BL class to run in at the same event or does it
Again your correct BUT the 4300 motor will not be nearly competitive against the 5800 motor. This would be the equivlant of running a 27t against 19t motors.

Progress and/or change is a tough undertaking and the brushless question brings this to light and brightly. It appears this was for many the first time being aware there is anything other than the Super Sport Motor 5800 motor.
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